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I noticed when I lived in the South that many white people had strong aversion to public transit. My theory is that this happened when the Civil Rights Act ended segregation on mass transportation. That meant that white bus riders would no longer be guaranteed that they would not have a "Negro" sit next to them. By that time, wages had risen and cars were cheaper, so they opted in droves to travel by car rather than share a seat with a black person. Kind of like when the schools were desegregated--it's easy to send the kids to private schools or move to all white suburbs to maintain a segregated lifestyle. Northerners never had legal segregation of public facilities, so sharing a bus seat with someone of a different race was nothing to them..
I don't care who needs it, I just want to see it done. I'm only 24, but even if Atlanta, Austin, Orlando, Kansas, the US government whoever announced tomorrow that they're going to build a massive, efficient transit service/loop freeway/tunnel/invigorated Amtrak/regional high speed train, etc, it probably wouldn't be finished until I'm 60.
Years and years are spent on environment and traffic studies, the public gets curious, the studies are done, the public gets excited, leaders do nothing with them, the public moves on, time passes, the public starts demanding traffic fixes again, leaders listen, but the previous studies have expired so now we have to do them all over again. Then you have to wrestle funding, fight off nimby's, acquire right a ways, fight off nimby's, and then construct, it takes forever.
Can't build anything today because cul de sac sprawl is now in the way, land and construction is expensive, and people still think just because they wont ride it, it won't benefit them, and any mention of "taxes" receives a hell no. I'm pessimistic about transit now. Leaders from cities, metros, and states across the country keep saying the same old thing - "we're going to fix this", then the next thing you know it's a year later, two years later, three years later, still no traction. That popular CD thread that was made in the city forum about the upcoming new transit is now on page 42.
Unless it's an airport, seaport, or diverging diamond opportunity, it just doesn't seem to be priority these days. Roads, rail, subways, Amtrak, high speed regional connections, no time for it.
You make a very good point here. That is something that gets joked about a lot in the Atlanta area, is all the numerous studies done and nothing is ever done. It is like we are continuously watching the same loop like you stated. I am around your age and I won't hold my breath to see a MARTA rail expansion in my lifetime outside of maybe the City of Atlanta, DeKalb, and maybe Clayton counties.
Austin needs an interstate overhaul. Atlanta needs to expand pt options.
Atlanta also needs an outer loop for the insane amount of 18 wheeler traffic that comes through the metro area and adds to the congestion on I-285, as most trucks are not allowed inside the perimeter unless they have a delivery there. Maybe something tolled or very limited access as to not encourage even more runaway sprawl.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rnc2mbfl
I voted for Orlando. If there was a sensible transit solution connecting all the attractions, you can take drivers (who don't know their way around) off the roads and make life easier for the people who actually live there.
I voted for Orlando. If there was a sensible transit solution connecting all the attractions, you can take drivers (who don't know their way around) off the roads and make life easier for the people who actually live there.
The reality is that once traffic is out of control, it's really too late to fix it because all of the associated development that accompanies the traffic is car oriented. No amount of rail is going to improve the traffic; it can only hope to prevent it from getting worse.
Quote:
Originally Posted by masssachoicetts
Orlando.. 70 million visitors a year? One of the fastest growing metropolitan areas inn the country? City hosting the largest unievrsity in the country?
City Transit? Sunrail which is a joke. There needs to be some sort of public transportation from OIA to places like the Florida Mall area/OBT, I Drive, Universal Area and Disney. Then a few other lines connecting the medical city to UCF and Downtown.
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Originally Posted by masssachoicetts
Are you serious... Lynx is probably one of the most inefficient services ever provided by a city. Not only is lynx confusing, but it is extremely spotty with service. Lynx does not run to Lake Nona at frequencies you would need. Light rail is needed. Going from the airport to downtown Orlando can take about 2 hours, and going to the tourist district on Lynx? It will take the better of 2.5 hours. There is a reason why maglevs, sunrail expansions and light rail are proposed for Orlando metro area. I urge you next time in Orlando to take one of these routes
btw. where is that direct route from OIA to JYP or or Florida Mall or Disney Springs, or Universal ? hmm... how about Medical City to UCF?
Nice try.
As already pointed out...apparently there's a ton of unfamiliarity with Orlando given Atlanta is running away with this poll. At least Atlanta has a somewhat viable existing system that works within much of the framework of the city's infrastructure. Orlando is a steaming dung pile mess of transit planning with a fixed route boondoggle of a rail system that is the square peg in the proverbial round hole when it comes to addressing varying employment centers, attractions and transportation hubs. Nothing viable is on the table and the population is exploding at 3%-5% growth per year. Give it time, Orlando is going to make LA traffic look like child's play...
The primary reason Atlanta is winning this poll is because it has the worst traffic out of the cities on this list and people tend to pinpoint inadequate transit as the main reason behind this, but that would be incorrect. Atlanta gets more flack for MARTA heavy rail (which isn't as extensive as it should be) than cities that have much less--and again, that's because of Atlanta's notorious traffic issues.
I think Texas and Florida (in theory) would be the easiest Southern states to pull transit off if that's the case. They don't really have the Civil Rights baggage that the other Southern states do. Not to mention the high Hispanic and overall immigrant populations, which aid in disrupting the binary segregation model.
You make a very good point here. That is something that gets joked about a lot in the Atlanta area, is all the numerous studies done and nothing is ever done. It is like we are continuously watching the same loop like you stated. I am around your age and I won't hold my breath to see a MARTA rail expansion in my lifetime outside of maybe the City of Atlanta, DeKalb, and maybe Clayton counties.
Yeah Atlanta was part of the inspiration of my post, but it's a general pattern I see everywhere. Look at SC: 25 years later and still can't get 11 miles of 526 finished. Arthur Ravenel had to run for Senator to get the old Charleston bridges replaced because no one else would do it.
They won't (probably) start fixing "Malfunction Junction" in Columbia until the 2020s because they keep dragging their feet with traffic studies. 95 won't be widened probably ever, but even if they announced a widening this afternoon, after all the traffic studies and legal nonsense, it'd probably be ready to start construction in 2038.
Bringing I-73 to Myrtle Beach is probably the most ridiculous: since the early 80s it's been the same pattern. It's proposed, studies are done, then something political happens and it fades away. A decade later it's proposed again, studies are done, then something political happens and it fades away. That cycle is still going on. It's not just SC, it's the same issue in every state. You could say "we want a bullet train from GA to MS", but then of course "AL" will come out and say "no, not on our land", and it's shelved.
I just want to see consistency. I remember reading that an underground tunnel through Atlanta was proposed last year and it was heavily buzzed about for like a month with politicians doing their usual, and now it's faded back into obscurity. After the 85 bridge collapse it seemed everyone - residents and leaders - were finally on the same "okay, this is enough" page, but not even a year later and it seems like it never happened.
Same with Amtrak. We've had what, 3 crashes in a row? Yet in two weeks no one will be thinking about Amtrak again. Airports are on fire, but it seems everything else, even our cherished interstates, have been waved away.
As already pointed out...apparently there's a ton of unfamiliarity with Orlando given Atlanta is running away with this poll. At least Atlanta has a somewhat viable existing system that works within much of the framework of the city's infrastructure. Orlando is a steaming dung pile mess of transit planning with a fixed route boondoggle of a rail system that is the square peg in the proverbial round hole when it comes to addressing varying employment centers, attractions and transportation hubs. Nothing viable is on the table and the population is exploding at 3%-5% growth per year. Give it time, Orlando is going to make LA traffic look like child's play...
Exactly kyle. Orlando regional growth on quickfacts is up 16% from 2010-2016. If I live on the east side, maybe lets say Lee Vista or Waterford Lakes... and I work in Disney or Universal, how do I get to work if I do not want to drive or have a car? Lynx will reroute you through Downtown and will take 4 HOURS. There needs to a simpler, better, more efficient system in Metro Orlando.
Now that Lake Nona hosts Orlando's upcoming medical city, business park, amazon facility, a lagoon resort, USTA, Orlando City, and all the future things going in 32832... there needs to a way to get to Downtown Orlando, Innovation Way or the Tourist District. Interconnecting these areas will not only improve the drastically worsening traffic, but promote industry and commercial developments. Lynx is not only hard to use, but inefficient..and I think someone suggested Disneys Magical Express..... which is an utter joke because residents cannot use/wont use the system. The busiest airport in Florida as of 2017 currently has no light rail service connecting it to hotspot areas... its kind of pathetic. Largest convention city in the US and no rail service to the airport? Hopefully the intermodal facility delivers. Im using Lake Nona as an example because there was 3,000 people living there in 2000, 27,000 in 2010.. and now Lake Nona's website says theres 60,000+ in the area.
Orlando needs better transportation (Lynx is not nearly a fraction of the solution) period. So whoever said they don't obviously has never been to Orlando.
Exactly kyle. Orlando regional growth on quickfacts is up 16% from 2010-2016. If I live on the east side, maybe lets say Lee Vista or Waterford Lakes... and I work in Disney or Universal, how do I get to work if I do not want to drive or have a car? Lynx will reroute you through Downtown and will take 4 HOURS. There needs to a simpler, better, more efficient system in Metro Orlando.
NO U.S. Metro of Orlando's population and expanse has anywhere near this type of expansive rail system. It will never happen.
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Lynx is not only hard to use, but inefficient..and I think someone suggested Disneys Magical Express..... which is an utter joke because residents cannot use/wont use the system.
Now you're moving the goalposts. You mentioned 60 million tourists a year with no PT from the Airport. It was mentioned in that context, but you already knew that.
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The busiest airport in Florida as of 2017 currently has no light rail service connecting it to hotspot areas... its kind of pathetic.
The busiest Airport in Florida in 2017 was MIA, and they have a rail connection to the Airport.
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Largest convention city in the US and no rail service to the airport?
That would be Las Vegas, and the Taxi Diver's Union will never allow it.
Again, you clearly don't know Orlando nearly as well as you think you do.
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