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Excellent analysis, Raddo-- so many goods points brought out in a cogent, poetically concise post.
We can expand on one point: our society is too large to efficiently handle this medical/psychiatric problem on the Federal level-- better done locally. [Would a Federal Law outlawing diabetes help us at all, for example?]
And we can add an additional datum illustrating the negative effects of our Victorian attitude that doesn't deal with root causes: the overwhelming number of cases of heroine OD deaths occur in users who "took the cure," were "clean" for a period of time, then returned to using (because the cause wasn't dealt with) picking up with the dose they ended with-- much too large for the newly intolerant ex-user. A compassionate program of supervised usage and education would prevent this sad, avoidable scenario.
Its hard to get them to admit things were actually much safer back when addicts were getting painkillers from their doctors, before the super extreme crackdown on all opioid drugs, most doctors wont write scripts for them anymore due to being so scared of the DEA coming in and taking their license away, and yet overdose and death rates have skyrocketed since those laws were enacted...why do we still look to DEA and other such agencies to deal with this, when their track record is this terrible?
Everything the DEA and other law enforcement agencies suggest and do to fight drugs, ultimately ends up benefiting the drug cartels, so maybe its time look into the DEA a little more, I think there is probably some collusion and corruption at the higher echelons going on.
I will admit though, it still makes no sense that none of the pharma companies tried to challenge or legally fight the 2012 opioid laws, this makes no sense at all, narcotic drugs were their cash cow back then and we are supposed to believe they were totally for all this to come to a grinding halt due to more govt regulations on their product? Yeah right! what other industry would allow that to happen without a huge legal battle?
There isn't enough money in the entire country to treat all these drug addicts. I saw a show on tv where they tried to rehabilitate ONE drug addict. It was painful to watch, took forever, the person relapsed. Sure, with unlimited resources and not so many addicts, something could be done. However, health insurance funding is being drastically cut and even without those cuts, positive outcomes of rehab seem to be few and far between.
Mostly the drug addicts I've heard about are now dead of overdoses. If the cops revive them with narcon, what good does it do but cost money and take valuable time away from the police who have other things to do. To make drugs legal simply gives the go ahead to use them and normalizes it. It encourages people to try drugs and after a while, instead of productive citizens, we'll have even more hopeless, useless drug addicts. Addicts begging on the streets for handouts, breaking into cars and homes to steal, sleeping on the sidewalk, abandoning their kids, killing their brains, and becoming a big drain on society.
Since we didn't intervene in time and now there are so many of them that we can't even afford intervention, maybe we should look at the reasons people take drugs in the first place. It is not normal. I don't want it to become normal. People should not be encouraged to turn themselves into zombies who are useless to society, who hurt their families who raised them, not to mention their kids, if they have them, and their friends. Legalization is the easy way out. Just look the other way: problem solved.
You seem to be under a couple of misconceptions.
First, legalization does not normalize it. It does not mean free-for-all. It means if you want some free drugs, you have to go to a "treatment center". I put that in quotes because that is the place where most of the questions lie, because we don't yet know exactly how these should work. Regardless, these centers would be there to prevent desperate people from breaking the law in order to get the money to buy a fix. Desperate addicts would no longer have to turn to crime, which is a major part of why legalization should be considered. The addicts would no longer be dying of overdoses, because of the availability of pure product of known strength. In this one paragraph, I have spelled out how these centers, along with legalization, will reduce the harm being caused by our current methods by 90%.
Second, do you want to know what really encourages young people to try illegal drugs? Prohibition! If it's against the law, it is glamorized in the eyes of kids. It means that if they are the type of person that does reckless things to begin with, usually out of showing off in front of peers, illegality makes the act even more attractive to them because it is that much more reckless. If you don't believe that, go ask some kids.
Furthermore, kids now have easy access to these drugs because of street dealers. With legalization, street dealers go away, because a fix is only a treatment center away. There would be no profit in being a street dealer, or a cartel boss, for that matter. Without street dealers, kids would have a much harder time getting their hands on drugs, and the cartels would fade away. Talk about a win-win!
So legalization not only minimizes the harm, it also opens up treatment avenues that are currently unavailable to us.
Why not try? Everyone on this thread seems to agree that the problem is as bad as ever, despite ramping up this 40 year old War. In fact, this most recent spate of overdoses was caused by the DEA stepping in to try to do something about it. In 2012, they threatened doctors with the pulling of their license if they didn't stop prescribing so many opioids. It scared some doctors into cutting millions of patients off cold-turkey, causing the truly addicted patients to turn to street heroin in desperation. 1000's of those patients are no longer with us, because the government felt the need to "intervene". Tragic.
So it seems to me that every time we "tighten down" on the problem we worsen the problem. Let's try a new approach.
In CE I posted a story about how a police dept was indicted due to them searching over 900 HS students for drugs without a warrant and nothing was found. What is the deal with this? Now I know that people will talk about all the ways the harder drugs can mess you up, kill you even, and causes issues which I am not denying it's bad for sure, but I swear, police and politicians seem to view drugs as worse than genocide, worse than the holocaust, worse than anything a fusion of Hitler, Stalin, Pol Pot, Mao Zedong, Vlad the Impaler and the entire Kim Il Sung family could ever hope to come even close to creating as pure evil as DRUGS!!!! Like they straight-up get erections when they think about them.
Yes, I understand being against drugs and wanting to limit people getting them, but good lord most cops/politicians seem to have some very sick, sadistic and unhinged obsession with them. Hence, instead of treatment they choose just to throw them in prison for decades. Or if this were another time and these same people were some all-powerful Kings they'd have you drawn and quartered just for smoking a joint. To me, the cops and politicians that are against drugs are FAR more scary than any of the drugs they say they are against.
IMO, the short answer is: There's money in illegal drugs. At every branch, limb, and stick, there's money in illegal drugs.
There's asset forfeiture when someone gets busted
There's inpounding a car, if the drug bust happened on the road. If the suspect doesn't have the money to get the car out of impoundment, there's another asset.
If a police department can show that there's a drug problem in the community, it justifies new equipment, new cars, new hires, etc.
If a meth bust happens in someone's home, that's employment for inspectors, fees for the city coffers, money going to Home Depot and what not, for building supplies...
And then, Big Pharma doesn't want the average Joe self-medicating...so THEY throw big money around, and lobby our congressmen and Senators to crack down on drug users...
IMO, the short answer is: There's money in illegal drugs. At every branch, limb, and stick, there's money in illegal drugs.
There's asset forfeiture when someone gets busted
There's inpounding a car, if the drug bust happened on the road. If the suspect doesn't have the money to get the car out of impoundment, there's another asset.
If a police department can show that there's a drug problem in the community, it justifies new equipment, new cars, new hires, etc.
If a meth bust happens in someone's home, that's employment for inspectors, fees for the city coffers, money going to Home Depot and what not, for building supplies...
And then, Big Pharma doesn't want the average Joe self-medicating...so THEY throw big money around, and lobby our congressmen and Senators to crack down on drug users...
It's really all about the money.
If that were true, why would big pharma sit back and allow the tough prescription drug laws and regulations Govt enacted back in 2012?
This was a time when opioids were flying off the shelves, doctors were writing scripts left and right for them, addicts would willingly pay more money than these drugs were worth to just get them...once DEA got involved the new laws killed their cash cow...what industry accepts new govt regulations that will kill their most popular products without a legal battle?
The 2012 drug laws did nothing but push all the former pill addicts and their money to the drug cartels and their products. The cartels must have some major deep pockets and influence when they can sway US govt to their benefit.
try illegal drugs? Prohibition! If it's against the law, it is glamorized in the eyes of kids. It means that if they are the type of person that does reckless things to begin with, usually out of showing off in front of peers, illegality makes the act even more attractive to them because it is that much more reckless. If you don't believe that, go ask some kids.
Furthermore, kids now have easy access to these drugs because of street dealers. With legalization, street dealers go away, because a fix is only a treatment center away. There would be no profit in being a street dealer, or a cartel boss, for that matter. Without street dealers, kids would have a much harder time getting their hands on drugs, and the cartels would fade away. Talk about a win-win!
<<<snipped for brevity>>>
You may have a point but every time I've asked why kids try drugs it's because they want to feel better, to get high.
So MY point is, what is wrong with them that they feel so awful? Why do they need to be high to feel good? Most people feel okay the way they are without taking drugs. Get to the root of the cause--it would also involve why so many kids are committing suicide. Just WHAT is wrong with our society that kids are so depressed?
Also, the police in my last town, a tourist town that filled up with druggies in the off season, were fed up with the drugs. The police chief, who was wonderful and actually had to kill someone who was swinging a machete one time but other than that, never shot anyone, said that the narcon made it "like a revolving door." They were treating the same people over and over and over.
AND, I really do not want these kids to go somewhere and buy drugs, take them, and then get behind the wheel of a car. There's enough of a problem with alcoholics doing that. We need to find out WHY they feel that they need drugs to feel normal. Then treat THAT reason.
There is no "War on Drugs" in this country.
When I see drug dealers hanging from a lamp post on Main Street USA, then I believe it.
When I see drug dealers shot dead in the parking lot of the police department, then I believe it.
Right now, we just have lip service.
Most crimes and deadly accidents where we live are caused by drug addicts high on something.
Legalize it and gets worse.
While it isn't my business what you put in your body, but when my life or property is in danger from an addict then it becomes my business.
I have no problem keeping most hard drugs illegal but marijuana is literally one of the least harmful substances in existence to be illegal. It's less harmful than alcohol and virtually impossible to overdose on, doesn't destroy the liver, and would prevent a lot of people from doing silly stuff like huffing or trying marijuana substitutes that are actually harmful. I don't buy that it would be a "gateway" drug. I should be able to grow it in my basement for my own personal use, and even would support an excise tax or tax stamp and pay a bit to the feds for the privilege to do so.
As far as other hard drugs, I would make simple possession of small amounts an infraction with a $500 fine if caught, going up by $500 for each subsequent infraction, and only punish the dealers and people found selling or manufacturing. Throwing people into prison for abusing drugs who don't otherwise commit other crimes is just a waste of time and money. Now if they have already gotten infractions for drug possession and then get arrested for robbery or theft, then you throw a longer jail/prison sentence at them.
If a person can support their own drug habit with their own money and pay the infractions when caught but otherwise are nonviolent, more power to them.
We need to find out WHY they feel that they need drugs to feel normal. Then treat THAT reason.
Yes! That's exactly right. In the long run, stopping the demand is the only real solution.
But that's much easier said than done. Even if the root causes were identified today, actually fixing it could take a generation or more. In the meantime, why not minimize the harm being done?
Our current method of fighting the problem includes maximizing the harm, with the vain hope that turning drug users into criminals (in addition to whatever problems they had which caused them to turn to drugs in the first place) would be enough of a deterrent to keep them away from the drugs. We can trace the fact that that doesn't work all the way back over 100 years to alcohol prohibition. It didn't work. It caused more problems than it solved. Anyone can look back at history to plainly see that. As bad as the alcohol scourge was back then, which was so bad a constitutional amendment was enacted, prohibition only made it worse. Much worse.
Do you really think it is prudent to continue to maximize the harm, maximize the problems, for another generation?
Don't you think it would be better to take steps to minimize the harm while we are searching for the answer to the real problem, which you so eloquently stated: "We need to find out WHY they feel that they need drugs to feel normal. Then treat THAT reason."?
If so, I wish you could broaden your long term, big picture view of the problem wide enough to realize that making more war will not minimize the harm.
try illegal drugs? Prohibition! If it's against the law, it is glamorized in the eyes of kids. It means that if they are the type of person that does reckless things to begin with, usually out of showing off in front of peers, illegality makes the act even more attractive to them because it is that much more reckless. If you don't believe that, go ask some kids.
Furthermore, kids now have easy access to these drugs because of street dealers. With legalization, street dealers go away, because a fix is only a treatment center away. There would be no profit in being a street dealer, or a cartel boss, for that matter. Without street dealers, kids would have a much harder time getting their hands on drugs, and the cartels would fade away. Talk about a win-win!
<<<snipped for brevity>>>
You may have a point but every time I've asked why kids try drugs it's because they want to feel better, to get high.
So MY point is, what is wrong with them that they feel so awful? Why do they need to be high to feel good? Most people feel okay the way they are without taking drugs. Get to the root of the cause--it would also involve why so many kids are committing suicide. Just WHAT is wrong with our society that kids are so depressed?
Also, the police in my last town, a tourist town that filled up with druggies in the off season, were fed up with the drugs. The police chief, who was wonderful and actually had to kill someone who was swinging a machete one time but other than that, never shot anyone, said that the narcon made it "like a revolving door." They were treating the same people over and over and over.
AND, I really do not want these kids to go somewhere and buy drugs, take them, and then get behind the wheel of a car. There's enough of a problem with alcoholics doing that. We need to find out WHY they feel that they need drugs to feel normal. Then treat THAT reason.
The thing is we don't help to offer people that take drugs an alternative. We don't give them an incentive to stop. In Switzerland in the 80s they had a huge issue with people taking drugs. What did they do? They set up many clinics where those on drugs would come in, get a good place to eat, sleep, shower and get a dose of whatever drug they were using while also offering therapy and assistance. It helped dramatically and curbed the issue big time.
The thing is we don't help to offer people that take drugs an alternative. We don't give them an incentive to stop. In Switzerland in the 80s they had a huge issue with people taking drugs. What did they do? They set up many clinics where those on drugs would come in, get a good place to eat, sleep, shower and get a dose of whatever drug they were using while also offering therapy and assistance. It helped dramatically and curbed the issue big time.
Too many people see that as 'soft'. They prefer to see the offenders punished.
Never mind that it's not actually effective. A lot of people look at the criminal justice system and care less about results and more about feeling good about seeing the 'bad guys' made to suffer.
And the fact that this results in a society that is less safe, where their children and other loved ones and friends are more likely to be victimized? Pffft! Whatever! That's down the road. They want the here-and-now warm fuzzies of retribution!
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