Welcome to City-Data.com Forum!
U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Great Debates
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 12-06-2009, 07:36 AM
 
35,016 posts, read 39,154,953 times
Reputation: 6195

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by SOON2BNSURPRISE View Post
What is the program for those on the welfare roles? What plan is there for the participants to get off of the system? How are we as a nation showing the poor that they can work hard and over time succeed? Each of the examples that I gave for those that are now successfull took years to happen. Are we teaching people that success can happen over time? From what I see the entire system is holding people back by allowing them to remain on the welfare roles.
The "cradle to grave" programs ended in 1996 and have continued to dwindle from there. I believe now people can only receive cash assistance for a lifetime total of five years. Plus people (generally mothers, there are few men on the kind of welfare you're talking about) who are accepted into the program are required to work x-hours per week or month in exchange for help.

You can look up your state's policy online.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 12-06-2009, 08:01 AM
 
Location: Victoria TX
42,554 posts, read 86,977,099 times
Reputation: 36644
Quote:
Originally Posted by SOON2BNSURPRISE View Post

Why would you hold any of these people in contempt for working hard to get where they are? .
I'm sorry you wasted so much time making a point that you didn't need to make. I didn't say people SHOULD hold them in contempt, I said they DO hold them in contempt, up and until they stop their old world behavior and begin to act like American country club millionaires.

Illegal Mexicans are trying to do exactly the same thing, and for their effort, the majority of Americans want troops to go down there and shoot to kill.

Since you went to such lengths to convey your personal experiences, let me ask you this. When traveling, do you actually prefer to put your family in an Indian-owned motel, in order to help this meritorious entrepreneur become a wealthy hospitality mogul? As opposed to some American mom and pop who lack the drive?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-06-2009, 10:04 AM
 
3,562 posts, read 5,226,922 times
Reputation: 1861
I find this painful. I can't rep you, currently. Be that as it may, there are moments in time where you rock. This is one of them.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-07-2009, 01:06 PM
 
Location: Living on the Coast in Oxnard CA
16,289 posts, read 32,345,962 times
Reputation: 21891
Quote:
Originally Posted by jtur88 View Post
I'm sorry you wasted so much time making a point that you didn't need to make. I didn't say people SHOULD hold them in contempt, I said they DO hold them in contempt, up and until they stop their old world behavior and begin to act like American country club millionaires.

Illegal Mexicans are trying to do exactly the same thing, and for their effort, the majority of Americans want troops to go down there and shoot to kill.

Since you went to such lengths to convey your personal experiences, let me ask you this. When traveling, do you actually prefer to put your family in an Indian-owned motel, in order to help this meritorious entrepreneur become a wealthy hospitality mogul? As opposed to some American mom and pop who lack the drive?
This has nothing to do with business owners. My thoughts are toward the many that are on the dole, living on welfare and not participating in the American Dream. They see no hope other than siting by the mail box waiting for the next welfare check. They do this when at the same time someone that imigrates to this nation with nothing but a dream and turns that dream into success. I used the example of the imigrants because if you were to visit their nations you would see that they were leaving something much worse than most here will ever imagine.

This has nothing to do with those American citizens that built their own business here or worked hard in some other way to make their dreams become a reality. The thread is about the problem of the poor and not the problem of the Mom and Pop business owner in America. If you were to check you would find that the largest segment of Millionaires in this nation is the average Mom and Pop business owner. Many of which did just as the immigrants that I am talking about.

As far as staying at an Indian owned hotel or a Mom and Pop hotel owned by an American couple how am I supposed to know if the place is owned by an American Citizen or not? When you choose a place to stay do you ask the couple if they are American Citizens? How do you know if the imigrant couple running the place are not Citizens? Did you check to ask?
Is your assumption that the people running the place are not American based on race?

I have some good friends from Iran, some of whom own businesses here. I frequent their places of business. They have all become American Citizens. If your were to ask them they would tell you that Iran is a beautifull place to visit, but the Government has failed its people. Every one of them loves this nation. They are all true Americans.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-07-2009, 01:18 PM
 
Location: Victoria TX
42,554 posts, read 86,977,099 times
Reputation: 36644
Quote:
Originally Posted by SOON2BNSURPRISE View Post
If you were to check you would find that the largest segment of Millionaires in this nation is the average Mom and Pop business owner. .
A WalMart Greeter, working fulltime from age 18 to 65 and then going on SS, will earn a million dollars (at today's wages) in his lifetime. A person who isn't even capable of doing that will receive a million dollars in public benefits in a lifetime. So now you know who the millionaires are.

About half of all mom and pops who go into business, put their entire life savings and all they can borrow into it, and in less than four years, the business fails and they have nothing and file for bankruptcy. So much for the American dream which for an increasing number of people, is an American nightmare. Not even talking about the so-called American dream of "owning your own home".
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-07-2009, 03:29 PM
 
Location: Living on the Coast in Oxnard CA
16,289 posts, read 32,345,962 times
Reputation: 21891
So the other half of mom and pops are successfull then and do make it? so what to do? Do nothing because half of those failed that did something? Those seek like good odds to me. The odds for winning the lotto are so bad that it is not worth it to play. The odds to win in Vegas are so bad that it isn't worth it to play. You just stated that the odds to win in the small business world are 50 50 that you winn or lose within the first 5 years. Those are the best odds I have seen so far for success.

Look at all those people that thought they had a sure thing going for them by working a job for someone. Not too good with the economy and lay offs. Nothing is for certain. One thing is certain is that by doing nothing you can gain nothing. By sitting on your hind section and hoping that Uncle Obama will save you and put food on your table, you still have nothing and chances are will remain poor.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-07-2009, 03:44 PM
 
Location: Victoria TX
42,554 posts, read 86,977,099 times
Reputation: 36644
Quote:
Originally Posted by SOON2BNSURPRISE View Post
So the other half of mom and pops are successfull then and do make it? so what to do? Do nothing because half of those failed that did something? .
It is not my place to counsel users on their prospects.

It is my place, however, to grant every person basic respect and dignity and the freedom to seek their fortune, whether their hoped-for rewards be financial or otherwise, and not cast judgment upon them if their dreams are different from my own.

I think the actual odds are about 50/50 that a small business startup will fail or not fail in 5 years. Not all that "don't fail" generate enough income to support the entrepreneur.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-08-2009, 04:11 PM
 
48,502 posts, read 96,856,573 times
Reputation: 18304
The problem of tehpoor is its only likely to get worse as they decide more and more to not take advantage of a basic education and dropout rates rise. That is why the income gap will continue to rise. You know its bad when the federal government spends money to teach life skills as part of job training. That bascially is trying to teach people that you have to show up on time;not call in sick because you earn a sick day and just showing up for work without working is not enough to advance you.Truely sad.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-08-2009, 04:51 PM
 
3,562 posts, read 5,226,922 times
Reputation: 1861
No, what is sad is that you have not discovered spell check.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-08-2009, 09:43 PM
 
Location: Houston/Heights
2,637 posts, read 4,463,432 times
Reputation: 977
My typing skills, and spelling skills are poor at best now. but before I found "Spell checker" I couldn't read half of what I had written, the next day. ---I know what your thinking, so be nice.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:

Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Great Debates

All times are GMT -6.

© 2005-2024, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Contact Us - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37 - Top