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Switzerland has problems with their healthcare plan if it is government run. I will have to google for info on that but I don't feel like right now.
I do know other European nations and Canada have a ton of problems with their plans. Waiting lines, rationed care, people dying off before they can get critical care, high costs, heavy taxation levels, huge government spending deficits, etc. You want to talk other countries while ignoring what goes on there.
This isn't Europe, thankfully. This our country. That is what the American revolution was about. If we slave to their dumb ideas then we shouldn't have bothered. LOL
This isn't Europe or Canada bro, and I don't think it is true they all support it.
They do. Try visiting somewhere outside of the United States - Canada, Germany, UK, Australia.
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You are also ignorning their consistent double digit unemployment, high taxation levels, and huge spending deficits that result from funding a massive entitlement.
The following countries have universal, cheaper per capita healthcare than the United States, and also have lower unemployment rates: Sweden, New Zealand, Canada, Australia, the Netherlands, Germany, Iceland, Norway, Switzerland, South Korea. This is not an exhaustive list.
The following countries have lower debt to GDP ratio than the United States and also have universal health care that costs less per capita than the United States: Germany, Austria, Canada, Switzerland, New Zealand, Australia, Sweden, Norway. Non-exhaustive list.
Do you have a reason why what works in those countries cannot work in the United States?
Um, no. Most people have insurance thru their employer or a private plan or they are healthy and have enough money to pay out of pocket when they need to.
So everyone doesn't need to have several million dollars to pay their insurance costs.
You seem prone to exaggeration and embellishment. LOL
If you have insurance through your employer or a private plan, you have someone else paying your medical bills, namely, the insurance company. That's what insurance does, it pays medical bills that individuals could not pay on their own.
They do. Try visiting somewhere outside of the United States - Canada, Germany, UK, Australia.
The following countries have universal, cheaper per capita healthcare than the United States, and also have lower unemployment rates: Sweden, New Zealand, Canada, Australia, the Netherlands, Germany, Iceland, Norway, Switzerland, South Korea. This is not an exhaustive list.
The following countries have lower debt to GDP ratio than the United States and also have universal health care that costs less per capita than the United States: Germany, Austria, Canada, Switzerland, New Zealand, Australia, Sweden, Norway. Non-exhaustive list.
Do you have a reason why what works in those countries cannot work in the United States?
Yeah dude, they are democracies yet everybody believes the same thing on issues? You really are a bonehead if you believe that.
The cheaper per capita healthcare is a trick they use because it isn't including the taxes people pay for it. They are paying like 25 percent of their taxes for healthcare. If they weren't being taxed for healthcare and their government run system was shut down, they would be spending less on healthcare. They getting taxed all the time for something they only need on occasion. It's a bad deal.
It doesn't work in those countries. They are flawed plans screwing lots of people over but once you implement something like this it is hard to get rid of it. Governmet programs never go away.
These countreis have high taxes, huge spending deficits, long waiting lines, lower quality care, etc. America has much better healthcare quality than these other countries. You never focus on quality of care, just the costs.
Again, Republicans want to reduce the costs of healthcare, Democrats via O-Care are actually EXCUSING the high costs of healthcare and just transferring the costs from the high risk people to the low risk people. It isn't a fair law and it is bad law if it hurts the majority of people to ostensibly help some lower income people.
If you have insurance through your employer or a private plan, you have someone else paying your medical bills, namely, the insurance company. That's what insurance does, it pays medical bills that individuals could not pay on their own.
No, you are paying a premium and you are paying a deductible and then you are paying a percentage after the insurance companies kicks in. Many people never have any real high cost healthcare so they are actually paying in more then they get back.
If insurance company is other people paying our bills then why do we need government to get involved? You consistently make arguments that backfire on you.
If insurance companies were not involved, the bills would not be so bloated as doctors would have to deal directly with customers. They would have a lot of customers in debt collection rather than making any money if the costs didn't come down. Insurance actually drives costs up as doctors and medical people have no real incentive to be more efficient and look to keep costs down.
Yeah dude, they are democracies yet everybody believes the same thing on issues? You really are a bonehead if you believe that.
The cheaper per capita healthcare is a trick they use because it isn't including the taxes people pay for it.
Yes, they most certainly do factor in taxes. Otherwise Canada would show zero cost and not half the cost of the US.
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It doesn't work in those countries. They are flawed plans screwing lots of people over
Could you please give me an example of a country that is trying to move to the pre-2009 American healthcare model?
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Again, Republicans want to reduce the costs of healthcare, Democrats via O-Care are actually EXCUSING the high costs of healthcare and just transferring the costs from the high risk people to the low risk people.
Republicans did nothing to lower the cost of healthcare during the six years they had the Presidency, both houses of Congress, and 7/9 of the Supreme Court justices. They would have continued to do nothing if the Democrats had not fixed the system. Even today you see no proposals from Republicans about what to do about preexisting condition exclusions, annual maximums - the only thing they have is 'repeal Obamacare.' Which is funny, because it was all their idea - Newt Gingrich proposed it as an alternative to Hillary Clinton's 1993 plan, and Mitt Romney passed it in Massachusetts.
No, you are paying a premium and you are paying a deductible and then you are paying a percentage after the insurance companies kicks in.
And in the event that you have a high medical bill, the insurance company pays you more than you paid them, because you yourself could not pay such a high medical bill.
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If insurance company is other people paying our bills then why do we need government to get involved? You consistently make arguments that backfire on you.
Because a huge number of people don't have insurance. And when they do it often doesn't cover pre-exisiting conditions, or it imposes lifetime maximums, or has barriers to switching companies, or a variety of other problems that keep people from getting covered for what they need.
I suggest you learn more about this issue before you discuss it. Learn what insurance is, and why several millions don't have it, how other countries have set up systems to give everyone health insurance at far lower costs. Try to figure out why people who disagree with you have the opinions they do.
Yes, they most certainly do factor in taxes. Otherwise Canada would show zero cost and not half the cost of the US.
Could you please give me an example of a country that is trying to move to the pre-2009 American healthcare model?
Republicans did nothing to lower the cost of healthcare during the six years they had the Presidency, both houses of Congress, and 7/9 of the Supreme Court justices. They would have continued to do nothing if the Democrats had not fixed the system. Even today you see no proposals from Republicans about what to do about preexisting condition exclusions, annual maximums - the only thing they have is 'repeal Obamacare.'
Canada shows healthcare costs that people paid out of pocket as a percentage of GDP. The taxes are not included in that cost although they are obviously a very big part of the costs.
You keep talking about other countries but this is our country and it is our government and if people oppose a dumb plan then that plan is going down in flames. To argue we must do whatever Europe and Canada does is silly. We are the world's best economy so it doesn't make sense to follow what these high tax socialist freedom restricting countries do.
Democrats don't support free market solutions and I think Democrats had a majority under Bush. We can't ram thru everything we want. We've been preaching health savings accounts and other free market solutions for years and you guys hate that because government is your god. Government is always your solution to everything. You are zealots about government. It really is weird if you think about it. You want the same kind of people who work at the DMV involved in healthcare decisions. LOL
Annual maximums are done to keep premiums down. Obamacare is jacking up premiums by lifting annual maximums. You can't have it both ways.
Again, the idea is to push healthcare costs down. Not just spread out the misery. Democrats like to spread misery and essentially buy votes with other people's money.
We've been proposing stuff for years, like tort reform on these medical malpractice suits and given Democrats are supported by the lawyer lobby, they don't support stuff like this.
And in the event that you have a high medical bill, the insurance company pays you more than you paid them, because you yourself could not pay such a high medical bill.
Because a huge number of people don't have insurance. And when they do it often doesn't cover pre-exisiting conditions, or it imposes lifetime maximums, or has barriers to switching companies, or a variety of other problems that keep people from getting covered for what they need.
I suggest you learn more about this issue before you discuss it. Learn what insurance is, and why several millions don't have it, how other countries have set up systems to give everyone health insurance at far lower costs. Try to figure out why people who disagree with you have the opinions they do.
Yes this is called risk pooling, some people will benefit more than others, but since we don't know the future, we gamble as a group to spread out the costs among us. You are paying for insurance though, you act like it is 100 percent paid by somebody else. Again, if somebody IS paying our medical bills, why the need for ObamaCare to save the day? You are nuking your own argument for Ocare with this talking point.
Some people who don't 'have insurance don't WANT it or NEED it, b/c they can pay out of pocket plus they are healthy. They taking on m ore risk to cut down expenses now and they pay up when they have to.
Only 8000 out of the entire population are denied insurance for pre-existing conditions. But state govenerments already have high risk pools they can jump into, and there are other remedies for these people, and we could easily deal with these 8000 people without government doing a power grab of an entire industry.
You need to take your own advice. You clearly don't understand why insurance companies have annual caps and lifetime caps and pre-existing conditions and all the rest. They have to keep costs down or they wont be in business and nobody will get insurance. O-Care is spefiicall designed to put them out of business, so government will the only option. I know you get off on this anti-corporation and anti-capitalism kind of power grab by the government though.
All you are doing is supporting the formation of a monopoly on the healthcare insurance market by the government.
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