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That may or not be the case. Basically that's a baseless assumption the total percentage that never applied for a visa.
Again, it's this simplistic argument (which seems to now dominate every facet of politics) that takes nothing else into account that is truly doing harm in our nation.
Immigration reform will be impossible if you simply come from a standpoint of emotion.
It doesn't matter whether they were refused a visa or never applied for one. What part of "no" don't they understand?
We can't afford to base our immigration policies on just humanitarism either. Many things have to be factored in, in order to remain humane to our own citizenry and not negatively impact our own country. It is the pro-illegals that are appealing on emotion, not us.
You're not really making sense. Increasing wages doesn't necessarily equate to retaining workers. Also farmers don't have unlimited funds to simply increase wages. Illegal immigrants comprise more than 2% of farm workers btw. According to Pew in 2006, 26% are illegal. That's a very significant number.
Yes, at the uni level. Uni=university level.
There are unlimited H-2A visas available for "legal" immigrant farm workers. That argument is getting old.
Actually reform will be impossible until we secure the border between the USA and Mexico. The fact that at least 12 million have crossed this border illegally should be evidence enough for most.
We don't know how many applied for a VISA because we have no idea what the actual number of illegals are.
Another thing is that we don't know the impact of enforcing our laws on agriculture will be. How can we? We don't know that any cost savings are passed on to the consumer. How do farms operate without illegals in some areas and not others? How do some resturants function without illegals? Yet to hear the pro illegal crowd we would all starve.
How do some houses get built without illegal labor?
My favorite is when the pro-side claims that no one will cut my grass without illegals. Well I have been cutting my own grass my entire life. My tractor did not come equiped with an illegal to drive it.
It really is simple. You can't operate using illegal labor, its against the law.
Any industry that allows itself to be dominated by illegal labor needs to be modified or eliminated.
9% unemployment... I can see some answers to that problem. You want the check here is where you will show up for work on monday morning.
There are key aspects to reform that are CRUCIALLY needed. The biggest, is how we distribute visas. We have a pretty good idea of how many illegal immigrants are in the US. We do have a good idea of what would happen if you deport all illegal immigrants. That's not even debated. We know the billions of dollars just in initial deportation. We know the billions lost. We know that these companies would have greatly reduced productivity. Not to mention a loss of sales tax, etc. We know that the average American has seen a net benefit in purchasing power by illegal immigration.
It's not that simple. You may cut your own grass, but you do benefit from illegal labor.
The 9% unemployment is a red herring argument. Illegal immigration has slowed due to the recession. Not to mention that illegal immigrants have WAY higher unemployment rates than the rest of the nation. So this means that the effect on unemployment is not that great. We would expect unemployment to DECLINE if illegal immigration had a significant impact. They don't constitute a large percentage of the total workforce.
There are unlimited H-2A visas available for "legal" immigrant farm workers. That argument is getting old.
There are only 30,000 H-2A visas. Obviously accessibility is an issue. It is getting old, I mean after all shouldn't facts triumph over national sentiment? There is a middle ground to be had and I feel that many online don't really get that.
There are key aspects to reform that are CRUCIALLY needed. The biggest, is how we distribute visas. We have a pretty good idea of how many illegal immigrants are in the US. We do have a good idea of what would happen if you deport all illegal immigrants. That's not even debated. We know the billions of dollars just in initial deportation. We know the billions lost. We know that these companies would have greatly reduced productivity. Not to mention a loss of sales tax, etc. We know that the average American has seen a net benefit in purchasing power by illegal immigration.
It's not that simple. You may cut your own grass, but you do benefit from illegal labor.
The 9% unemployment is a red herring argument. Illegal immigration has slowed due to the recession. Not to mention that illegal immigrants have WAY higher unemployment rates than the rest of the nation. So this means that the effect on unemployment is not that great. We would expect unemployment to DECLINE if illegal immigration had a significant impact. They don't constitute a large percentage of the total workforce.
What is the basis for your assertions? Do you have credible data to substantiate your claims? If so, please share.
It doesn't matter whether they were refused a visa or never applied for one. What part of "no" don't they understand?
We can't afford to base our immigration policies on just humanitarism either. Many things have to be factored in, in order to remain humane to our own citizenry and not negatively impact our own country. It is the pro-illegals that are appealing on emotion, not us.
It's not only humanitarian, but also a longer term economic stance as well. If you create an underclass, you're essentially decreasing the number of consumers. With the demographic quagmire we're in (a decreasing number of Whites and Blacks) we need to look as who the future middle class consumers can and will be. Thus, we need to address the issue of illegal in such a way that tries to promote people to the middle class. This fosters stability and creates our consumer class, the economic basis of America.
Like I said, it's not a simple problem. Read Planet of the Slums. It really does show the what happens when a nation loses that consumer class.
Emotionality runs on both sides. The hardcore La Raza and the hyper patriotic are simply opposite ends of the spectrum, yet with the same fervor. This is not to call anyone any names. Just simply stating how I feel about extremists. The more you shout and the more you cling on to ideology and not look at every moving part, the more your argument becomes laughable...again this goes to both sides.
What is the basis for your assertions? Do you have credible data to substantiate your claims? If so, please share.
The census, Pew Hispanic, Rand...pretty much every other major educational institution in our nation. It's not as if this information of how we know these figures is really new or earth shattering.
The census, Pew Hispanic, Rand...pretty much every other major educational institution in our nation. It's not as if this information of how we know these figures is really new or earth shattering.
I didn’t say it was earth shattering. I simply asked if you would like to provide proof. Apparently not.
I didn’t say it was earth shattering. I simply asked if you would like to provide proof. Apparently not.
I gave you a list of organizations. That's pretty much proof. Not to mention most think tanks use the same methodology as Homeland Security and get roughly the same results. Even when using different techniques, the stats come out to roughly the same numbers. You might have to do a little more research than simply ask for 1 link.
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