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Old 04-10-2008, 10:13 PM
 
220 posts, read 382,497 times
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The only difference is that Italy is halfway around the world from New York City while Los Angeles is next door to Mexico.

 
Old 04-10-2008, 10:16 PM
 
Location: California
3,172 posts, read 6,762,982 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by macmeal View Post
It COULD be, and in a few cases, this may be all there is to it. true.

But there are a lot of differences, despite your analogy. The immigrants who came here decades ago (LEGALLY, I might add) were 'taunted', pushed, and 'pressured' into assimilating. There was a powerful stigma at work, to shed one's 'foreign' ways, and become Americans, and the quicker the better. This was ALSO true of the MEXICANS who arrived here in the US, during that era. Often times, the biggest "patriot" in the neighborhood was the old 'foreigner' down the street with the HUGE American flag on his porch on the Fourth of July. Mexican-Americans historically have had a HIGH rate of military service in the US..higher even than our 'norm". Similar stories could be told of ALL groups, in that time in history. "Becoming American" was a precious prize worth striving for.,,,for ALL immigrants, "brown" or not. People went out of their way to 'show' that they were now "members" of ttheir new society. It was 'worth it' to them, to make that special effort.



Today, the immigrants have changed. PART of that change has been in reaction to the change that has taken place HERE. No longer do we "push" assimilation...that's too 'intrusive'. People should be able to 'celebrate their cultures' we believe...no matter WHAT those cultures are. We have no RIGHT (we feel) to ask them to "change"..that would be 'imposing upon them". Indeed, plenty of us (check out this forum) don't even think we should ask them to be LEGAL....even ILLEGAL people, we're told, are still 'good'...as good as you, or me, or anyone else. NO ONE, we're told, has a right to 'pass judgement'.

With this in mind, it should be no surprise that the "new" illegal immigrant 'crowd' (now numbering in the MULTIPLE MILLIONS) see little incentive to assimilate...."assimilate to WHAT?" they might ask. Apparently, the AMERICANS don't care, so why should "we"?...and reading over many posts on this forum, I'd have to say they're probably right.

Modern illegal immigration has been reduced to a simple economic move. There's no emotional "Statue of Liberty" moment...no "Breath of Freedom" upon arrival here...it's seen as little different from moving across a state line. And no 'gratitude' is involved, either, because "we" no longer EXPECT it. We've pretty well told the whole world that THEY (whoever they are) have as much right to be here as WE do...legal or not. So no gratitude, and no 'appreciation'....and no assimilation, is neccessary.

Those who WANT to assimilate, for personal reasons, are free to do so..and many do. But it's not 'pushed', nor is it even ENCOURAGED.

BIG difference in today's illegal immigration, and past LEGAL immigration. And by the way, I have a large number of "brown" family members who agree. "Brown" immigrants may infuriate SOME Americans, but ILLEGAL ones infuriate a lot MORE....in my experience.


your making a point, but the thing that no one can deny is that assimilation takes place naturally whether one wants it to or not.

If you are born and raised in a country, you will learn the language. The American culture is way too strong and far reaching to ignore. I dont care how many signs are written in spanish.


Whether they get forced into it or not, the next genration will speak english, and will be more American. They don't spend all day at home...they go to school, they go to the mall, they go to the dmv, they watch tv and movies, listen to the music. They will assimilate.


All the kids having trouble learning english are recent immigrants. Throw an American into China, and he will have trouble learning mandarin..but I bet you his kid will grow up speaking it.
 
Old 04-10-2008, 10:16 PM
 
Location: Denver
9,963 posts, read 18,539,773 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ArizonaBear View Post
Be careful there; macmeal, someone may accuse you of being anti illegal immigrant------or, at least anti 'Hispanic'.

Needless you say; I agree with your position
I just wish some of you would make up your mind on who you are at the issue with, I mean sometimes you attack Hispanic culture, then any Spanish speaker, then you say it is just illegals that you dislike and legals are great. I'll just assume you have a problem with all of the above.
 
Old 04-10-2008, 10:18 PM
 
Location: Denver
9,963 posts, read 18,539,773 times
Reputation: 6181
I hate to tell this to everyone here but I doubt Mexicans will be the last wave of mass immigration to the US.
 
Old 04-10-2008, 10:19 PM
 
Location: Mesa, Az
21,144 posts, read 42,214,200 times
Reputation: 3861
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mach50 View Post
I just wish some of you would make up your mind on who you at the issue with, I mean sometimes you attack Hispanic culture, then any Spanish Speaker, then you say it is just illegals that you dislike and legals are great. I'll just assume you have a problem with all of the above.
Let me put it this way: if we were being overrun by illegal Hungarians; I would be just as offended------and, as you know, I am of part Hungarian lineage.
 
Old 04-10-2008, 10:19 PM
 
162 posts, read 326,681 times
Reputation: 53
you are right, otherwise we could have pizza with tortilla flavor and probably the taco bell dog will bark in italian style, lol
 
Old 04-10-2008, 10:20 PM
 
Location: California
3,172 posts, read 6,762,982 times
Reputation: 336
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mach50 View Post
I just wish some of you would make up your mind on who you at the issue with, I mean sometimes you attack Hispanic culture, then any Spanish Speaker, then you say it is just illegals that you dislike and legals are great. I'll just assume you have a problem with all of the above.
thats the contradiction that bothers me the most. they say it has nothing to do with hispanics, then they complain about hearing spanish all the time, or use terms like "mexifornia" to describe the changing demographics.

In the end, thats what it will be. Demographics are going to change, and thats what really scares people.

But just because Mexicans are growing in numbers does not mean they are tryign to take over the country.

Thats like saying all the Italian/Irish immigrants wanted to take over the country. Instead they assimilated..and yes, Mexicans are capable of that too.


You rarely hear about the Mexican-American Middle class, but it does exist. And you know why it does?

They ASSIMILATED.
 
Old 04-10-2008, 10:20 PM
 
Location: Denver
9,963 posts, read 18,539,773 times
Reputation: 6181
Quote:
Originally Posted by ArizonaBear View Post
Let me put it this way: if we were being overrun by illegal Hungarians; I would be just as offended------and, as you know, I am of part Hungarian lineage.
But even you AZBear whom I have no personal issue with, have recently posted generally about Hispanic culture being at fault when it comes to learning in schools.
 
Old 04-10-2008, 10:24 PM
 
Location: California
3,172 posts, read 6,762,982 times
Reputation: 336
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mach50 View Post
I hate to tell this to everyone here but I doubt Mexicans will be the last wave of mass immigration to the US.
It won't. Over time, a new group will immigrate in large numbers. I read somewhere a long time ago that while Hispanics comprise of the vast majority of immigrants..asian immigrants are coming at a faster rate.

You never know.

Not the first, probably not the last.
 
Old 04-10-2008, 10:28 PM
 
Location: Denver
9,963 posts, read 18,539,773 times
Reputation: 6181
Once the hundreds of thousands of Iraqi refugees are given citizenship here expect a major Arab wave.
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