[canudigit]

Originally Posted by Specialbuddy

Just found this too

List of most miserable cities in U.S. 2010
1. Cleveland
2. Stockton, Calif.
3. Memphis, Tenn.
4. Detroit
5. Flint, Mich.
6. Miami
7. St. Louis
8. Buffalo, N.Y.
9. Canton, Ohio
10. Chicago

From forbes.com, a list of most miserable cities in the U.S., released yesterday.

These lists are somewhat subjective, don't you think? And the titles always have to sound sensationalistic. Instead of calling it something like "Cities With a Few More Challenges", or something like that, they have to inject the term "miserable", as if everyone living in these carefully selected cities is walking around crying into their coffee and praying to leave before their therapy expense drives them into bankruptcy. Sheesh. I lived in the Phoenix, AZ area for much of last year. Sure, Phoenix has some nice features (same as here and everywhere else), but there are many things about Phoenix that would qualify it for a list of "Most Miserable": exceptionally high crime, dust storms, excessively high utility prices, excessively high cost of car insurance (secondary to excessively high car theft), excessively high cost of automobile registration and plates, excessively high incidents of skin cancer, traffic that would make you slap your mother, horrific job market at the moment, and foreclosures on almost every corner. However, the person or people who compiled this list decided that these other cities are more miserable, based on the factors that they have chosen as indicators of misery. See my point? Subjective. All places are a mix of good and bad, or there would be entire cities completely empty of life, because the "misery" would have driven everyone away.

"Forbes". LOL.

[Peter B]

Bitter folks complaining because they are not able to generate a sufficient income to live well.

Originally Posted by Specialbuddy

Why does every thread about Northern Michigan turn into this?

[canudigit]

Originally Posted by Peter B

Bitter folks complaining because they are not able to generate a sufficient income to live well.

Which is sometimes one's own fault and often times not. I know people who have extensive college degrees and have worked very, very hard to better their lives and still lost their jobs due to downsizing. Just working hard and getting a college degree used to be enough, but not anymore. Times are so tough everywhere right now.

[scolls]

Originally Posted by Peter B

Bitter folks complaining because they are not able to generate a sufficient income to live well.

I have enough income to live well. I have enough income to make two house payments, truck payment, and still have money left over. If I wasn't in northern Michigan, I'd be living better.

I just don't understand Michigan anymore. When I was looking to relocate to Florida, I lurked in the forums and all the Floridians where able to discuss all the shortcomings of Florida. In Michigan we just ignore it and tell everybody to be positive. There is a lack of quality jobs in Michigan and especially northern Michigan. To get these special skills that apparently Peter has, you have to leave northern Michigan anyways. There are no good universities in northern Michigan. Why would a student who decides to go to Michigan or Michigan State come back up north where wages are lower and jobs are hard to find? I think I'm the only one

[michmoldman]

Originally Posted by scolls

I have enough income to live well. I have enough income to make two house payments, truck payment, and still have money left over. If I wasn't in northern Michigan, I'd be living better.

I just don't understand Michigan anymore. When I was looking to relocate to Florida, I lurked in the forums and all the Floridians where able to discuss all the shortcomings of Florida. In Michigan we just ignore it and tell everybody to be positive. There is a lack of quality jobs in Michigan and especially northern Michigan. To get these special skills that apparently Peter has, you have to leave northern Michigan anyways. There are no good universities in northern Michigan. Why would a student who decides to go to Michigan or Michigan State come back up north where wages are lower and jobs are hard to find? I think I'm the only one

Did you tell them Florida sucks, and bash it at every possible chance like you do northern Michigan? Maybe thats the reason people bash you? I'm sure you didnt, because all the other forums I have seen react the same way when someone talks down their home. And once again...no one is disagreeing with you that life in Michigan, especially northern Michigan is rough, and jobs are scarce. YOU are telling everyone how crappy Gaylord is along with almost all the other towns and cities in North MI. I personally would not want to live by Detroit, but I never bash it. I know tons of people love it just just people love Gaylord, Grayling, Westbranch and so on. Maybe if you say Grayling is nice for some people, but not for you, northern Michigan is nice, but not for you...instead you act like people who live there would rather be dead. Discuss it like a rational person instead of just from your view.

[Peter B]

Exactly! People who bash the areas they live in are absolute morons. This is the USA! Anybody can live ANYWHERE they want to! So, complaining and doing nothing for your situation shows your ineptitude. We live up here, love it, and did what was necessary to stay here. Lots of folks up here are lazy, and as I said before, were raised believing the state owes them a living, and put more energy into whining than actually doing something about it. My wife & I could've moved just about anywhere in the country when we left LI 5+ years ago. We chose the Traverse area because we have a couple of friends she knew from Michigan State and fell in love with the natural beauty, perfect summers and cold snowy winters. As everyone here knows, the only thing I whine about is the food as I was spoiled where I grew up. But, we cook very often and are pleased the culinary aspect of this area has vastly improved since we moved here. I LOVE NORTHERN MICHIGAN

Originally Posted by michmoldman

Did you tell them Florida sucks, and bash it at every possible chance like you do northern Michigan? Maybe thats the reason people bash you? I'm sure you didnt, because all the other forums I have seen react the same way when someone talks down their home. And once again...no one is disagreeing with you that life in Michigan, especially northern Michigan is rough, and jobs are scarce. YOU are telling everyone how crappy Gaylord is along with almost all the other towns and cities in North MI. I personally would not want to live by Detroit, but I never bash it. I know tons of people love it just just people love Gaylord, Grayling, Westbranch and so on. Maybe if you say Grayling is nice for some people, but not for you, northern Michigan is nice, but not for you...instead you act like people who live there would rather be dead. Discuss it like a rational person instead of just from your view.

[scolls]

Originally Posted by michmoldman

Did you tell them Florida sucks, and bash it at every possible chance like you do northern Michigan? Maybe thats the reason people bash you? I'm sure you didnt, because all the other forums I have seen react the same way when someone talks down their home. And once again...no one is disagreeing with you that life in Michigan, especially northern Michigan is rough, and jobs are scarce. YOU are telling everyone how crappy Gaylord is along with almost all the other towns and cities in North MI. I personally would not want to live by Detroit, but I never bash it. I know tons of people love it just just people love Gaylord, Grayling, Westbranch and so on. Maybe if you say Grayling is nice for some people, but not for you, northern Michigan is nice, but not for you...instead you act like people who live there would rather be dead. Discuss it like a rational person instead of just from your view.

No Floridians did that for me. They mentioned how bad the schools are throughout Florida and how bad the crime is throughout the state. They also admitted about Florida having low wages and mostly service industry. Things they didn't say was be positive and you aren't skilled.

I guess bashing Gaylord means stating the fact it has one the single highest crime rates of any city north of Saginaw and higher than about 80% of Detroit's suburbs, or that it has low wage earners, schools that are statistically below a lot of suburban Detroit schools, sub standard hospitals (any hospital not equipped to handle a heart attack is sub standard) and lack of social or night life.

Remember, this started when I made a thread that said MY comparison. Than I posted about the old couple getting tied up and robbed in Gaylord, and one poster said if it happened in Harper Woods they would've been stabbed, raped and set on fire even though statistically you are more likely to get raped, murdered, and set on fire in Gaylord.

Please will someone tell me about the quality jobs in northern Michigan. I'm sorry if you take reality as bashing. Look at the common industries. Especially for females. I was shocked that welfare actually made the list of top industries. Top occupations are secretaries and cashiers.

[scolls]

Originally Posted by hereIcomeagain

I will be moving to North Michigan around East Jordan, how is the work situation around there and Petoskey. I could even drive to Traverse City. My relitives told me that Traverse City has lost many businesses, like Mongolian BBQ and the mall has many empty slots. I do not have relitives in Petoskey and EJ is a smaller town. Any ideas would be helpful. I work in real estate and I know its bad but was hoping for it to pick up.

Ok here is a Florida response to this question;

Well, there aren't a lot of good paying jobs left around the area. A lot of people are either retired or working at low wage jobs that don't provide health care. It's hard to find a job that would pay more than 30k a year.

Now the Michigan response;

If you're positive you'll find a good job. If you can't you're just unskilled and feel entitled to welfare. Northern Michigan is wonderful. It's so beautiful. It has pretty forests and lakes. Nice summers to. Oh and lake Michigan beaches are fantastic. It has cute little towns that have sister cities in Switzerland and try to imitate them.

[Peter B]

HAHA!! Talk about having blinders on

Originally Posted by scolls

Ok here is a Florida response to this question;

Well, there aren't a lot of good paying jobs left around the area. A lot of people are either retired or working at low wage jobs that don't provide health care. It's hard to find a job that would pay more than 30k a year.

Now the Michigan response;

If you're positive you'll find a good job. If you can't you're just unskilled and feel entitled to welfare. Northern Michigan is wonderful. It's so beautiful. It has pretty forests and lakes. Nice summers to. Oh and lake Michigan beaches are fantastic. It has cute little towns that have sister cities in Switzerland and try to imitate them.

[Tyryztoll]

scolls, for God's sake.......LEAVE MICHIGAN ALREADY!!! PLEASE!