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29 percent of Asians in the city [NYC] live in poverty as of 2012, compared to the 25.7 percent of Hispanics and 22.5 percent of blacks who do. The poverty rates for Asians increased the most between 2008 and 2012, showed the report released at the end of April, with much of it due to language barriers and non-immigrant citizens who have no access to the city's welfare system.
I would argue that the poor Asians have it even worst. Most of their English skills is non existent and this makes them even unqualified for the $100 unskilled day laborer jobs for which you still need to understand what people are telling you. And politically they're attacked for being somehow having an advantage and the current regime wants a racial quota for the top high schools put on Asians. They also want to introduce an essay for the specialized high school test just because some idiot thinks Asians can't write because there's doubts on whether they can kill the exam based admission.
A very small section of Rego Park maybe but most properties are just 200k-300k co-ops or multi family homes. Like I said Whitestone is probably the one place listed that I would imagine where a good portion of the people would be able to afford a 800k house without rental income or have a house worth 800k due to home appreciation the past decade. Your perception isn't date, those neighborhoods you mentioned are historically great neighborhoods. But I just don't consider being able to afford a few hundred thousand dollar co-op upper middle class.
I guess we have to define what upper middle class is. To me being able to max out your 401k, buying a brand new Mercedes/BMW (> C-class or 3 series), paying for day care or nanny (no slave wages), targeting to save 6 figures the kids' college funds, and being able to afford a property at least 800k all at the same time without having to live with you mom/dad/grandma/great grandma under one roof would be considered upper middle class. A very small portion of Rego Park and Midwood fit this criteria. Forest Hills which wasn't on the list, I would say is close to upper middle class like Whitestone and a section of Forest Hills I would consider wealthy i.e. those living in the 2-4 mil McMansions. And I don't don't believe those giant 2-4 mil McMansions in Forest Hills have illegal sub-partitions or basements rented out .
Of course on the high end there are the $4 mil mansions too, but the majority of the people live in coops and apartments.
Yes I agree. But overall Forest Hills is one of the only neighborhoods outside of manhattan sub-96th Street that can be even considered close to upper middle class. There really isn't a neighborhood that's homogeneously upper middle class to wealthy unless you consider sub-partitions of neighborhoods. In that case Forest Hills Gardens, Bayside Gables, Malba, Douglaston north or LIE, a portion of Bayside Hills, a good portion of Riverdale would be upper middle class. Not sure if I missed any..maybe Jamaica Estates. I know that a lot of people making lots of dough also live in Brooklyn i.e. Park Slope, but many people that live there also do room shares, etc. so I never get that feel that people truly are on the path to upper middle class in those places. When I use to live in Windsor Terrance I frequently went to Park Slope, I get the feeling that most people there are transients and are only there until they need and can afford that big house in the suburbs. I guess same can be said about myself at that point in time.
I would argue that the poor Asians have it even worst. Most of their English skills is non existent and this makes them even unqualified for the $100 unskilled day laborer jobs for which you still need to understand what people are telling you. And politically they're attacked for being somehow having an advantage and the current regime wants a racial quota for the top high schools put on Asians. They also want to introduce an essay for the specialized high school test just because some idiot thinks Asians can't write because there's doubts on whether they can kill the exam based admission.
I agree. Asians got it pretty bad. Being newcomers to this country, they usally start from the bottom (first generation). As for the racial quota on Asians, I think its ridiculous. Stopping kids who simply work hard to get out of poverty is a slap on the cheek. As for the essay, the name on the test will give away their ethnic background. I know a few colleges that purposely grade English placement exams low to make more money.
Last edited by Mistertee; 10-28-2014 at 09:27 PM..
You don't have a ****ing clue to what you're talkign about. Not a statistic or a fact in that entire blurb?
ASIANS and immigrants are poor? THe biggest growth of immigrants in NYC NJ and Delaware have beeen South Asians (Indians and Pakistanis). These groups are more economically well off and educated than whites. They are the reason so many high tech companies have located to NYC. I don't see many black white hispanic kids spending $200k on a hard science, engineering or technical degree. 50% of the PhD holders in america are Asian American.
Get your head out of your ass.
If it offers any consolation I'm part Asian Indian too.
Rego Park and Midwood (or at least parts of Midwood) wouldn't be deemed as "upper middle class" by you?
Rego Park impresses me as "upper middle class" (as is its neighbors Forest Hills and Kew Gardens) . . . unless my perceptions of these areas have become somewhat dated.
And Midwood has a whole collection of large gorgeous homes on immaculate streets (from what I see in Google Maps' Street View) and I would imagine you can't be just "lower middle" or even "middle middle" to maintain such homes.
Quote:
Originally Posted by bumblebyz
A very small section of Rego Park maybe but most properties are just 200k-300k co-ops or multi family homes. Like I said Whitestone is probably the one place listed that I would imagine where a good portion of the people would be able to afford a 800k house without rental income or have a house worth 800k due to home appreciation the past decade. Your perception isn't date, those neighborhoods you mentioned are historically great neighborhoods. But I just don't consider being able to afford a few hundred thousand dollar co-op upper middle class.
I guess we have to define what upper middle class is. To me being able to max out your 401k, buying a brand new Mercedes/BMW (> C-class or 3 series), paying for day care or nanny (no slave wages), targeting to save 6 figures the kids' college funds, and being able to afford a property at least 800k all at the same time without having to live with you mom/dad/grandma/great grandma under one roof would be considered upper middle class. A very small portion of Rego Park and Midwood fit this criteria. Forest Hills which wasn't on the list, I would say is close to upper middle class like Whitestone and a section of Forest Hills I would consider wealthy i.e. those living in the 2-4 mil McMansions. And I don't don't believe those giant 2-4 mil McMansions in Forest Hills have illegal sub-partitions or basements rented out .
Of course on the high end there are the $4 mil mansions too, but the majority of the people live in coops and apartments.
Quote:
Originally Posted by bumblebyz
Yes I agree. But overall Forest Hills is one of the only neighborhoods outside of manhattan sub-96th Street that can be even considered close to upper middle class. There really isn't a neighborhood that's homogeneously upper middle class to wealthy unless you consider sub-partitions of neighborhoods. In that case Forest Hills Gardens, Bayside Gables, Malba, Douglaston north or LIE, a portion of Bayside Hills, a good portion of Riverdale would be upper middle class. Not sure if I missed any..maybe Jamaica Estates. I know that a lot of people making lots of dough also live in Brooklyn i.e. Park Slope, but many people that live there also do room shares, etc. so I never get that feel that people truly are on the path to upper middle class in those places. When I use to live in Windsor Terrance I frequently went to Park Slope, I get the feeling that most people there are transients and are only there until they need and can afford that big house in the suburbs. I guess same can be said about myself at that point in time.
I may be somewhat "fuzzy" on the full & true definition of what truly entails what has been called "upper middle class". Bumblebyz's detailed description sounds probably right.
Over the years, in my own mind, I have defined three levels of middle class. I hear the world-at-large just mention "lower middle class" and "upper middle class". To me, there is what I call a "middle middle class" (people who aren't deemable as "lower middle class" but aren't quite "upper middle class" either). I have never heard of anyone else saying "middle middle class". Perhaps they just simply say "middle class" to mean the same thing, whereas I try to be more exacting and say "middle middle class" to distinguish such persons from those who are either "lower middle class" or "upper middle class".
There's been a diminishing middle class in NYC (and America) since the late 1970's but now it seems accelerated. The growing social stratification of the city is getting worrisome and I read one study which says were at levels of inequality not seen since the turn of the century. One of the reasons I made the choice to rent in the burbs. Granted I live in an upper middle class suburb but for a lower COL than a comparable neighborhood in NYC (trendy Brooklyn or desirable Manhattan)
When I first heard the "Tale of Two Cities" phrase being used a few years ago I balked at it but it's true for Manhattan, much of Brooklyn and even some parts of Queens now. I'd say Staten Island, some neighborhoods in the Bronx and Eastern Queens are where middle class NYer's are (own a home and raise a family while saving every month is what I think of).
Though people are mentioning hierarchies within the middle class itself like upper, middle and lower middle class which confuses things a bit.... Forest Hills and Riverdale come to mind as 2 upper middle class areas of NYC. Though, class is hard to tack down since it's a matter a lot of complicated factors beside just income like for example entry level workers who are from middle class background but are earning min wage or are making $25-30k per year. What would they be classified as? That's a whole 'nother thread right there.
Amazing Newyorkwriter dude: my first thought was wow !!! the Audacity of your original post...... POOR DUMB BLACKS.....
RE: Establishing,owning & sending children/ grandchildren to the best shools:
As one of eight children raised by a mother Mildred who had to divorce her husband during our child hood. Mildred worked at a laundry while struggling to raise her children. After always harping on education and introducing excellent study habits she lived long enough to witness her children on Honor rolls graduate high school, saw one daughter receive her Nurse degree and one son graduate with Engineer/Math degrees.
She did not live to witness her other Honor students receive their undergrad / graduate degrees, grand children and great grand children's undergrad and graduate degrees, Twins Financial, Accountant and Criminal Justice degrees, her grand son's, Physician and other grand son's Economist degrees. She read to my toddler as my baby sitter resulting in her 3 grades advanced Iowa tests. She did not witness my daughter as she was sworn in as an Attorney or her appointment as a Judge.
I assure you this is not isolated to our family. There are so many Black edudated, decent, successful BLACK people.
True I am, as many other Blacks are truly disappointed to see some blacks, as well as some hispanics and some whites do things that fit your POOR DUMB BLACK category.
The statement that absolutely nothing prevents NYC locals from rising up to the top and the assumption that all ethnc whites are educated, decent and successful as you know is not true. There are many reasons that the middle class has been pushed out of NYC.
DITTO Bronyxguyanese: Agree.
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for your definition of dink (I think). But some people say that my rhymes stink.
