Scranton - NYC Railway...Any Progress? (Philadelphia, York: purchase, live, buses)

[W-B proud]

Originally Posted by scrantonluna

PA will cheap out and will run on the same old rails that have been down since the 40s. That means you're going to have a steady stream of rail work, and that includes clearing the old lines, laying new spurs, construction of new structures along the line, etc. With all of the gas drilling work in NEPA, you will also see further involvement with rail service in terms of equipment and product delivery.

We are talking about the proposed passenger line here though right? i just do not see an economic rebirth coming on the tracks of a new railine. When I look at the overall picture (minus the B.S. that this projects supporting poloticians try to brainwash you to believe), I just don't see it. it will be a super expensive Marts bus on railroad tracks that all of NEPA and Pa. will be forced to pay for whether they want it or not, plus the ongoing subsidizing, upkeep, repairs, wages, maintance etc. It's just not worth it. this is not a super congested city like Philly or New York, we simply don't need a train to " relieve congestion on the roads and highways" the very worst traffic jam of the entire year in NEPA, doesn't equal one average day in rush hour traffic on the Schuykill Expressway, or Cross Bronx Expressway, and even when there IS a "traffic jam" it is 99% of the time due to construction, not volume or congestion. We are a small metro area in the shadow of the Megalopolis. Money is tight everywhere, and i just think we should invest that money into reparing bridges, water lines, infrastructure...you know...important things, instead of p*ssing in away on a project that will help Scranton with it's "image", and make them feel more "big city" and modern. What it boils down to in my mind is that Scranton wants a new toy, another feather in their cap regardless to if it is necesarry or not, and in this case i definately don't think it is necessary or an economic rebirth in the making. If Scranton wants rail service let a PRIVATE INCORPARATION or owner fund it and maintain it.

[DarkWolf]

Originally Posted by W-B proud

We are talking about the proposed passenger line here though right? i just do not see an economic rebirth coming on the tracks of a new railine. When I look at the overall picture minus that B.S. the supporting poloticians try to brainwash you to believe, I just don't see it. it will be a super expensive Marts bus on railroad tracks that all of NEPA and Pa. will be forced to pay for whether they want it or not, plus the ongoing subsidize, upkeep, repairs, wages, maintance. It's just not worth it. this is not a super congested city like Philly or New York, we simply don't need a train to " relieve congestion on the roads and highways" the very worst traffic jam of the year in NEPA, doesn't equal one average day in rush hour traffic on the Schuykill Expressway, or Cross Bronx Expressway, and even when there IS a "traffic jam" it is 99% of the time due to construction, not volume or congestion. We are a small metro area in the shadow of the Megolopolis. Money is tight everywhere, and i just think we should invest that money into reparing bridges, water lines, infrastructure instead of p*ssing in away on a project that will help Scranton with it's image, and make them feel more "big city" and modern.

Well all the cars and buses funnel back into NJ and clog up our highways....your in the Megapolis...

[W-B proud]

Originally Posted by Nexis4Jersey

Well all the cars and buses funnel back into NJ and clog up our highways....your in the Megapolis...

Yeah, we are technically in the Megalopolis, but if the Megalopolis were our solar system...we would be Pluto.

[Trucker7]

Originally Posted by Nexis4Jersey

Well all the cars and buses funnel back into NJ and clog up our highways....your in the Megapolis...

And why should we spend money to fix YOUR congestion? Has NJ considered the option of tolling I-80 within their borders? That might move more people to use the Martz bus and alleviate congestion on I-80 and is a lot cheaper than running this train.

[frank754]

From the NYC area, there's rail passenger service in every direction to cover the sprawl of commuters. To Connecticut, to Long Island, to the shore, to Philly, to Raritan, to Dover/Hackettstown, to Rockland/Orange, etc. Granted, most of the major traffic is within a 50 mile radius, and NEPA is a lot further. But you do have a lot of transplants and commuters, especially in the Stroudsburg/Pocono area where it seems like it's another extended suburb of NJ & the NYC area. as mentioned, it's a high growth area, where many Jerseyites flee to avoid the high property taxes and to get away from the sprawl. Aside from Connecticut, Long Island, and metro NJ, there's a huge population here, if you include (2006 census estimates) Luzerne (313,020), Lackawanna (209,728), Wyoming (28,093), Wayne (50,929), Pike (58,195), Monroe (165,685) and Carbon counties (62,567), that's an area of a good 888,000 people, all within the service area.
For an area that size to be without rail service seems very unusual, especially with the Mt Pocono vicinity (a central hotbed of transplants/commuters) being just 100 miles from Hoboken (and Scranton only 30 miles further). Back in 1961, when there still were several Scranton-Hoboken trains, the quickest was around 3 hrs 10 mins, with most more like 3 1/2 hrs, but the Poconos a bit over 1/2 hour less.

http://viewoftheblue.com/photography...s/EL102961.pdf

Aside the highways, which are already problematic, there's not much alternative, except maybe a flight to Newark. And PA has already tried to put tolls on 80, the Feds rejected it, I'm sure they wouldn't allow NJ to do that either.

[Delray Patty]

I for one Hope they get the train up and running...it's been a long time coming..I love trains, never mind how you won't get stuck in traffic or accidents like 80....NEPA needs the trains. As a child we
rode the train from Hoboken to upstate N.Y. to visit relatives, my parents never owned a car. for our
family it was wonderful. When I live in NEPA they were talking about the trains and so many of my neighbors were against it. I couldn't figure it out, all they spoke about was sprawl, drugs, gangs, etc.
Well guess what, the drugs and gangs came anyway with no help from trains....so now what's the problem with trains...Like I said when I spoke up at a township meeting one time, You will attract more
working class people with the trains. Like the money the N.Y. metro market pays, but they dont' want to raise their children there...I think it would have made a big difference.....Did Pa. get any money from the Government for this train service? maybe they could apply for the money that Gov. Scott from
Florida rejected.....

[Mr Yuk]

Originally Posted by Delray Patty

You will attract more
working class people with the trains. Like the money the N.Y. metro market pays, but they dont' want to raise their children there.......

Even so, it will drive up the cost of living in the area to NY levels. No thanks. For the once in a blue moon I may go to NY, I'm OK with driving or taking a bus.

I don't like the idea of $1,500 rent and $500,000 houses being the norm in Scranton/Wilkes-Barre.

[toobusytoday]

I can see that housing costs would go up at first if the area was immensely more accessible, but if the argument is that the bus is just as fast, (convenient and cheaper) doesn't that mean that those commuting people are already here and commuting? I've got to say that I personally would rather take a train then a bus, I just don't think it makes economic sense to bring in rail service when there are so many other things for the government to spend their money on.

But, back to the argument of trains making an area hugely popular, I would love to see a study that shows how commuter trains impact an area in this day and age. Not 50 years ago, but now. Last year our family went down to Roanoke, VA for my oldest son's College graduation. On the way back we stopped at some little town off of route 81 so my daughter could catch a train back to NYC, where she was living. The town looked pretty worn out, not a destination place at all. The same has been the case for towns I've seen in Vermont that have rail service. Maybe those are not good comparisons, because they're farther away from the big city's, but it made me think that train service does not always mean huge sprawling growth.

[DarkWolf]

Originally Posted by toobusytoday

I can see that housing costs would go up at first if the area was immensely more accessible, but if the argument is that the bus is just as fast, (convenient and cheaper) doesn't that mean that those commuting people are already here and commuting? I've got to say that I personally would rather take a train then a bus, I just don't think it makes economic sense to bring in rail service when there are so many other things for the government to spend their money on.

But, back to the argument of trains making an area hugely popular, I would love to see a study that shows how commuter trains impact an area in this day and age. Not 50 years ago, but now. Last year our family went down to Roanoke, VA for my oldest son's College graduation. On the way back we stopped at some little town off of route 81 so my daughter could catch a train back to NYC, where she was living. The town looked pretty worn out, not a destination place at all. The same has been the case for towns I've seen in Vermont that have rail service. Maybe those are not good comparisons, because they're farther away from the big city's, but it made me think that train service does not always mean huge sprawling growth.

I wonder why towns along the Main line in SEPA or towns along the Morristown line are doing very well. If the line connects into a city or large town , then the towns along tend to have growths. The towns you've visited down in Virgina and Vermont have Intercity Rail , which not what your getting here. Go visit Morristown , Media , New Brunswick , New Rochelle , Rahway , and The Amboys and then form an opinion on the affect Rail has on towns and small cities. Theres a huge push for it in SEPA mostly by towns and businesses , it must make economic sense to them. At the end of the day the Govt should be spending $$$ on this its , critical to the growth of your region....same with the Lehigh Valley line. NJ can not continue support all these road expansions , its starting to get really expensive. We have alot of Developments popping up along the states Railway towns , same is happening in SEPA , Massachusetts , Southern Connecticut and Maryland....its called Railway / Transit Orientated Development. New Jersey has had a statewide policy since 1993. PA could use a Statewide policy , that would clear the way for more developments along the Transitways and Railways in SEPA and this line.

[toobusytoday]

I'm familiar with the towns surrounding Philadelphia. My youngest son was born in Media, my oldest was born in Philadelphia. We lived in the Delaware Valley for a number of years. But, just because an area is doing well does not mean it's that way because of rail service. I notice you didn't mention Chester, Marcus Hook, or Ridley Park even though they are very close and all served by the same line that services Media via SEPTA. Heck, trains go to Camden. I don't really think that rail service is an indicator one way or another on good growth.