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Again you folks are defining wealth one-dimensionally, in this case obsessing over advances in telecommunication. Yes, we have cheap access to telecommunication. In order to accomplish this (and the 25% of global resources we consume as only 5% of the global population) we have to alienate population clusters who are sitting on the mineral resources required to mass produce these seemingly essential artifacts of living. As a result we displace masses of people, extort foreign governments with the use of IMF loans or foreign "aid", secure rights to said natural resources and mass-produce on labor who get paid below-subsistence wages for it, so that Jeniffer the suburban preppy white highschool girl can have an ipad mini. The fact timmy the welfare case can also get one is a simple byproduct of economies of scale, a trickle of living in the recipient country, not a measure of his personal affluence.....All this for the low low price of a global construct where in the same supposedly technologically advanced world 16,000 minors die of starvation EVERY DAY. So technology is not cheap, it costs 16,000 lives a day, before war mind you. It's just cheap to us. Extend that to the jewelry you pawned, the tomatoes you ate inside of your burger or bought at the walmart. All these items have a human tax, it's just one YOU didn't pay for. In actuality you too are paying the man, via the TRIAD of American unaffordability. You can't afford a mud hut or medical co-pays, but you have access 4G wifi so you think you're better off. The point is WHO CARES. Telecommunication is beer and circus.
Thence technological advancements are NOT a suitable metric with which to measure progress or even true affluence. Bangladeshis, Indians and Pakistanis live with an insanely high proportion of HIV amongst their poor, and these folks also have a huge amount of telecommunication access available to them. They may be green screen nokias instead of iphones, but they make our market look tiny. And they're dying of AIDS... Again, cheap computers does not equal progress nor affluence. It's a technology trap. The fundamental problems of human consumption unsustainability remain.
The poor are still pretty effed up in this Country. I wouldn't trade my position with any of them, and I'm a frugal anti-excess american-household-on-single-income-social-snickers-from-my-peers kinda guy. I wouldn't go calling them the architects of their own dispossession just because they have access to irrelevant cheap telecommunication.
I guess it's my engineering background shining through again.
Things like solar and renewables vs. fossil fuel and coal.
Awareness of the cause and effect relationships when it comes to Health.
Simple things like just about anyone can now have the world at their fingertips through the net.
I did read one book years ago called the Techno Peasant... and found it interesting... might have to read it again 30 years later to see how accurately it predicted the future...
I know a big point then was we would be out of oil in 20 to 30 years and that was 30 years ago.
In one way, technology has made many things affordable to those of modest means... remember when a basic computer and printer was 3k? Or a simple Texas Instrument Calculator over $100 and now they give them away...
My boss paid $1800 for a cell phone the size of a lunch box and now every teenager has one...
Just saying, it's not all doom and gloom.
exactly
people complain about smart phone plans but don't realize a smart phone plan is cheaper than a house phone bill was 20 years ago
the internet is an amazing tool and doesnt have to just be used for facebook updates
information and knowledge is so accessible now and it saves so much time which if you really are broke can be better used either working overtime or looking for a job
medicine is advancing at a rapid rate as well
almost all of the poorest people in the us right now live better than almost anyone else has in the history of the world
I guess I'm one that has a least one foot in last century...
Never lived in a house with cable... have rabbit ears for my Zenith TV... never owned a Smart Phone and don't have cell phone... right there I'm saving over 2k a year compared to what some of my friends pay...
I'm on my third computer... a $199 special... the old Win98 wasn't cutting it anymore and I still have my Apple //e
No computer or video games in this house either... just never had to have the latest or greatest of anything and content to wait until prices drop if it is something I need. Still don't get the flat screen craze... can honestly say my tenants own newer cars, have the latest smart phones and TV's, Cable or Dish then I do and that also goes for the jewelry department too.
Not too much choice with the computer because I need it for work... at least it's a work expense... all $199 of it.
My cars were well used and not abused... still have the $800 car I drove going to school... Did get a deal on my one and only new one and it was because I was working overseas at the time... it's 11 years old now.
I don't endorse the book the Millionaire Next Door other to say it does give a person reason to stop and think. Mostly, the people that made the fortunes don't live lavish lifestyles... they leave that to future generations.
Don't get me wrong... nothing against conspicuous consumption... it's great for the economy and I say better someone else's spending propping things up instead of my spending.
You can really live a frugal lifestyle with little effort... we must truly live in a rich country judging by what we throw away...
Not a day goes by without seeing some of my co-workers with a Starbucks in one hand and their smart phone in another... as long as they can pay for it... more power to them
what are you paying for your house phone each month?
you realize that in the long run an lcd tv will cost you a lot less than your piece of crap zenith bc the zenith uses so much electricity
Again you folks are defining wealth one-dimensionally, in this case obsessing over advances in telecommunication. Yes, we have cheap access to telecommunication. In order to accomplish this (and the 25% of global resources we consume as only 5% of the global population) we have to alienate population clusters who are sitting on the mineral resources required to mass produce these seemingly essential artifacts of living. As a result we displace masses of people, extort foreign governments with the use of IMF loans or foreign "aid", secure rights to said natural resources and mass-produce on labor who get paid below-subsistence wages for it, so that Jeniffer the suburban preppy white highschool girl can have an ipad mini. The fact timmy the welfare case can also get one is a simple byproduct of economies of scale, a trickle of living in the recipient country, not a measure of his personal affluence.....All this for the low low price of a global construct where in the same supposedly technologically advanced world 16,000 minors die of starvation EVERY DAY. So technology is not cheap, it costs 16,000 lives a day, before war mind you. It's just cheap to us. Extend that to the jewelry you pawned, the tomatoes you ate inside of your burger or bought at the walmart. All these items have a human tax, it's just one YOU didn't pay for. In actuality you too are paying the man, via the TRIAD of American unaffordability. You can't afford a mud hut or medical co-pays, but you have access 4G wifi so you think you're better off. The point is WHO CARES. Telecommunication is beer and circus.
Thence technological advancements are NOT a suitable metric with which to measure progress or even true affluence. Bangladeshis, Indians and Pakistanis live with an insanely high proportion of HIV amongst their poor, and these folks also have a huge amount of telecommunication access available to them. They may be green screen nokias instead of iphones, but they make our market look tiny. And they're dying of AIDS... Again, cheap computers does not equal progress nor affluence. It's a technology trap. The fundamental problems of human consumption unsustainability remain.
The poor are still pretty effed up in this Country. I wouldn't trade my position with any of them, and I'm a frugal anti-excess american-household-on-single-income-social-snickers-from-my-peers kinda guy. I wouldn't go calling them the architects of their own dispossession just because they have access to irrelevant cheap telecommunication.
The above sounds like it could have been written from some of my friends that were born in raised in Europe... the difference is they also acknowledge the technological advances in medicine alone have been unbelievable and that is especially true for the elderly in America. Most of my overseas friends are Doctors and Nurses.
While Europeans have access to care and for the young through the productive years that can be argued to be top rate... the access severly declines for those seasoned citizens unlike America where medicare is vastly superior.
I don't know what to say about Aids... are you saying those getting aids in these countries don't have the information or having the information does little to reduce the cases of Aids?
Taken to extremes... I venture to say just about everything is unsustainable given a large enough time frame.
I never thought of foreign aid as extortion...
Would eliminating foreign aid to poor countries be a good thing?
As to technology... my first car is a 1930 Model A Ford and my daily driver for decades was a 72 Plymouth... I still have a rotary phone and don't have a cell or tablet... appreciating the technology doesn't necessarily equate with the desire to own or possess...
Form follow function and necessity if the mother of all invention.
Please,for those complaining about housing costs,check out the Nj thread.
someone making 160,000 cant afford a 400,000 house.
thats the median price of a home in Nj.
See how the middle class are priced out of Jersey?
what are you paying for your house phone each month?
you realize that in the long run an lcd tv will cost you a lot less than your piece of crap zenith bc the zenith uses so much electricity
Phone and DSL run about $40 a month... my city adds an extra tax to these bills.
The Zenith is circa 1980... one of the last made in USA... at least is says made in USA.
I don't watch much TV... might be a benefit of having Rabbit Ears
My philosophy makes it hard to send something to a landfill/trash when there is nothing wrong with it and meets my needs... kind of getting rid of a car just because it's old or having to have the latest smart phone, etc...
I think I had the last pager in existence... where I live is a dead spot for cell phone coverage and work provided a pager that had no dead zones... small, compact and 100% reliable and cost $10 a month.
About two years ago we got the letter saying the paging service was being discontinued and that was that.
I would consider a cell if coverage were reliable... it is comical to see how frustrated neighbors get standing out in the street or walking up the hill just use their cells... one spent a lot of money on a mini tower that works sometimes and sometimes not...
My grandparents lived a very simply life on a small dairy farm... about 30 milk cows... they were healthy and fit into their 90's... never owned a car, still had the new tractor they bought in the 1950's... didn't have a phone till the 80's, baked their own bread, etc...
One year, the peach blight ruined the peach harvest... I brought a case of Del Monte peaches with me when I visited... didn't realize they didn't own a can opener Grandma did say the Del Monte peaches were almost as good as hers
Had friends come to spend a week with me once... they were in shock because my grandparents had no trash can... they had no garbage. When you put up your own preserves, there are no cans or wrappers to toss out... when you don't buy prepackaged goods... no plastic. All food scraps went to the pigs or chickens and paper products were mixed in with the kindling... My Grandfather saved all the Del Monte cans for his workshop. No waste, no mess and they lived in a nice cinder-block/stucco home they had built themselves
The older I get... the more I can appreciated the good life they had made for themselves. They needed very little money, worked hard, 7 days a week as anyone knows that has milk cows... yet they were happy, content and healthy.
Please,for those complaining about housing costs,check out the Nj thread.
someone making 160,000 cant afford a 400,000 house.
thats the median price of a home in Nj.
See how the middle class are priced out of Jersey?
They are doing something wrong...
Most likely they have too many obligations and little savings.
The 'whole country' seems to be driving a brand new 50k SUV and i consistently say "how do people do it".
I know a guy who makes at least 75k per year, he lives like a hermit, has no wife, no GF, no kids, no pets and he's basically living paycheck to paycheck.
I walk around Whole (paycheck) Foods and the place is jam packed, how can average joe's afford to fill up a shopping cart at this place?
I consider myself a fairly smart person, but when it comes to 'how people do it' i feel like a 3rd grader, i got nothin when it comes to understanding how people do this.
I feel the same way, esp. about Whole Paycheck. I went there a couple weeks ago with a gift card and was APPALLED at the prices. And by the fact that it was jam packed. All I could think was 'where are all these people getting all this money???"
what are you paying for your house phone each month?
you realize that in the long run an lcd tv will cost you a lot less than your piece of crap zenith bc the zenith uses so much electricity
But the quality goes in before the name goes on. (TM)
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Grandma did say the Del Monte peaches were almost as good as hers 
