Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
I was skinny as a rail in middle school and early high school. A strong wind could have blown me away. Couldn't have asked for an easier target than me. You know what? I was never bullied. I was never harrassed. It's because I didn't act vulnerable. I didn't invite scrutiny. And if for some odd reason someone was out of line, I spoke up, instead of cowering. I had personal fortitude....almost like I didn't even know I was a twig that could be easily pushed around.
By the end of 10th grade, I was 6'2" 185lbs. Not exacty a small guy anymore. I'm pretty sure there were a few people walking the halls that were glad they didn't bully me. I would have exacted revenge and smacked them around.
The point? It's all about who you are and how you carry yourself. Every bully on the planet knows that a person who fights back is the person that won't get bullied. It's human nature.
I stand by my original statements: Scientists should study the link between homosexuality and the lack of personal and psychological fortitude. I'm convinced there is a connection.
There certainly might be a connection. It's not, however, in any way innate to homosexuals.
Our society demonizes, torments and abuses gay youth. Gay youth are told every single day that they are wrong, inherently immoral, evil, and that need to change - they hear it at church, from their parents, from their friends, at school - everywhere. And nearly all gay youth feel that can't talk about it with anyone lest they be rejected and hated by the ones they love - a legitimate fear sometimes. I've counseled gay teenagers before - I've met more than one 14 year old who was thrown out of the house at gunpoint when found out as gay. I've also known a few gay people who did come out of the closet at 13, 14, or 15 (back in the 1990s). Life at school was a living hell for them.
Imagine being a gay 11 or 12 year old (especially prior to the 2000s or the 2010s). Imagine how much shame and self-hatred you'd internalize. Now imagine doing that every single day for a decade. Humans, let alone teens and preteens, aren't very well equipped to deal with that. It leads many gay youth to self-destructive behaviors such as drug and alcohol abuse, promiscuous sex, and suicidal thoughts.
If you talk to any gay person (especially one born pre-1990s) who will speak to you honestly, they'll tell they considered suicide at one point in their youth. I knew I was gay at 10. From 10-17 the last thought I had before going to bed every night was a wish that I'd wake up "normal", and I was devastated every morning when nothing had changed. My primary concern for 7 years of my childhood was making sure nobody ever discovered that I was gay. And for 7 years I didn't tell a single person - not a parent, not my brothers or sister, not a single one of my friends. Finally, at 17 when I was off at college half-way across the country from anybody I knew, I just couldn't take it anymore. I had to either come out, stop denying my humanity, and live openly and honestly as myself, or I had to kill myself. I seriously considered killing myself, and had it not been for a few concerned people, I very well might have.
So yeah, their might be a connection between homosexuality and "physiological fortitude", but it's not a causal connection. It's a connection born from abuse. If you raised heterosexual youth in the same environment of shame, demonization, torment, and out right hatred, the same connection would trouble the heterosexual community.
Last edited by hammertime33; 07-11-2011 at 11:52 AM..
Please don't put words in my mouth. That's all i'll say to the bolded statement.
I believe you missed my point. I have no problem with a person coming out of the closet. But they should know the reality of that decision, and be comfortable enough with themselves to stand up and stand proud. Otherwise it just doesn't sound like a good decision if that person does not have the psychological wherewithal to deal with the burden. Society sucks sometimes...but is suicide the remedy? Wouldn't the closet have been a better place for these troubled teens? At least until after high school? The answer is not ideal, but it seems obvious to me.
Well, first of all, I was actually responding to 20 Yrs in Branson's post, not yours.
Also, the OPs story is referring to a kid that was outed against his will. He did not come out of the closet willingly. Is that child worthy of your compassion?
[quote=PITTSTON2SARASOTA;19945830] Unfortunately we will now never know what he may have contributed to our country because he never reached maturity and is now dead.
QUOTE]
Honestly did you read your own link because he took an overdose of meds and he lived Most people doing this are just out for attention and never really mean to kill themselves.
Unfortunately we will now never know what he may have contributed to our country because he never reached maturity and is now dead.
QUOTE]
Honestly did you read your own link because he took an overdose of meds and he lived Most people doing this are just out for attention and never really mean to kill themselves.
wow... Agenda driven drive by thread is all this is. I can't believe all the homosexuals that didn't even read this, they just let their emotions run wild with NO facts. That is so damn typical. I wonder how many other "issues" they do this with too just to try and crowbar in their agenda.
Well, first of all, I was actually responding to 20 Yrs in Branson's post, not yours.
Also, the OPs story is referring to a kid that was outed against his will. He did not come out of the closet willingly. Is that child worthy of your compassion?
The OP is heart-wrenching, but he's one of millions of gay teens. He was outed against his own free-will, yes, but I believe that those who are considering coming out of the closet during the formative years (high school) are playing Russian Roulette. Why take a chance now and subject yourself to something that you don't even know if you can handle? And then possibly kill yourself over it? Doesn't make a lot of sense to me. Either you're strong enough to handle the stress of being gay in high school, or you're not. If it's questionable, then the better solution is to stay in the closet until after high school. As I said before...society sucks sometimes and its not ideal....but suicide should never be the remedy.
So because a person isn't gay they cannot speak about how it feels to be bullied? Is gay bullying worse than bullying a "fat kid", a kid that is unattractive, or just bullying someone for the heck of it? Is society telling fat girls that they are ugly and need to lose weight, somehow "nicer" than society telling homosexuals that they are not normal and need to engage in straight activities?
Most people have been bullied. Have been mistreated.
I am a minority in many ways, and I have been mistreated based on that. Members of my family have as well--much worse than me in fact. But to say that this mistreatment/discrimination that led to this teen's suicide is society's fault isn't putting the "blame" in the right area. There are thousands of teens that commit suicide, not all of them are gay. The reasons for committing suicide vary.
This teens reason was because he was gay and felt unaccepted. Another teen's reason could be because he felt his life was horrible. Both situations are horrible. But every gay teen is not committing suicide, just as every teen that feels that their life is horrible is not committing suicide.
As I said before, in the past--minority groups that were oppressed, mistreated, and discriminated/bullied against, did they too kill themselves because of this? Or is suicide merely an action taken by those that are already severely depressed, and hopeless--no matter their sexuality, race, and so on.
And because bullying occurs for all kinds of 'reasons', you think bullying is "Okay"? Because I think that was the point, that bullying is NOT 'okay', no matter why it happens. Yes, some kids can deal with being bullied; the point is that not all of them can. And, yes, I would say that severe depression can cause one to contemplate suicide. So we need to look at the causes of that depression. And one of those causes is bullying and living in a society where too many people agree with the bullies.
I made it through 6 pages of posts before I had to type something so if this has been said in pages 7-11 I apologize.
Kids are cruel. Bottom line. Kids are effing cruel. I was teased and bullied all through elementary/middle/high school. I made it through ok...but mainly because I wasn't teased or bullied to the extent that the kid in the OP's story was/is. Being teased for being fat/ugly/nerdy/poor/etc. IMHO is cake compared to what a gay/lesbian teen has to endure through highschool. I was teased...sure. But I never heard another kid say that they were going to kill me because I was the way I was. Lets just keep this in mind when you go to type that "well were were all teased in school so whats the big deal". Teasing is one thing, being threatened and fearful for your life is another.
Unfortunately we will now never know what he may have contributed to our country because he never reached maturity and is now dead.
Honestly did you read your own link because he took an overdose of meds and he lived Most people doing this are just out for attention and never really mean to kill themselves.
Nobody knows you are a devil worshiper until you tell them. Nobody knows you have had an abortion unless you tell them. Nobody knows that your sister is married to a black man unless you tell them. Nobody knows you beat your children unless you tell them.
If homosexual people don't want to be ostracized, criticized, and traumatized by their lifestyle choices, then they need to keep their mouth shut.
20yrsinBranson
IOW, if you stayed in the closet, you wouldn't be bullied? That's pure BS. How about the teenaged boy who simply has a higher voice than his classmates? Should he simply refuse to talk while at school so his classmates won't think he's gay?
The following suicide note was written by Steven, a 16-year-old high school student who happens to be gay. After he wrote this note he attempted suicide by taking an overdose of medication.
He survived.
He was hospitalized, treated, and not long after his suicide attempt, moved with his family to another state. . . ."
1) This is a story about a failed suicide attempt. I think that ALL suicide is a tragic loss that could have been avoided. Many survivors of suicide attempts go on to live fulfilling lives and are very happy to be alive. Living and getting the help that they need are the keys. I hope that the boy in the article is receiving help and that he will eventually be happy.
2) Suicide is the third leading cause of accidental death among youth--under twenty-five. It is tragic and is often linked to bullying.
"One suicide occurs every 15 minutes [in the US]; almost 100 suicides a day.
More than a million people attempt to take their own lives each year." <U.S. Department of Health and Human Services, Sept. 14, 2010>
3) Promote anti-bullying policies in schools. These policies help reduce ALL types of bullying and make it a punishable offense to witness or even suspect bullying and NOT report it. If we teach the children, eventually society will be more compassionate. Some schools do a good job of teaching and enforcing these policies.
4) I agree with promoting awareness, education, and prevention: suicide rates ARE a MAJOR cause for concern. Teaching acceptance and compassion will help our world become a kinder place. Statically speaking, several factors increase the risk for suicide attempts: being poor, socially isolated, young (15-19), thin, drug abusing, white, gay, male, having emotional issues (depression), having psychological disorders, having access to guns, living in Alaska, the current season being winter--especially Christmas season.
These are NOT CAUSES. They are ONLY conditions that are shown to have a correlation to higher suicide rates. Knowing these allows us to be mindful of specific populations, which might need more interventions.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Most people doing this are just out for attention and never really mean to kill themselves. 
teaching and enforcing anti-bullying in schools can help the world to become more compassionate
