Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
George Zimmerman did want to know who the non-resident was, I think he did make the attempt to talk with Trayvon, but as stated Trayvon ran off.
Later after GZ got off the phone on the way back to the car it was stated by GZ that Trayvon came back and attacked him.
The investigating officers for the prosecution said under oath that there was no evidence that George stalked Trayvon or started the fight.
The officer did concur eventually that GZ's wounds were consistant with his testimony.
At this point you only have GZ's word that he was on his way back to his car and Trayvon attacked him. The State investigator said they did not know who started the fight. That means they don't know if what Zimmerman is saying is true. The is a BIG difference between "We have no evidence that Zimmerman started the fight" and "We don't know WHO started the fight." They don't know. That doesn't mean they do know that Zimmerman did NOT start the fight.
Can you tell me fairly close the exact statement the investigator made concerning Zimmerman's wounds? I think you're missing subtleties in the testimony. Hearing is pretty subjective, and most of us hear what we want to hear.
Better yet, is there a video out there of the hearing? I'd really like to listen to the testimony if you know where I can find that.
There are a lot of ifs in that scenario. It would not be unusual to have "deuling experts"...however, the background of each expert would be covered, and one may be better than the other. Another reality is that juries tend to go with "scientists"....technical experts above eye witnesses. Too many people watch CSI programs and they have caused problems for usually the prosecution. If in this case the prosecution has a forensic expert, it would be to their advantage, ESPECIALLY if they can discredit the eye witness' testimony.
As for the eye witness who says Zimmerman was screaming for help, well, there may also be another eye witness who says the opposite. Again, we don't know who all the witnesses are yet. As for GZ's brother's explanation, who could that information have come from other than GZ? Would GZ have any reason to say there was a struggle for the gun? Self-serving come to mind?
Also, the state knows all of these things we are talking about, and if they did not have anything to counter them, there would have been no charges against Zimmerman.
Most complicated trials have "dueling experts".....it's very common.
There are "ifs" all over the place in this fora LOL...
Yes, I agree CSI shows have created havoc for the prosecutors...
No, self-serving does not come to mind, more like, that's a possibility. When all the documents are released the police reports will reveal GZ's original statement, of course he could be lying, usually when a person lies the story changes/evolves in an attempt to fit the evidence, we may see this in his 3-5 statements or we may see that his statements remained consistent throughout...It's difficult to keep a story straight when it's a lie...
As far as the state filing charges on flimsy evidence...it wouldn't be the first time IMHO...
Is this suggesting that the victim is responsible for his own death, even though the whole thing was started by someone much older following him?
Is that sort of like blaming a woman for being raped because of the type of clothes she was wearing?
it is nothing like that, and i don't know how you got that out of my question. i am just asking why, when you have a cell phone already in your hand and if you feel threatened, wouldn't you call the police?
the truth is none of us know yet what actually happened. the only fact we know is that GZ saw himself as the neighborhood "watchperson" and called or followed people over 40 times previously-all kinds of people over all kinds of things.
none of those resulted in a death, so obviously something was different about this one-but we will have to wait and see exactly what happened. i don't pretend to know whether GZ chased TM down, or TM went up to GZ to confront him for following him, or who was on top during the fight beating whom.
i also find it interesting that the media has a short attention span when a white person is assaulted or killed by a black person because it doesn't fit the agenda.
The autopsy report will give teh exact height and weight of Trayvon at the time of death. I think those things will be an issue.
Though weight and height may be relevant, the jury instructions take more into account ---
[SIZE=3]"In considering the issue of self-defense, you may take into account the relative physical abilities and capacities of the defendant and victim."
[/SIZE]I think that's because we all know there's more to height and weight in who has the advantage--- does either have a health ailment; formal combat training; age difference;, and other factors.
There are "ifs" all over the place in this fora LOL...
Yes, I agree CSI shows have created havoc for the prosecutors...
No, self-serving does not come to mind, more like, that's a possibility. When all the documents are released the police reports will reveal GZ's original statement, of course he could be lying, usually when a person lies the story changes/evolves in an attempt to fit the evidence, we may see this in his 3-5 statements or we may see that his statements remained consistent throughout...It's difficult to keep a story straight when it's a lie...
As far as the state filing charges on flimsy evidence...it wouldn't be the first time IMHO...
Agree, the state does file on flimsy evidence. Just seems in such a high profile case it would be foolish, unless the real goal is to get a guilty plea to a lesser charge.
As for that gun thing, if two people were struggling for a gun, wouldn't you think it would be more likely and reasonable that the gun went off accidentally? I mean if you're struggling to hold onto a gun, how could you take aim an shoot, how would you know that the gun wouldn't get turned around at the moment you fired and shoot you instead of your opponent? Did Zimmerman think about that and decide he had a better chance using stand your ground than saying that it accidentally went off?
Why did that original officer at the scene say he didn't buy Zimmerman's story and thought he should be charged with manslaughter? At some point that officer's police report will be released and it will be interesting to see what he says Zimmerman told him.
Though weight and height may be relevant, the jury instructions take more into account ---
[SIZE=3]"In considering the issue of self-defense, you may take into account the relative physical abilities and capacities of the defendant and victim."
[/SIZE]I think that's because we all know there's more to height and weight in who has the advantage--- does either have a health ailment; formal combat training; age difference;, and other factors.
I totally agree and I think that is something which will be explored by both sides and addressed at the trial or immunity hearing.
According to the In-Take Sheet (found in the court file) at the time of his arrest, April 12, Zimmerman was 5'8" tall and weighed 185 lbs. Of course, we don't know the exact weight on Feb. 26th. And as someone else pointed out, the extra "weight" of carrying a gun.
Travon is taller with a longer reach. If Zimmerman does not know how to fight, he would be no match for Trayvon. Trayvon would steady wail on him from a distance. The only way Zimmerman could stop him is lunging in to tackle him or something
This is really all semantics and will have little bearing on the case.
if TM would be "freaked out" why wouldn't HE call the police? (maybe he did, but i just haven't heard that yet).
he had a cell phone and he was talking to his girlfriend, so he could have called the police and said that someone was bothering/following him. i think most women would call the police, but maybe men are more willing to get into a confrontation/"handle it".
Bingo. He wasn't scared but mad at getting caught. He lived a few feet away he could have easily avoided Zimmerman. That's the only logical explanation for is violent response.
it is nothing like that, and i don't know how you got that out of my question. i am just asking why, when you have a cell phone already in your hand and if you feel threatened, wouldn't you call the police?
the truth is none of us know yet what actually happened. the only fact we know is that GZ saw himself as the neighborhood "watchperson" and called or followed people over 40 times previously-all kinds of people over all kinds of things.
none of those resulted in a death, so obviously something was different about this one-but we will have to wait and see exactly what happened. i don't pretend to know whether GZ chased TM down, or TM went up to GZ to confront him for following him, or who was on top during the fight beating whom.
i also find it interesting that the media has a short attention span when a white person is assaulted or killed by a black person because it doesn't fit the agenda.
I've read that Trayvon was talking on his cell phone to a friend, and the friend has said that all of a sudden it sounded like the phone was thrown and the call was ended. So, MAYBE he didn't have the cell phone in his hand long enough to call the police. Maybe he was walking along, talking to his friend, telling her someone was following him, and then there was no time left to DIAL 911. And maybe, as someone else pointed out, he didn't think the police would help him out. We don't know, so it seems silly to speculate as to why he didn't call now that he is dead.
Are you kidding me about a black person killing a white person not getting attention?
As far as the details of the evidence in the Zimmerman case, you are right, NONE OF US knows what those are at this point. All we have is some information put out there by the media, the court file, and speculation. Discovery has not even begun yet, so we don't know how much or what specific evidence the State has. After April 27th, we may know more. For certain the defense will know more.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Just seems in such a high profile case it would be foolish, unless the real goal is to get a guilty plea to a lesser charge. 
Did Zimmerman think about that and decide he had a better chance using stand your ground than saying that it accidentally went off? 