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The tax rates in the US are the lowest in history. Even with the higher corporate tax, there are so many god damn loopholes in the tax policy that NO corporation actually pays that marginal tax rate. Theoretically, the economy should be booming right now, no? Instead, we've lost 8 million jobs since the Bush Tax Cuts went to effect (I won't even get into the draconian Reagan tax cuts). This is despite all of the infrastructure we've built with a 70-90% tax rates, that still must be maintained. Of course, grandma won't go for the government cutting the SS/Medicare she paid for. Soccer Mom/Soccer Dad in their McMansions won't go for the government removing their highway they use to commute to work. We certainly can't just decide not to support our war veterans who fought for our freedoms.
Free Trade = No government regulation of international trade conducted by corporation. That's why millions of jobs have been sucked out of our country and have re-established themselves in formerly 3rd world countries. As a result, now that Americans have to complete with them for work, their wages continue to go down. There are jobs today that paid $12/hr in 1986 that still pay $12/hr today, despite inflation. All Americans should be upset and rioting in the streets that we allowed a handful offolks at teh top bribe our politicians into dragging down our standard of living.
The number of illegal aliens in the US has increased by 750,000 in 1970 to 11 million now. This is because the government decided that we should instead invest our time and energy in the faux-war against communism in the middle east, and that those poor illegal immigrants deserve a taste of the American dream too without having to go through the legal process like everyone else. Now, as a result of allowing these illegals aliens to just flood in, natural-born and legal American immigrants must now compete with them for jobs, as they will accept making $2-$3/hr, since they don't have an SS number and as a result (just like with unregulated trade) don't have to pay taxes.
The New Deal's WPA, which became CETA, was put on life support by Reagan when he first entered office and was abolished by Clinton completely. This program was something young teens and young adults could turn to if they wanted to gain some work experience during the economic crisis in the 1970s, and still earn respectable wages.
Precisely.
We've given the monolithic, all-powerful corporations EVERYTHING - low taxes with loopholes, endless "tax deals," no accountability when they destroy a market or economy in their greed, "free-trade" deals with every nation under the sun, and so on.
And what have they give us in turn? A broken economy, massive off-shoring of jobs, illegals flooding the nation and taking away the lower-end work, crooked markets everywhere, run-away unemployment, and shattered promises and dreams.
At some point, people are going to have to wake up and realize a few things:
1) American businesses are not all run by "nice men and women who are just trying to make an honest dollar." Oh, sure, many of them are, especially among small businesses, but the crazy notion that being a businessman somehow makes you honest and your motives pure (because "business exists to make a profit") is crazy. People all have the same flaws, and giving them power and money brings out the worst in them. This is true in government (which some love to bash) and business - there is no difference.
2) You cannot negotiate with sociopaths. Many "captains of industry" will not be happy until they own everything and everyone, and they don't care how they achieve that goal. Until then, they will lie, cheat, and steal - gutting whole countries to give themselves bigger bonuses. Even if the majority are not like this, it only takes a small, powerful minority, such as the banking sector, to crash an economy. Robbing a bank with a gun and robbing a nation with a bank are both crimes and should be treated as such.
3) People have no choice but to participate in this economy. Some have said, "oh, well - just start your own business!" or "you don't have to consume." The second statement is absurd - try living on the streets without eating and let me know how it works out, and the first ignores so many aspects of reality (start-up costs needed for small businesses, failure rates, skills needed, etc.) that is barely worth mentioning except as a small, secondary source of income. While Marxism has MANY flaws, and I don't support it, Marx was right about one thing - in a capitalist society, all people have to offer is their labor. If companies don't care or can find cheaper, slave labor elsewhere (thanks to "Free trade"), the citizens are in a lot of trouble without too many options.
Stuff to think about.
Last edited by Rambler123; 08-14-2012 at 08:15 AM..
Marxism is mathematically impossible. As simple as that. We can argue economy or politics but we can't argue with math. It is what it is. It has also been tried and false over almost a century and it brought nothing but poverty and stagnation and death. Look up the history of USSR, China and North Korea.
Marxism is mathematically impossible. As simple as that. We can argue economy or politics but we can't argue with math. It is what it is. It has also been tried and false over almost a century and it brought nothing but poverty and stagnation and death. Look up the history of USSR, China and North Korea.
Okay... if you read what I wrote, you'd notice a couple of things:
1) I flat-out said I do not support Marxism. All I said was that Marx is correct in stating that in an industrialized, capitalist society, workers have only their labor to offer, which is true... I suppose the very wealthy also have investment money, but that only applies to a small percentage of the population.
2) The rest of my post didn't support Marxism, either. All I am calling for is accountability from all parties - including corporations - and recognition of the fact that doing something to "make money" or "in the interest of the corporation" is not a justification for doing whatever one wishes, regardless of the damage it causes.
I don't see how anyone can disagree with these statements... though disagreeing with what one *thinks* I said is sure a lot easier...
The tax rates in the US are the lowest in history. Even with the higher corporate tax, there are so many god damn loopholes in the tax policy that NO corporation actually pays that marginal tax rate. Theoretically, the economy should be booming right now, no? Instead, we've lost 8 million jobs since the Bush Tax Cuts went to effect (I won't even get into the draconian Reagan tax cuts). This is despite all of the infrastructure we've built with a 70-90% tax rates, that still must be maintained. Of course, grandma won't go for the government cutting the SS/Medicare she paid for. Soccer Mom/Soccer Dad in their McMansions won't go for the government removing their highway they use to commute to work. We certainly can't just decide not to support our war veterans who fought for our freedoms.
Free Trade = No government regulation of international trade conducted by corporation. That's why millions of jobs have been sucked out of our country and have re-established themselves in formerly 3rd world countries. As a result, now that Americans have to complete with them for work, their wages continue to go down. There are jobs today that paid $12/hr in 1986 that still pay $12/hr today, despite inflation. All Americans should be upset and rioting in the streets that we allowed a handful offolks at teh top bribe our politicians into dragging down our standard of living.
The number of illegal aliens in the US has increased by 750,000 in 1970 to 11 million now. This is because the government decided that we should instead invest our time and energy in the faux-war against communism in the middle east, and that those poor illegal immigrants deserve a taste of the American dream too without having to go through the legal process like everyone else. Now, as a result of allowing these illegals aliens to just flood in, natural-born and legal American immigrants must now compete with them for jobs, as they will accept making $2-$3/hr, since they don't have an SS number and as a result (just like with unregulated trade) don't have to pay taxes.
The New Deal's WPA, which became CETA, was put on life support by Reagan when he first entered office and was abolished by Clinton completely. This program was something young teens and young adults could turn to if they wanted to gain some work experience during the economic crisis in the 1970s, and still earn respectable wages.
Tax, you may argue the tax is low in USA but it's not fair. It disproportionally targets the rich, meaning the rich pays majority of the income tax while the bottom 50% pays next to nothing. You may argue that percentage wise, the rich doesn't pay as much but I have to argue, is the rich's $ any different from the poor? If the 10% a rich guy is paying is $100,000 while a 50% tax from a poor person only amounts to $500, who contributes more to the society?
The tax needs to be changed to consumption based tax in coupled with a flat rate income tax, similar to that 999 plan. Then nobody needs to argue what's fair or not fair.
You also need to know, regardless what you say about the rich, they don't have much influence as what you portrayed. It is reflected in that majority of the federal budget is going to the poor. Yes, look it up yourself.
Free Trade: the world has become flat. You are complaining about $8 or $12 an hour pay? Hey, you know what? How about $0 an hour for you and the big corporation you hate will gladly shift their work overseas where the workers only need $8 a day.
We aren't competing with ourselves anymore (Illegal immigrants also took a big bites out of our pie); we are competing globally nowadays.
Business will go where it is easy to conduct business. USA until recently is still the best place to conduct business: stable political environment, well trained workers and land of law (what's left of it at least).
You want jobs? You may want to drop your hatred against big companies and find ways to help them stay here. Look at France. They elected some president who wants to jack up the tax rate to 75% on rich people, guess what, the next thing will be the rich closing down all their companies and move to a better place... like UK. :-)
[quote=313Weather;25624620]A couple of other FYIs for you to ponder on...
The tax rates in the US are the lowest in history. Even with the higher corporate tax, there are so many god damn loopholes in the tax policy that NO corporation actually pays that marginal tax rate. Theoretically, the economy should be booming right now, no? Instead, we've lost 8 million jobs since the Bush Tax Cuts went to effect (I won't even get into the draconian Reagan tax cuts). This is despite all of the infrastructure we've built with a 70-90% tax rates, that still must be maintained. Of course, grandma won't go for the government cutting the SS/Medicare she paid for. Soccer Mom/Soccer Dad in their McMansions won't go for the government removing their highway they use to commute to work. We certainly can't just decide not to support our war veterans who fought for our freedoms.
Is it the tax rates or spending rates? Spending, size and scope of government has increased with no logical justification. We have become more efficient with the use of various technology, but still the size and spending of local, state and federal government grows. Where is the demand from the markets for bigger government spending and bigger government? There is none.
The reason you have a nice-sized home in the suburbs, are working in a safe/clean environment with fair wages working reasonable hours, your children can get an education for (practically) free, you can call the police/fire/ambulance for (practically) free, you can drive those highways to nowhere to your job, you have a safety net when you fall on hard times, etc. is a result of liberal policies.
You and others should try familiarizing yourselves with the history of this country.
An education for "practically free" and police/fire/ambulance for "practically free?"
Says someone who obviously has never paid property taxes in his/her life.
In other words, you have no freakng clue what you're talking about, so please stop pretending you do.
The film is 1:44 minutes long but you really only have to watch up until the 36 minute mark when the q and a portion starts. So anyway, he goes through the time line of the American economy starting from the late 19th century and explains why government deregulation has allowed corporations to run wild. He even points out the specific problem and offers a solution. After watching this video, you truly begin to understand why people had more buying power in the past than today and it tackles the problem that everyone makes excuses for.
Here is the link to the video.
wrong
the reason is not capitolism...but the GOVERNMENT
who pushed for nafta and all the other freetrade...the globalist governmet politicians....million of job out scourced
who push for OVER regulation of housing and FORCING banks to easy standards of lending...the government...the result a housing bubble that bust
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