Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
The doctors and engineers ARE the one's with the $100,000+ in student loans. Do you think graduate school or medical school are free? The idea that every indebted college graduate is a slacker liberal arts major is just laughable. And even if that was true, outside of trades, you basically need a bachelors degree to get in the door for anything beyond basic service jobs.
The doctors and engineers with school loans will have them repaid in a few years. It is the slacker liberal arts majors complaining about their loans because they went to a boutique school chasing their dreams and now work at Starbucks. Hard to repay that loan when you make $20K per year.
The doctors and engineers ARE the one's with the $100,000+ in student loans. Do you think graduate school or medical school are free? The idea that every indebted college graduate is a slacker liberal arts major is just laughable. And even if that was true, outside of trades, you basically need a bachelors degree to get in the door for anything beyond basic service jobs.
Engineers only need a Bachelor's degree. Their pay comes with field experience. I don't know any engineer with $100,000+ in student loans.
I agree with the general sentiment that some express here about Republicans. They are almost as intrusive on our freedom as Democrats. Just in different ways.
But the OP's original post is still a valid one. It is just another example of a politician's attempt to insulate us from anything he deems "bad." Are we such wimps that we can't see that free speech sometimes presents us with stuff we don't like? I think beauty pageants are stupid. So I don't watch them. Colleges don't need to restrict the free speech that occurs on campus.
I agree with the general sentiment that some express here about Republicans. They are almost as intrusive on our freedom as Democrats. Just in different ways.
But the OP's original post is still a valid one. It is just another example of a politician's attempt to insulate us from anything he deems "bad." Are we such wimps that we can't see that free speech sometimes presents us with stuff we don't like? I think beauty pageants are stupid. So I don't watch them. Colleges don't need to restrict the free speech that occurs on campus.
The question is... do you value a functioning society or a completely "free" society? The type of society proposed by the right-libertarians is dysfunctional anarchy. Left-libertarians like myself align closer to Democrats; freedom from government in social issues but government regulation of capitalism.
The question is... do you value a functioning society or a completely "free" society? The type of society proposed by the right-libertarians is dysfunctional anarchy. Left-libertarians like myself align closer to Democrats; freedom from government in social issues but government regulation of capitalism.
None of these choices are binary, are they? Dems often intrude on social issues too. They want to regulate speech as per the OP. The concept of hate speech is just invalid. They want to regulate food choice as per Bloomberg. They are strongly anti-smoking, but seemingly accepting of obesity (fat acceptance movement).
The question is... do you value a functioning society or a completely "free" society? The type of society proposed by the right-libertarians is dysfunctional anarchy. Left-libertarians like myself align closer to Democrats; freedom from government in social issues but government regulation of capitalism.
The application of aggressive force, what you are advocating for "society to function", as a core component of society is by definition dysfunctional; a society functions for each person in it by virtue of people peacefully interacting with each other for some determined mutual benefit. This functions for all parties involved, whereas aggressive force by definition only functions for one party involved, the most physically powerful who can subjugate other people to his will; that is the barbarous law of the jungle, not the civilized law of the free man. How anyone can advocate for such a hideous subjugation as opposed to mutual benefit and call the former a functional society and the latter a dysfunctional society is beyond me.
A free society is functional for all its members; an unfree society is dysfunctional for the common man, functioning only for the powerful. Pure and equal freedom when enforced as the law levels the interactions between people, thereby creating a functional society for everyone.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Mon
The doctors and engineers ARE the one's with the $100,000+ in student loans. Do you think graduate school or medical school are free? The idea that every indebted college graduate is a slacker liberal arts major is just laughable. And even if that was true, outside of trades, you basically need a bachelors degree to get in the door for anything beyond basic service jobs.
The above is why the trades are being recommended a lot more often than they used to be. The entire education system is dysfunctional, though, when people are expected to go to a no-tuition school for 13 years and then have to take out thousands of dollars in debt to go to another school designed for pure education for 4 additional years to get what amounts to career training at best or an admission slip at worst. Aside from the obvious musings about why college degrees should be required for these jobs in the first place, it also makes me wonder why we put students through 13 years of education when what really counts is the 2-6 years they complete afterwards.
Just think - it's hardly unusual now to send people to two years of pre-kindergarten and/or get a master's degree. That means it's hardly unusual for people nowadays to spend 17 years in the education system. Considering what they know at the end of those 17 years is at roughly the same level as the college graduate students of yore knew with far fewer years of formal education, I question the value of putting people through 13-15 years of formal education before they even get to college. Americans don't seem to be getting much value out of this ponderous stretch of time they have institutionalized.
I also find it interesting that in this thread the vast majority seemed to burn out in grades 5-9, 6-10 years into formal K-12-type schooling for most people. Finland, a country with some of the mentally healthiest and best-performing students in the world, mandates only 9 years of schooling, with the vast majority electing for another 3 years on an academic or vocational track. The overwhelming majority of Americans report far better experiences in college than in high school, and it's unusual for one to spend more than 4-8 years in college. Based on these patterns I think it's possible that most people's limit for a formal schooling program is 6-10 years. I'm off to the education forum to chew on that thought...
No, the answer is that we need more engineering students or we will having to keep importing them from other countries. Somewhere around 25% Engineering students during the 80's, now its down to 6%.
All of the jobs that didn't require an education are going away, or are considered "demeaning" or "undervalued". Well life isn't fair. Not all of us are going to make it. Not everyone can graduate college and do whatever they want to do for the rest of their lives.
We need nurses, doctors, engineers, and special scientific fields.
We actually have to many lawyers right now, the field is saturated.
The answer is, when you talk to someone about your future and where you can go with your life, not everyone is meant to go to college. Thats the real answer.
Exactly right, there are a few groups working to change that but sadly most "educators" today aren't on board with it.
PROFOUNDLY DISCONNECTED?
* A trillion dollars in student loans.
* Record high unemployment.
* Three million good jobs that no one seems to want.
The goal of Profoundly Disconnected is to challenge the absurd belief that a four-year degree is the only path to success. The Skills Gap is here, and if we don’t close it, it’ll swallow us all.
Old washed up baby boomer’s and millennials, why do you feel that it's the governments job to wipe your azz for you? why you let the fringe left wing media give you your opinions? why do you support people who raise taxes on the working middle class when we have record un-employment, disastrous policy decisions on health care and ignore our own people when they are being killed by terrorists? Why do you continue to listen to the left wing battle cry "tax the rich tax the rich" when it has shown to destroy economies? Why do you feel we need more government in our lives?
In short, you should be asking yourself, why you voted for these losers over and over and have not gotten anywhere. Why did you fall for the "lets transform America" and "hope and change" thing?
Are you that much of a "low information voter" that you will let anyone scam you?
Quote:
Originally Posted by remoddahouse
Old conservative people, why do you let fringe right wing media give you your opinions. Why do you support people who cut taxes when we're running deficits, spend trillions going to war on false premises when the ultimate result is bound to be a disaster and put judges in place who do things like the citizen's united ruling where big business gets way too much power in our elections.
In short, you should be looking at yourself in asking questions and wonder why you're handing such a big debt to younger people instead of worrying about one person's opinion at a very small college campus.
Americas liberals and conservatives are lost and separated.
What conservatives don't understand is that most liberals want to live in a conservative country, like Switzerland. Switzerland has small government, low corporate tax rates, public gun ranges, a citizen militia, no welfare freeloaders, ex.ex. And Switzerland beats America in everything from economy to poverty levels.
Funny how liberals don't vote for politicians who want that kind of government/country, they elect politicians who are doing everything they can to move us in the exact opposite direction. If all of that is really what liberals want they really are lost and need to wake up about who they elect.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
