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OP, this is a serious question. Exactly what is the southern heritage that the Confederate Flag represents to you?
I'll tell you but I doubt you'll understand.
In 1861, the US was less than 100 years old. The ideas of liberty, state's rights, and revolution against oppression were fresh. The Southern people sincerely felt that they had every right to leave a union they had joined voluntarily following a successful revolution that overthrew a tyrannical government. George Washington was their hero (and, yes, he owned slaves).
There had been discord between the northern and southern states almost from the beginning. In fact, placing the nation's capital in DC to placate the South over the war debt issue (DC was considered pretty far south at that point), and it went downhill from there. And secession was not a novel idea. Indeed, it had been discussed and threatened by various states since soon after the beginning. There are scholarly arguments on both sides of the issue. The idea that voluntary entry into a Federation did not negate the voluntary secession therefrom has definite merit. Indeed, it wasn't a legal or constitutional argument that won the war - it was simply force of arms (the old "might makes right"). During the war, Lincoln actually assumed powers not bestowed on the POTUS, defied the Constitution, and generally did what he felt was right regardless of whether he actually had the legal right to do so.
It's easy to simply write off those who fought for the Confederacy as racist traitors, but it's also incorrect. Doing so demonstrates a shallow disregard of the complexities of history and the people who lived it. Most southerners didn't even own slaves - as has been mentioned. They fought against an invading army. Some years ago there was a TV miniseries on the subject - I can't remember if it was "The Blue and the Gray" or "North and South" - but there is a great scene that I think sums it all up. Two young soldiers, one US and one CSA, find themselves face to face away from the fighting. The Union fellow asks, "What's it like to own slaves?". The Southern boy, incredulous, replies "Slaves! We're lucky to own shoes!". The Union fellow, shocked, asks "Then why are you fighting?", to which the CSA fellow replies "We're fighting because you're down here." That's pretty much it in a nutshell for the average CSA soldier.
The difference between a revolution and a rebellion is victory. Remember that the Founding Fathers were also traitors - to England. And they wrote slavery into the Constitution because they owned slaves.
Your "heritage" is one of racism. Everyone else in the free world gets that. Time to step out of the muck & admit it.
If you have any offspring they will have a heritage of HATE for people because of where they were born and raised no matter how kind and honest they lived.
You purposely are not getting it. Te south went to war partially to protect slavery. That is why many see the confederacy as racist.
the confederacy has been gone for 150 years. If you fail to understand that, or are intent on projecting the sins of those people on the current generation 8 generations later, that is your error.
Since the Charleston shooting I’ve found myself being pushed more and more to the right. It’s odd for me because I’ve always been a moderate (even liberal on some issues). But I’m a 57 year old Southern Woman who is proud of my heritage. Because of that I’ve been labeled a racist, a traitor and a Nazi (by implication) by folks on the internet who don’t anything about me but what I’ve just mentioned. And suddenly I see it – the hatred of many (not going to generalize and say “all”) on the left for anything they disagree with and/or don’t understand. People who lash out and name call based on a knee-jerk reactions and little real knowledge either of the people they are attacking or the history they seem to think they are experts on. Indeed, these people have managed to turn not only today’s Southerners, but all, into one-dimensional racist buffoons. History is a lot more complicated than that because it’s made by real people – who are complicated.
I have a degree in history and I’ve studied US history from Colonial times through Vietnam. The history of slavery goes back hundreds of years. The sectional differences of the US states began before the ink was dry on the Constitution. It can’t be boiled down to a soundbite. And calling people names only demonstrates a lack of any but the most superficial knowledge of the history of the US, but also a rabid refusal to do more than cast stones from some kind of self righteous Neverland. From the flag, to the monuments, to the Dukes of Hazzard – it’s just too much. And it has caused more division than the shooting that started this ever could have. People came together after that in support and shock. Then it dwindled into attacks on heritage and charges of racism – toward people who not only didn’t support Roof, but were outraged at his actions. It has succeeded not only in division, but in the alienation of people like myself who find they have had all the insults and misjudgment they can take.
I totally understand and feel your pain.
I feel myself being pushed further to the left when I read generalizations and see low info CD users calling everyone to the left of the tea party names such as "commie," "leftists," "statist," "socialists," "bots" etc., and make utterly bizarre assumptions such as "libs feel sorry" for criminals who have committed inhuman crimes. It is so much lazier for people to stereotype others than to look deeper.
It sucks to be categorized and put in a box by people who have no idea what they are talking about, but like to say anything that come into their pointy little heads.
the confederacy has been gone for 150 years. If you fail to understand that, or are intent on projecting the sins of those people on the current generation 8 generations later, that is your error.
If the confederacy has been gone for so long why are people so angry that others do not want its flag flying on government property?
You make political decisions based on what people say about you online. Maybe this is what's wrong with America.
Nope. I've just experienced for myself the bullying and intolerance of radical leftists actually directed at me and at something I believe in. Not I understand what my friends on the right have been talking about.
Since the Charleston shooting I’ve found myself being pushed more and more to the right. It’s odd for me because I’ve always been a moderate (even liberal on some issues). But I’m a 57 year old Southern Woman who is proud of my heritage. Because of that I’ve been labeled a racist, a traitor and a Nazi (by implication) by folks on the internet who don’t anything about me but what I’ve just mentioned. And suddenly I see it – the hatred of many (not going to generalize and say “all”) on the left for anything they disagree with and/or don’t understand. People who lash out and name call based on a knee-jerk reactions and little real knowledge either of the people they are attacking or the history they seem to think they are experts on. Indeed, these people have managed to turn not only today’s Southerners, but all, into one-dimensional racist buffoons. History is a lot more complicated than that because it’s made by real people – who are complicated.
I have a degree in history and I’ve studied US history from Colonial times through Vietnam. The history of slavery goes back hundreds of years. The sectional differences of the US states began before the ink was dry on the Constitution. It can’t be boiled down to a soundbite. And calling people names only demonstrates a lack of any but the most superficial knowledge of the history of the US, but also a rabid refusal to do more than cast stones from some kind of self righteous Neverland. From the flag, to the monuments, to the Dukes of Hazzard – it’s just too much. And it has caused more division than the shooting that started this ever could have. People came together after that in support and shock. Then it dwindled into attacks on heritage and charges of racism – toward people who not only didn’t support Roof, but were outraged at his actions. It has succeeded not only in division, but in the alienation of people like myself who find they have had all the insults and misjudgment they can take.
They tout Travon Martin and Not-so-gentle Michael "e-thug" Brown, the mayor of Baltimore that gave them a pass, the overreaching of the white house on every minority shooting although whites are being murdered at 5 times the rate while completely ignoring this, their new found heroes criminal activity prior to justifiable shootings, and the hundreds of blacks being killed in Chicago by other blacks.
And you are surprised? You see, racism is only lauded on whites. If blacks hate whites, it's justified. If you by the same right dislike them you are racist. The race card has been played so much no one hears it anymore. That little misfit that killed those people needs to be executed. Period. Not so much for his admitted racist belies but rather, his d bag ways. He's a murderer.
Murderers in turn NEEED to be executed. The race argument is a sideshow. To run down that hole is to forget white carried barrack into the whitehouse. So much for everyone being racist. They only use it because no one will challenge them thus sowing seeds of hatred. It's self perpetuating despite efforts as those seen by the victims families in charleston. Brave folks and way too merciful for that kid. See? Whites that don't like other whites when they Misbehave. Unlike othe communities when kids like Michael a brown get themselves shot for being equally d baggish in their behaviors?
The only way to take diminish this onslaught of lynch-mob style bigotry from the left is to start calling them out on it. Shaming them if that is the popular way to say it now. And of course they should be ashamed. Also, if they are honestly and publicly called out on this enough times, the tide will begin to recede.
*LOL* No way you wrote this with a straight face. The whole m.o. of social conservatives has been and continues to be shaming. Thankfully it isn't working well anymore.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Spartacus713
But as long as people like you go with the politically correct flow and just refuse to say anything, it will continue unabated, and likely even get worse.
So not saying anything is what led to the creation of sodomy laws, Prop 8, and other such causes? I can't believe how little agency you all are pretending to have. Poor little victims now, eh.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Spartacus713
I am glad you have seen the light. Great post, and thanks for speaking up about this important subject.
Oh yes, the coming-out narrative was just so special, wasn't it.
Nope. I've just experienced for myself the bullying and intolerance of radical leftists actually directed at me and at something I believe in. Not I understand what my friends on the right have been talking about.
You are saying that you have experienced bullying and intolerance. You claim that people on the internet say bad things about you. You claim you are being pushed too the right. You also believe that the bully, intolerance directed at you online (you never mentioned any bully or intolerance directed at you in your day to day life) is not what is pushing you to the right.
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