Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
The average Technician makes $23 an hour. I am close to 32.
I started at $8 an hour over 25 years ago. Back then minimum wage was around $5.00 an hour.
Our new people currently start at 12 an hour. They know squat and must be taught everything. It takes time. Not a single new hire is worth the 12 an hour we pay to start. Why? Because it takes a Technician away from being productive to train them. It's an investment.
Paying someone $15 an hour because it feels good is a fools errand.
Same here. I was on commission at a small electronics shop, earning around $200/wk in the early 70's in San Diego. My wife worked in retail sales (department store). We bought a house and had a new Toyota Corolla.
Then I went to work for an oceanographic instruments company as a tech. I took a small decrease to work there, but quickly made it up through raises, the first one at my 90 day performance review.
I moved into the field service department. Travel was required. I got a pay increase. Then I was given responsibility for the lease pool. I got a pay increase. Next, I was invited to join the Marketing Department as Sales Administration Supervisor. I got a pay increase. While in that position, I had to learn all the ins and outs of sales and invoicing, bookings vs. sales, and I had to track bookings for my department. I also had to learn about payment instruments like L.C.'s (Letter of Credit) and had to scan the L.C. to ensure we were in compliance with the requirements.
All this experience added to my personal qualifications, which led me to my next job as Sales Administration Supervisor at a Scientific Atlanta division, where I had 7 ladies working for me.
When a year later, S.A. closed that division, I got a job at another oceanographic instruments company. My former boss's boss was the Marketing Manager there. I was hired as "Applications Engineer."
This is how it works. A minimum wage is a starting wage for lower level positions. No one is supposed to remain in those positions their entire working life. If they do, they are pretty stupid.
Why should taxpayers be fleeced to pay for them? Why can't they live within their means? If they want to earn more money, there's their incentive for acquiring more valuable skills.
jojan's arguments are all based on emotion, not the reality of the real world. That's what Democrats always base their arguments on.
Look, if someone isn't earning enough for their needs, they need to find a job that meets their needs. If they don't have the skills, they need to acquire them. It's that simple. Don't blame the CEO for not paying someone who isn't worth $15/hr a "living wage." What is a "living wage" for one person might not be for someone else.
No, the CEO's are not!
The stupidity of your reasoning is mind boggling.
That's because it's not reasoning; it's emoting. Liberals don't think; they "feel."
Exactly why so many of their policies fail, or have severely negative unintended consequences. For example, Welfare programs destroying the Black family unit:
I do think the government, Republican, Independent and often Democrats, does favor the ownership class or 1% too much. This is done through immigration and temporary work visas, some of the tax policies and even some regulations that produce high barriers to entry, trade policy, right to work laws etc. And there is some of privatizing profits and socializing loss. And too many subsidies. I'm sure someone could pick each of those categories and give examples.
An example, state or local government pass right to work laws, then gives tax incentives and even grants to domestic and even foreign businesses. Or, semi-skilled and skilled trades, government doesn't even try to enforce labor laws and immigration laws. Or college, government issues many student visas and gives some of them affirmative action. Or government issues a large number of HB1 visas for tech works. And on and on it goes.
If Democrats want to argue that, it's a valid discussion and I won't argue against it much. The constitution delegates the federal government to provide for the common defense, set immigration policy and international trade policy and even interstate trade. But it seems to always do this in a way that works against most Americans.
What I object to most about Progressive, liberalism is the government being involved in so many social issues and private individuals lives. Government applies its pseudo-science, pseudo-religion and social politics way to much on private individuals.
That's because it's not reasoning; it's emoting. Liberals don't think; they "feel."
Exactly why so many of their policies fail, or have severely negative unintended consequences. For example, Welfare programs destroying the Black family unit:
Liberals. I honestly believe that they mean well and truly believe that the world can be a utopia.
The reality seldom reflects the dream. There are people who will never be anything above a minimum wage employee.
Some because they just aren't very bright, some because they are followers with no ambition to be more. Some people will never be more because they make disastrous personal decisions, one after another.
Paying the above more than they are worth is simply another form of welfare and that is why liberals really love the idea of imposing yet another burden upon those they feel can afford it.
I do think the government, Republican, Independent and often Democrats, does favor the ownership class or 1% too much. This is done through immigration and temporary work visas, some of the tax policies and even some regulations that produce high barriers to entry, trade policy, right to work laws etc. And there is some of privatizing profits and socializing loss. And too many subsidies. I'm sure someone could pick each of those categories and give examples.
An example, state or local government pass right to work laws, then gives tax incentives and even grants to domestic and even foreign businesses. Or, semi-skilled and skilled trades, government doesn't even try to enforce labor laws and immigration laws. Or college, government issues many student visas and gives some of them affirmative action. Or government issues a large number of HB1 visas for tech works. And on and on it goes.
If Democrats want to argue that, it's a valid discussion and I won't argue against it much. The constitution delegates the federal government to provide for the common defense, set immigration policy and international trade policy and even interstate trade. But it seems to always do this in a way that works against most Americans.
What I object to most about Progressive, liberalism is the government being involved in so many social issues and private individuals lives. Government applies its pseudo-science, pseudo-religion and social politics way to much on private individuals.
Its not the progressives that pushed for 21 year legal limit for alcohol purchase, banning online gambling and banning gay marriage. This is the social issues, family values right wingers.
Liberals. I honestly believe that they mean well and truly believe that the world can be a utopia.
The reality seldom reflects the dream. There are people who will never be anything above a minimum wage employee.
Some because they just aren't very bright, some because they are followers with no ambition to be more. Some people will never be more because they make disastrous personal decisions, one after another.
Paying the above more than they are worth is simply another form of welfare and that is why liberals really love the idea of imposing yet another burden upon those they feel can afford it.
You do realize that 10 times as many people benefit from minimum wage increases as the people on minimum wage right?
Whats so great about corporations steamrolling over the 99%, force you to train your replacment and send you packing? Whats so great about this race to the bottom of lower pay and benefits you encourage? Massive income and wealth inequality leads to destruction of democracy and massive crime rates. This is what we see in America. Whats so great about that? You will have to pay for it anyway, through no say in which laws are passed and through constant fear of getting mugged or beaten to a pulp. This is the Latin Americanization of America. And this is what Trump is trying hard to push through his tax plan and supreme court nominations. If we continue down this path of grovelling the super rich and demonizing the 99% (while pretending like we are millionaires ourselves) we will look like Mexico.
Greedy Companies and the Goons Trained in American Universities of how to enrich themselves at the expense of the public and certainly at the expense of the employee's... is the ONLY Reason this company would close shop and move.
This is what America gets for pushing the "degree" as if its the answer all be all bought piece of paper, and these people come out with a degree and pursue how to enrich themselves by any and every means, and that is their sole aim and concern. Because that what the University System has taught them.
Production Level Employee's DON'T destroy companies, they are the ones who actually manufactuer and produce the 'actual" products.
As to Destruction, Executives are the ones who Destroy Companies!!!! andthey are advised directed and pushed by Lawyers and Bankers, whom both chase greed as a basis, and they will advise anything that gives them, "billing hours", and the bank will do anything that set itself up to push off another loan with a circle of fees, and these dummies riding degree's have been trained to go for it each and every time. Then if it is a public traded company, blame the Board of Directors and all the blood suckers in the Stock Maker Brokerages who drive up the stock value by FICTIONS push the company to borrow against fiction, until it chokes itself.
Its not the progressives that pushed for 21 year legal limit for alcohol purchase, banning online gambling and banning gay marriage. This is the social issues, family values right wingers.
What? California voters passed Prop 8. California is a Right-wing state? Um... no.
Interesting look at the vote broken down by race, gender, religion, employment, etc. Two groups that traditionally vote Left-wing had the highest percentages of Yes votes: Blacks and Latinos.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Liberals don't think; they "feel." 
