Betsy DeVos on 60 minutes (free speech, worker, bombs, website)
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Location: The place where the road & the sky collide
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Quote:
Originally Posted by InformedConsent
Nope. Penn is NEVER confused with Penn State (or PSU, they're referred to as either), and in fact if anyone is doing so, they're deliberately misleading others into thinking their degree is from Penn.
Look, hon, l lived in the Philadelphia metro over 40 years. Penn State is in State College. U of P is in the University City section of West Philadelphia. I'm telling you how the schools are referred to, from a local perspective. I'm also telling you that U of P released a statement that Trump attended the University of Pennsylvania & took classes, as an undergraduate at Wharton. I've known a good many people who did the same. They said that they attended U of P. I know a couple of people who went to Wharton for an MBA. THEY said that they went to Wharton. There's a protocol that the Blowhard-in-chief decided that he could circumvent because it makes him sound better & smarter.
It's been whispered in Philadelphia for decades that Fred Trump gave U of P money to get sonnyboy in. You can believe what you want. I doubt that you've lived in the Philadelphia area, or you wouldn't be insisting on this. Trump was there in the 60s. Absolutely no one who did what he did in the 60s tried to pass themselves off as Wharton students, except him. They said that they were University of Pennsylvania students, taking some courses at Wharton. That is truthful. To say otherwise is deceptive.
The joke in Philly used to be that Trump was saying that he went to Wharton, but Mick Jagger went to the London School of Economics. Who would you go to for economic advice.
Look, hon, l lived in the Philadelphia metro over 40 years. Penn State is in State College. U of P is in the University City section of West Philadelphia. I'm telling you how the schools are referred to, from a local perspective.
Maybe to the uninformed. Look, "hon"... Try going on a job interview and deliberately misleading the interviewer by saying you graduated from Penn when you really graduated from Penn State, and it's a VERY different story.
Please don't confuse the locals' uninformed vernacular with the terms that are ACTUALLY used.
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I'm also telling you that U of P released a statement that Trump attended the University of Pennsylvania & took classes, as an undergraduate at Wharton.
His degree is actually from Wharton. Read the commencement program.
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I've known a good many people who did the same.
Here's where you're getting confused. Penn offers a bachelor's degree in Economics, but it's not from Wharton. Wharton offers a bachelor's degree in Economics that has different requirements than the Economics bachelor's degree from Penn. They're two different things.
It's a shame you're from that area and still have NO clue of which you speak. /SMH
Funny, I quoted the same study myself back in post #375. If you missed it, here it is again.
Quote:
Originally Posted by glamatomic
No, it isn't worthless. They did break it down into Catholic, Lutheran, Christian and Secular.
However, you are correct in that Jesuit schools are marginally better, at least according to the CEP study.
Directly from the CEP study:
The study found that low-income students from urban public high schools generally did as well academically and on long-term indicators as their peers from private high schools, once key family background characteristics were considered. In particular, the study determined that when family background was taken into account, the following findings emerged:
1. Students attending independent private high schools, most types of parochial high schools, and public high schools of choice performed no better on achievement tests in math, reading, science, and history than their counterparts in traditional public high schools.
2. Students who had attended any type of private high school ended up no more likely to attend college than their counterparts at traditional public high schools.
3. Young adults who had attended any type of private high school ended up with no more job satisfaction at age 26 than young adults who had attended traditional public high schools.
4. Young adults who had attended any type of private high school ended up no more engaged in civic activities at age 26 than young adults who had attended traditional public high schools.
Taken as a whole, these findings suggest that students who attend private high schools receive neither immediate academic advantages nor longer-term advantages in attending college, finding satisfaction in the job market, or participating in civic life.
This study did identify two exceptions to this general finding. The primary exception is that students who attended independent private high schools had higher SAT scores than public school students, which gave independent school students an advantage in getting into elite colleges. (These independent private schools enroll many students from affluent families and are often expensive and fairly elite themselves, with tuitions as high as $30,000 a year.) This finding suggests that while these schools are no better at teaching the subject matter, they may provide students with test-taking skills that help them further their education, or they may enroll students with higher IQs (aptitude tests like the SAT are a better measure of IQ than achievement tests are).
A second exception is that one special type of private school, Catholic schools run by holy orders (such as Jesuit schools), did have some positive academic effects. There are very few such schools, however; most Catholic schools are run by their diocese, not by
an order (Meyer, 2007).
As I said earlier, Jesuit schools make up only about 25% of the approx 1200 Catholic schools in the country. That is hardly enough schools to make a significant impact or alternative.
Having some positive effects at a very small percentage of schools, is not a solution to the wider problem.
The study actually goes on to strengthen my argument in that it concludes with this:
This study presents an answer to Coleman's studies of private school effects. Once the full scope of the family is taken into account, cultural capital as well as economic capital, private school effects disappear. These findings suggest a need to maintain the focus on improving schools while also bolstering supports for low-income families, such as providing adequate health care and preventive care, better wages, and high-quality child care and preschool programs.
Although families do make a considerable difference, the good news is that concerned parents are not unique to any race, religion, geographic region, or social class, and there are as many of them in urban areas as suburban areas. But families need a combination of economic and social supports, as well as high-quality public education, to ensure that their children can take advantage of the social contract our society makes through the institution of public schools—to give every child a chance to rise higher than his or her parents.
Thank you again for posting a study I had already referred to and strengthening my side of the debate for me
Location: The place where the road & the sky collide
23,814 posts, read 34,693,648 times
Reputation: 10256
Quote:
Originally Posted by InformedConsent
Maybe to the uninformed. Look, "hon"... Try going on a job interview and deliberately misleading the interviewer by saying you graduated from Penn when you really graduated from Penn State, and it's a VERY different story.
Please don't confuse the locals' uninformed vernacular with the terms that are ACTUALLY used.
His degree is actually from Wharton. Read the commencement program.
Here's where you're getting confused. Penn offers a bachelor's degree in Economics, but it's not from Wharton. Wharton offers a bachelor's degree in Economics that has different requirements than the Economics bachelor's degree from Penn. They're two different things.
It's a shame you're from that area and still have NO clue of which you speak. /SMH
How many U of P graduates do you know, personally?
Having some positive effects at a very small percentage of schools, is not a solution to the wider problem.
It IS a solution when those same educational strategies can be applied in more schools and/or if there were more religious order schools. Public schools are HIGHLY resistant to change. Why? Because they don't have to change. They go along to get along because nothing/no one can eliminate their pensions/benefits, and they have guaranteed taxpayer funding, regardless of their **** poor results.
ANYTIME there's a virtual government-run monopoly with mandated taxpayer funding and no option to use that funding on a better choice, we get exactly the same... Just look at the VA Health Care system.
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The study actually goes on to strengthen my argument
No, it does not. It CLEARY states in the conclusion:
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"Only one type of school shows an advantage over comprehensive public high schools in student achievement across subjects: Catholic religious order schools."
I have known dozens of graduates of U of P. I even have known a handful of Wharton graduates, who all had MBAs.
Again, there's a protocol. If you live in another part of the country you may not know it. Trump lived 100 miles away & certainly knew the protocol.
Back to the old local joke, when asked : Donald Trump says that he went to Wharton. Mick Jagger went to the London School of Economics. Who do you go to for economic advice? The answer was always the same, after a good laugh. Mick Jagger.
I have known dozens of graduates of U of P. I even have known a handful of Wharton graduates, who all had MBAs.
Again, there's a protocol. If you live in another part of the country you may not know it.
"Hon," Penn, Wharton, and Penn State grads work all over the US and indeed, all over the world. Penn State is NEVER referred to as Penn. NEVER. Penn and Wharton grads refer to themselves depending on which granted their degree.
In Trump's case, Wharton granted his degree. He earned Wharton's bachelor's degree in Economics. Other students will have earned Penn's bachelor's degree in Economics. They are not the same. They are two different degree programs, with different requirements.
Location: The place where the road & the sky collide
23,814 posts, read 34,693,648 times
Reputation: 10256
Quote:
Originally Posted by InformedConsent
"Hon," Penn, Wharton, and Penn State grads work all over the US and indeed, all over the world. Penn State is NEVER referred to as Penn. NEVER. Penn and Wharton grads refer to themselves depending on which granted their degree.
In Trump's case, Wharton granted his degree. He earned Wharton's bachelor's degree in Economics. Other students will have earned Penn's bachelor's degree in Economics. They are not the same. They are two different degree programs, with different requirements.
PLEASE don't be obtuse.
ROFLMAO. There must be truth to the rumor of Fred Trump greasing the skids to get sonnyboy in. ALL of the U of P graduates who I have known could speak & spell well.
Laugh all you want, but this exchange has exposed you as quite severely under-informed. That should be embarrassing for you, not funny.
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