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Nigeria is one of a handful of African nations that need an ethnic breakup. Outsiders just don’t understand how deep tribal loyalties lie. We live in western democracies where that kind of tribalism is hard to fathom.
I know this is Africa’s century. I can feel it. I can sense it from all the news I’m digesting from African and other foreign news outlets. The Chinese know it too, and have thrown all their cards on the table in a bet that it’s gonna happen. When many of these nations can get the IMF boot off their necks, things will change.
If I could only be here to see it. What I’d do just to get another 20 years of life beyond the normal lifespan. Lol
Outsiders? You're an outsider as well. What's your experience with Nigeria or tribal loyalties except what you read?
Nigeria is not unique to the African continent, and it's not even the most tribally divided. What you can say about Nigeria you can say two-fold for Kenya (for example, where besides tribes you also have Cu****ic, Bantu and Nilotic people occupying space as well, Nigeria is essentially all Bantu).
Nigeria has 200 million people, the most populous country in Africa, and it has a lot of natural resources. Comparing it to her West African neighbors (Benin, Togo especially), Nigeria is well-developed. Comparing Nigeria to just about any other country outside Africa, and it's a different story.
Many of these tribal divisions were exploited by European colonizers who aptly used "divide and rule" to quickly conquer much of West Africa. They loved to find one tribe, support them, and have that tribe conquer the other tribe. But these days, grudges are rare (even in a place like Rwanda that had a genocide), it's really just one tribe gets power and supports all members of their tribe to powerful or lucrative positions. I mean, why wouldn't you? You grew up with them, you speak the same language etc. It's not rocket science, it happens all over the world.
In Africa, think of tribes as nations (works this way in most cases). Switzerland would then have 3 tribes (French, Germans, and Italians) using this terminology. Nothing really exotic when you think of it that way.
Anyways, finger wagging James Watson and calling him a bad boy and a meanie won't get him to change his opinion. It may send some other scientists who feel that way into the closest - which maybe the purpose of the finger waiving. But then this kind of pressure shouldn't be what a university does. Let Watson say his opinion, let other scientists challenge it. Watson has definitely earned his right to his opinion.
And let the world move on. I never got why this subject is such a big taboo. Does it change anyone's reality what's the average intelligence of their "race". A dumb white man has no condolence if he's from a race of geniuses - he's still dumb as a rock. So who cares really? I guess it's important here or there for abstract reasons but it makes no difference to any of us.
Anyways, finger wagging James Watson and calling him a bad boy and a meanie won't get him to change his opinion. It may send some other scientists who feel that way into the closest - which maybe the purpose of the finger waiving. But then this kind of pressure shouldn't be what a university does. Let Watson say his opinion, let other scientists challenge it. Watson has definitely earned his right to his opinion.
And let the world move on. I never got why this subject is such a big taboo. Does it change anyone's reality what's the average intelligence of their "race". A dumb white man has no condolence if he's from a race of geniuses - he's still dumb as a rock. So who cares really? I guess it's important here or there for abstract reasons but it makes no difference to any of us.
The reason it is important is because it creates self fulfilling prophecies. The group in power has the POWER of suggestion to create these self fulfilling prophecies based upon their narratives. These beliefs will therefore subconsciously socially and economically engineer outcomes.
The reason it is important is because it creates self fulfilling prophecies. The group in power has the POWER of suggestion to create these self fulfilling prophecies based upon their narratives. These beliefs will therefore subconsciously socially and economically engineer outcomes.
Maybe you're right and people internalize these stereotypes. But it's not really in your power to change people's opinions. You can put pressure on them to shut up, which I guess is what the university is doing (a la the term "political correctness") but this is not an effective solution. it doesn't stop anyone from thinking these thoughts. In fact, it might be make these thoughts even more alluring - some kind of hidden truth if it were.
People just need to get over "race." It shouldn't be your most important identity. People have many identities, and "race" should be way way way way down at the bottom. It doesn't work that way in practice, but stuff like this only reinforces the notion race is an essential identity.
As a a Nigerian I hate the use of the word Tribe to describe the ethnic groups of Nigeria. Yoruba is an ethnic group made up of several tribes including a French speaking one in Benin and each Yoruba state has its own tribe. Igbo is an ethnic group made up of different tribes. Fulani is an ethnic group that is heavily intermarried with the ethnic group of Hausa. The northerners don’t really have tribes. The Fulani/Hausa are essentially Eastern Europeans to Southern Nigeria. Their taller, they have much straighter hair and their body shape is different, similar to how Southern Europeans while having massive overlap generally look different from Scandinavians when you get two groups of them together. Again I’m not that well verse but my parents can tell ethnic identity apart in general with a close to 70% accuracy.
The main problem with Nigeria is political wise while the parties have shifted away from being ethnic parties (The people who are elected make it all about ethnicity and are mostly old heads), the upcoming race is between two former military officials who can barely spell (massive exaggeration here) and the college graduate candidate is basically ignored. Bihari for example literally led a coup at one point...
Nigeria would do much better as seperate countries although a city like Lagos would be impossible as a much smaller nation. The Igbo have their stuff together but their landlocked, he Inaw got screwed over by the other ethnic groups and oil money. The Yoruba like the Igbo are fine and dandy the Hausa have a chance in their cities, the Fulani are nomadic people not to mention Wahhabists which are both anti-development compared to farmers/city people in the north and the south. Ibibio/Efik are the future of Nigeria’s tourism industry with safe cities like Calabar and Uyo.
Rwanda doesn’t have ethnic problems because they speak the same language and have the same culture, Tutsi vs. Hutus was closer to Protestants vs. Catholics than French vs English as they speak the same language they just look different, and with intermarriage promoted Rwanda has a good future. Botswana as well has a good future because it is mono-ethnic mostly.
What will save Nigeria is English being more dominant so the country becomes more unified culrrently only half of Nigerians speak English and only in mixed cities like Lagos, Port Harcourt and Abuja do the majority of people speak English. I went to Ibadan they need only spoke Yoruba their which is divisive especially to outsiders. Yorubas are 50-50 Muslim and Christian and get along with each other fine although some extremists exist. The main problem isn’t just religion. It’s religion, ethnicity, lifestyle (nomads vs farmers or city slickers vs rural) combined. Tribal issues as in different groups of Igbo who speak different dialects of the same language, hating each other has been mostly resolved in Nigeria, ethnic conflict is the problem. It’s not like Yorkshire people are beefing with people from Ulster. It’s the English vs The French.
That’s personally why I hate the word tribal in Western usage, because tribe does not equal ethnicity in Nigeria and never has.
SORRY to double post. But about actual IQ in Nigeria.
The problem I have with it is the IQ of Nigeria is definitely not 69. I would guess it is somewhere between 77-90. They did several studies in Nigeria in the 1990s and 1980s on schoolchildren and got 7 figures ranging from 97-67 of IQ of Nigerian children, and said the National IQ of Nigeria is 84. To this day you look up Nigerian IQ and some sources give you 84 others give you 69. The 69 IQ was esssentially taking the lowest IQ score of those tests which were in no way a representative sample of National IQ and claiming that this is the Nigerian IQ. Then recently newer western scientists have claimed that the claim that many have made before that the IQ of Africa by Lynn was 70 was factually incorrect and is more likely to be 82. The fact that most of Africa is simply to poor to even get an accurate representative IQ test already put the numbers into question. Not to mention African Americans who are 80%+ African (West African mostly) have an IQ of 85 on average and are the most studied black group. Then all of the Carribean countries that have large black populations non of them have even reported an IQ that even touched 70 (even Haiti is just an estimate essentially).
I don’t think IQ is some sort of terrible Science I just feel like it hasn’t even been accurately explored yet when the most famous IQ test for countries is largely incomplete. Not to mention IQ can easily change in 50 years. Like I said last post watch Botswana and Namibia’s IQ jump considerably higher as those two countries may eventually leapfrog others like Russia or Lithuania in development. When Eko Atlantic City is completed with mostly Nigerian money and this place revolutionizes Lagos in many ways, you’ll soon be hearing about the Nigerian IQ approaching 84 because Lagos looks more like Manila than Kinshasa.
My moms Grandfather, and my grandfather were educated Nigerian men who lived in the largest city in Africa at one point Ibadan, with the latter even owning a house in the UK, and being one of the first Nigerians in the UK. My dads mom doesn’t even know the day she was born and cannot write, she was raised in a small village were kids would not wear clothes till the age of 11. My Moms family are middle class folk got his day mostly living in Ibadan. My Dads family can be found in Canada, UK and the U.S as well as Germany many of them are millionaires (1 million dollar+ net worth not multimillion dollars which goes a long way in Nigeria), and most of them are upper middle clsss even by U.S standards although their is a few of them that are destitute and poor still in the village my grandmother was raised but even then their wealthier than the rest of the villagers. If IQ was so heriditary their would be no reason why I would have so many educated millionaires on the side of the family that came from a village were people couldn’t even read or write, or even know their age. But then you throw in things like Ijawland is we’re most of the Oil in Nigeria is located, and the fact that my grandfather on my dads side was a military/police man in his family and you quickly see that certain things like Liquid gold (Oil), political positions will make your family far more prosperous and “high IQ” than having a history of being educated and learned will. Non of my family is a millionaire directly from oil as in owning any oil, but the environment in which Petroleum Engineers and all the jobs that spawn from a big oil company moving into the area allowed them to profit of the natural wealth of the area they were raised. Saying IQ is simply hereditary wouldn’t explain at all why the village side of my family is smarter and more educated than the side that has been in cities decades before the other one maybe even a century (don’t know my family history yet far back). Environment plays a massive role because no matter how low IQ you family is you place an average Chinese child in a 1960s Nigerian village with no resources and you place an average Nigerian child with Bill Gates or anywhere in America, the Chinese child will have nochsnce unless he has a supergeius level IQ because until recently their was little that was meritocratic about Nigerian society we’re an IQ 105 would get you anywhere.
Most people don’t know this but those Nigerian princes are often college grads who are middle class who are trying to get rich quick scheme because Nigeria isn’t a meritocracy many of those Nigerian princes even do things like building their own computers.
Last edited by NigerianNightmare; 01-26-2019 at 01:08 AM..
Rwanda doesn’t have ethnic problems because they speak the same language and have the same culture, Tutsi vs. Hutus was closer to Protestants vs. Catholics than French vs English as they speak the same language they just look different, and with intermarriage promoted Rwanda has a good future. Botswana as well has a good future because it is mono-ethnic mostly.
The differences are ethnic between the Hutus and Tutsis. Tutsis are Nilotic people and Hutus are Bantu. Tutsis are pastoralists, while Hutus (like pretty much all Bantus) are farmers. Tutsis are taller, have narrower faces and have traditionally militarily dominated the Hutus despite being a minority (~15%).
Last edited by NomadicDrifter; 01-26-2019 at 06:50 AM..
The differences are ethnic between the Hutus and Tutsis. Tutsis are Nilotic people and Hutus are Bantu. Tutsis are pastoralists, while Hutus (like pretty much all Bantus) are farmers. Tutsis are taller, have narrower faces and have traditionally militarily dominated the Hutus despite being a minority (~15%).
I know this, but first of all Tutsis and Hutus have been mixed for a long time, so a Tutsi being talller and looking more Somali is true, but their so mixed that today it’s hard to claim that they are seperate ethnic groups. Also Nilotic vs Bantu is irrelevant to most conflicts. They fight because of ethnic differences not because some of them are Nilotes and some of them are Bantus. As Rwanda has basically struck down mentioning he words Hutu and Tutsi in about twenty years either group will simply seize to exist because they already spoke the same language and nowadays even live the same lifestyle, making the conflict of the war irrelevant to Rwanda’s development today. I’m not saying they never were two seperate ethnic groups but I’m saying that now their one ethnic group due to shared language, culture and occupation and increasingly shared genetics.
I know this, but first of all Tutsis and Hutus have been mixed for a long time, so a Tutsi being talller and looking more Somali is true, but their so mixed that today it’s hard to claim that they are seperate ethnic groups. Also Nilotic vs Bantu is irrelevant to most conflicts. They fight because of ethnic differences not because some of them are Nilotes and some of them are Bantus. As Rwanda has basically struck down mentioning he words Hutu and Tutsi in about twenty years either group will simply seize to exist because they already spoke the same language and nowadays even live the same lifestyle, making the conflict of the war irrelevant to Rwanda’s development today. I’m not saying they never were two seperate ethnic groups but I’m saying that now their one ethnic group due to shared language, culture and occupation and increasingly shared genetics.
I think the mixing is much exaggerated, and generally goes only one direction (a hutu + tutsi has children, the children identify more as a hutu than a tutsi, even in Africa where this is usually done by the father). Look at Kagame, there is no Hutu who will look like him. You can tell he's tutsi from a plane.
Nilotic vs Bantu I bring up because they're essentially "races" whereas tribes in Africa are ethnic groups. While a lot of White people think of Blacks from Africa as one race, the Black race, it's essentially three: Bantu (the most common, and what people think of when they think of Black Africans), Nilotics (people living along the Nile, pastoralists), Cu****ics (for some reason CD censors part of this word, these people are from the Horn and include Somalis and Afar people).
There are also some minor races such as the pygmies, or the bushmen but these people play less of a role in conflicts as the above.
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