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Old 05-15-2022, 02:35 PM
 
26,788 posts, read 22,556,454 times
Reputation: 10038

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Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnBoy64 View Post
https://twitter.com/TheStudyofWar/st...20808656412674



I would say it was all of the above. That new artillery is now coming in country full throttle.

Check on the Board Members there;

"Irina Verity

Position:
Manager of Strategic Partnerships

Iryna Verity is the Manager of Strategic Partnerships at the Institute for the Study of War (ISW). Her work focuses on ISW’s strategic projects, donor relations development and growth.

Ms. Verity has over 25 years of extensive experience working with leading corporations and privately owned businesses as well as diplomatic missions and governmental and non-profit organizations. Her portfolio includes work with The World Bank/International Finance Corporation, US-Ukraine Business Council (USUBC), and the US-Ukraine Foundation (USUF).


Ms. Verity is an active member of the US-Ukraine community and has been recognized with numerous awards throughout her career for her contributions to the economic, charitable, and cultural relations between the two countries.

Ms. Verity holds a B.A. in Slavic History, Literature and Language from Tadjik State University (Republic of Tajikistan). She is a multilingual communicator fluent in several eastern European languages. Born in Ukraine, she has lived, worked, and studied in central Asia, eastern Europe, and the United States."


At least now I understand where this clearly Ukrainian-fed propaganda is coming from on that site.


Because I have no idea what "Russian milbloggers" they are talking about.

If even someone like ME can understand by now the situation on the front lines and what's going on there, (since I know at least three reliable sources that explain in details the situation, obviously anyone in Russia willing to learn about it on ru channels are aware of where to get it.



So what "shock" of "milbloggers" they are talking about there - god knows.

Last edited by erasure; 05-15-2022 at 02:45 PM..

 
Old 05-15-2022, 02:42 PM
bu2
 
24,106 posts, read 14,891,132 times
Reputation: 12951
Quote:
Originally Posted by gwynedd1 View Post
Its like talking to a child. Who said Russian troops are not in Ukraine? I said that Ukrainians are on opposite sides of the Russian issue and particularly in the east. Did you know that Hispanic people like to watch Telemundo or do I need to explain that to you too? if the US decided to form an alliance specifically hostile to all Hispanic nations do you think we might fracture our country? Whatchy ya think there, smarty?



Of course I don't buy into the idea of "Ukrainians" in your mythological false dichotomies. The right bank Ukrainian on the left bank Ukrainians are completely different. So are the Rusyns where self identifying Ukrainians call them a fake culture.


https://neweasterneurope.eu/2020/10/...ty-of-ukraine/
Now, every country besides Ukraine recognises Rusyns as a distinct people. Documentaries by filmmakers such as Maria Silvestri and John Righetti and radio stations such as Rusyn.fm have attempted to regain this sense of national consciousness and tell the world our story and culture. We also now have Rusyn festivals, artists, TV shows and organisations, which were not allowed just 30 years ago. With all of this, however, the damage from the past still shows even gradually in more faint ways today.

Oh gee imagine that more Ukrainians and Western hypocrisy,



Ths US and their puppets always accuse their enemies of committing war crime, while also commuting war crimes. The US put the one that leaked war crimes in Iraq in prison.
It marked the beginning of a flood of classified documents, including the April 2010 release of a video that showed a U.S. helicopter crew firing on a group of people that included two Reuters employees.
...

In July 2013 Manning was found not guilty of the most serious of those offenses—aiding the enemy—but was convicted of numerous other counts, including espionage and theft. The following month Manning was sentenced to 35 years in prison.
The West now puts many journalists in prison, Julian Assange .





You mean like Syria, Afghanistan, Yemen etc?
The problem is that English is definitely not your first language.
Civil War is between people in a single country. 200,000 Russians invading Ukraine is NOT a civil war.
Staying on topic seems to be difficult for you also. Or are you just wanting to deflect from Putin's army murdering thousands of civilians, many of them ethnic Russians.
 
Old 05-15-2022, 02:54 PM
 
1,812 posts, read 2,225,046 times
Reputation: 2466
Quote:
Originally Posted by erasure View Post
Check on the Board Members there;

"Irina Verity

Position:
Manager of Strategic Partnerships

Iryna Verity is the Manager of Strategic Partnerships at the Institute for the Study of War (ISW). Her work focuses on ISW’s strategic projects, donor relations development and growth.

Ms. Verity has over 25 years of extensive experience working with leading corporations and privately owned businesses as well as diplomatic missions and governmental and non-profit organizations. Her portfolio includes work with The World Bank/International Finance Corporation, US-Ukraine Business Council (USUBC), and the US-Ukraine Foundation (USUF).


Ms. Verity is an active member of the US-Ukraine community and has been recognized with numerous awards throughout her career for her contributions to the economic, charitable, and cultural relations between the two countries.

Ms. Verity holds a B.A. in Slavic History, Literature and Language from Tadjik State University (Republic of Tajikistan). She is a multilingual communicator fluent in several eastern European languages. Born in Ukraine, she has lived, worked, and studied in central Asia, eastern Europe, and the United States."


At least now I understand where this clearly Ukrainian-fed propaganda is coming from on that site.


Because I have no idea what "Russian milbloggers" they are talking about.

If even someone like ME can understand by now the situation on the front lines and what's going on there, (since I know at least three reliable sources that explain in details the situation, obviously anyone in Russia willing to learn about it on ru channels are aware of where to get it.



So what "shock" of "milbloggers" they are talking about there - god knows.
A single Ukrainian working for this group does not make what this group says propaganda.

And she's not a board member. She's a high ranking employee. And for all you know she's one of your "good" Russian speaking Ukrainians.

Here are the actual board members, it's an impressive list:
General Jack Keane (US Army, Retired), Chairman, Institute for the Study of War; President, GSI, LLC
Dr. Kimberly Kagan, Founder & President, Institute for the Study of War
The Honorable Kelly Craft, Former US Ambassador to UN and Canada
Dr. William Kristol, Director, Defending Democracy Together
The Honorable Joseph I. Lieberman, Senior Council, Kasowitz Benson Torres & Friedman, LLP
Kevin Mandia, Chief Executive Officer & Board Director, Mendicant
Jack D. McCarthy, Jr., Senior Managing Director & Founder, A&M Capital
Bruce Mosler, Chairman, Global Brokerage, Cushman & Wakefield, Inc.
General David H. Petraeus (US Army, Retired), Member, KKR & Chairman, KKR Global Institute
Dr. Warren Phillips, Lead Director, CACI International
Colonel William Roberti (US Army, Retired), Managing Director, Alvarez & Marsal

https://www.understandingwar.org/who-we-are
 
Old 05-15-2022, 02:55 PM
 
26,788 posts, read 22,556,454 times
Reputation: 10038
Quote:
Originally Posted by bu2 View Post
The problem is that English is definitely not your first language.
Civil War is between people in a single country. 200,000 Russians invading Ukraine is NOT a civil war.
Staying on topic seems to be difficult for you also. Or are you just wanting to deflect from Putin's army murdering thousands of civilians, many of them ethnic Russians.

The problem is you don't understand the difference between Europe and the US, when talking about a "civil war."

The presence of American troops in Russia back in 1918 for example, in no way cancelled the fact that Russia was in the midst of the civil war.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Allied...sian_Civil_War
 
Old 05-15-2022, 02:58 PM
bu2
 
24,106 posts, read 14,891,132 times
Reputation: 12951
Quote:
Originally Posted by erasure View Post
So you are basically confirming now the long-standing lies of Ukrainian propaganda, that there is no such thing as LDNR army - it's all "soldiers of the Russian army?"

Congratulations.

Better later than never ( to admit that it were all lies.)
I on another hand already said on this thread earlier that it were NOT Russian troops operating near Kharkov that were retreating, but ill-prepared newbies from LNR. ( Their more seasoned fighters are in Donbass and Mariupol now and doing a fine job.)

But the same is happening to the Ukrainian army too now.

With shortage of the initially well-prepared men, who were killed in the first two months of war, now Ukrainian government is sending the cannon fodder to the front lines - ill-prepared people, whoever they can catch on the streets ( or the gas stations while filling out their cars, as I saw it happening in Western Ukraine.)
They too are sent to die now, to fill the gaps in the ranks.

So I was happy to see today on the military channels a group of Ukrainian recruits contacting certain people on-line and arranging the place to surrender, BEFORE they entered any fight, and before they are shot in the back by the likes of Azov for "betrayal."
And what they are saying, these Ukrainians, is that they are not cowards - they are simply not interested to die for the oligarchy and foreign interests.

And by the sound of it - they are not even the Russian speakers - they are the Ukrainian-speakers, even though they are still from the Eastern regions.

I know that all the rage here on this thread is that it's only the "Russian Ukrainians" that fight on the Russian side, and all "ethnic Ukrainians" of course support Kiev and Kiev only.

But let me tell you what I see on line IN REALITY.

In reality some of the ethnic Ukrainians from the Eastern part are the FIERCEST proponents of this Russian takeover.

They too see their country and people being used for the interest of the foreign powers, and they rally both ethnic Ukrainians and Russians alike around them to put a stop to it.
They actually think that their lands are safer with Russia for this matter.
Not only that; they believe that being Ukrainians, they are the inseparable part of the Russian culture. They believe that Tolstoy and Dostoeyvsky are as much "theirs" as someone like Gogol is part of the Russian classical writers. That they share in the common roots.

They believe that Ukraine comprise what's known as the "Russian Empire," as many other ethnicities that lived there for ages and contributed to the richness of the Russian culture.

And these people are a serious threat to Kiev's regime, they are the firebrands, and a lot of Ukrainians are listening to them, not just "the Russians."
Another bizarre tangent. Nobody denied some Ukrainian citizens were sympathetic to Russia. Nobody denied that there was an army Putin financed with foreign mercenaries and local ones.

It is interesting that Mariuopol was described as perhaps the most pro-Russian city still under government control and it got almost completely leveled by the Russian army. Imagine what would happen to a city with an overwhelmingly hostile populace. Wait, we don't have to. We have Bucha as an example. Rape, kidnapping, torture, murder.

And all of you justifying it because Ukraine was trying to promote the Ukrainian language.

This has nothing to do with that. It is just Putin's greed and desire for power. And Putin's paranoia, which seems to be shared by some of his defenders on here.
 
Old 05-15-2022, 03:02 PM
bu2
 
24,106 posts, read 14,891,132 times
Reputation: 12951
Quote:
Originally Posted by erasure View Post
The problem is you don't understand the difference between Europe and the US, when talking about a "civil war."

The presence of American troops in Russia back in 1918 for example, in no way cancelled the fact that Russia was in the midst of the civil war.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Allied...sian_Civil_War
There is no difference. You are more fluent than the other guy, but clearly English is not your first language.

A minimal number of foreign troops is different than Ukraine where there are a minimal number of separatists.

Its really bizarre for you to deny what Putin himself has admitted. He has sent troops in to try to topple the government of Ukraine.
 
Old 05-15-2022, 03:15 PM
 
1,139 posts, read 403,211 times
Reputation: 590
Quote:
Originally Posted by erasure View Post
The problem is you don't understand the difference between Europe and the US, when talking about a "civil war."

The presence of American troops in Russia back in 1918 for example, in no way cancelled the fact that Russia was in the midst of the civil war.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Allied...sian_Civil_War
You really need to reread definition of a civil war. Civil war is defined as citizen of a nation fight against each other. Russian troops are not citizen of Ukraine, they are in fact citizens of Russia and as such by definition conflict in Ukraine can't be defined as civil war.
 
Old 05-15-2022, 03:15 PM
 
Location: Los Angeles
7,826 posts, read 2,729,107 times
Reputation: 3387
Quote:
Originally Posted by erasure View Post
Check on the Board Members there;

"Irina Verity

Position:
Manager of Strategic Partnerships

Iryna Verity is the Manager of Strategic Partnerships at the Institute for the Study of War (ISW). Her work focuses on ISW’s strategic projects, donor relations development and growth.

Ms. Verity has over 25 years of extensive experience working with leading corporations and privately owned businesses as well as diplomatic missions and governmental and non-profit organizations. Her portfolio includes work with The World Bank/International Finance Corporation, US-Ukraine Business Council (USUBC), and the US-Ukraine Foundation (USUF).


Ms. Verity is an active member of the US-Ukraine community and has been recognized with numerous awards throughout her career for her contributions to the economic, charitable, and cultural relations between the two countries.

Ms. Verity holds a B.A. in Slavic History, Literature and Language from Tadjik State University (Republic of Tajikistan). She is a multilingual communicator fluent in several eastern European languages. Born in Ukraine, she has lived, worked, and studied in central Asia, eastern Europe, and the United States."


At least now I understand where this clearly Ukrainian-fed propaganda is coming from on that site.


Because I have no idea what "Russian milbloggers" they are talking about.

If even someone like ME can understand by now the situation on the front lines and what's going on there, (since I know at least three reliable sources that explain in details the situation, obviously anyone in Russia willing to learn about it on ru channels are aware of where to get it.



So what "shock" of "milbloggers" they are talking about there - god knows.
Who cares about their board members. I would imagine all of them are pro-Ukraine...like the rest of the free world. There are both Russian and Western analyst that just want an accurate assessment on what is happening in the war regardless of their loyalties. Here is their Mission Statement.

Quote:
MISSION STATEMENT
The Institute for the Study of War advances an informed understanding of military affairs through reliable research, trusted analysis, and innovative education. We are committed to improving the nation’s ability to execute military operations and respond to emerging threats in order to achieve U.S. strategic objectives. ISW is a non-partisan, non-profit, public policy research organization.

We believe ground realities must drive the formulation of strategy and policy. In pursuit of this principle, ISW conducts detailed, open-source intelligence analysis to provide the most accurate information on current conflicts and security threats. ISW researchers spend time in conflict zones conducting independent assessments and enhancing their understanding of realities on the ground. Through reports and timely events, our research educates military and civilian leaders, reporters, and the public to enhance the quality of policy debates.
Russian milbloggers are pro-Russian war bloggers...some of whom are embedded with troops on the front lines....who have reliably posted to the social network Telegram with claims of Russian success and Ukrainian cowardice. Are you telling me these don't exist???

According to the NY Times this guy has 2.1 million followers on Telegram

https://www.nytimes.com/2022/05/15/w...s-kremlin.html

Quote:
“I’ve been keeping quiet for a long time,” Yuri Podolyaka, a war blogger with 2.1 million followers on Telegram, said in a video posted on Friday, saying that he had avoided criticizing the Russian military until now.
https://t.me/yurasumy/3510

Here's another one

Quote:
Another popular blogger, who goes by Starshe Eddy on Telegram, wrote that the fact that commanders left so much of their force exposed amounted to “not idiocy, but direct sabotage.”
https://t.me/vysokygovorit/7886

And another one

Quote:
And a third, Vladlen Tatarski, posted that Russia’s eastern offensive was moving slowly not just because of a lack of surveillance drones but also “these generals” and their tactics.

“Until we get the last name of the military genius who laid down a B.T.G. by the river and he answers for it publicly, we won’t have had any military reforms,” Mr. Tatarski wrote.
https://t.me/vladlentatarsky/13591

So The Study of War is reporting factual information...wouldn't you say??
 
Old 05-15-2022, 03:17 PM
 
26,788 posts, read 22,556,454 times
Reputation: 10038
Quote:
Originally Posted by swake View Post
A single Ukrainian working for this group does not make what this group says propaganda.

And she's not a board member. She's a high ranking employee. And for all you know she's one of your "good" Russian speaking Ukrainians.

Here are the actual board members, it's an impressive list:
General Jack Keane (US Army, Retired), Chairman, Institute for the Study of War; President, GSI, LLC
Dr. Kimberly Kagan, Founder & President, Institute for the Study of War
The Honorable Kelly Craft, Former US Ambassador to UN and Canada
Dr. William Kristol, Director, Defending Democracy Together
The Honorable Joseph I. Lieberman, Senior Council, Kasowitz Benson Torres & Friedman, LLP
Kevin Mandia, Chief Executive Officer & Board Director, Mendicant
Jack D. McCarthy, Jr., Senior Managing Director & Founder, A&M Capital
Bruce Mosler, Chairman, Global Brokerage, Cushman & Wakefield, Inc.
General David H. Petraeus (US Army, Retired), Member, KKR & Chairman, KKR Global Institute
Dr. Warren Phillips, Lead Director, CACI International
Colonel William Roberti (US Army, Retired), Managing Director, Alvarez & Marsal

https://www.understandingwar.org/who-we-are

I think that when this group is working on other subjects, their outlook/info might be more objective/worthy of attention.

But in this situation, this particular "high ranking employee" is a source of Ukrainian propaganda supply.

I can even pinpoint to you why.

"The attempted river crossing showed a stunning lack of tactical sense as satellite images show (destroyed) Russian vehicles tightly bunched up at both ends of the (destroyed) bridge, clearly allowing Ukrainian artillerymen to kill hundreds and destroy scores of vehicles with concentrated strikes."


The (destroyed) bridge in reality was ONE of the few pontoons.
The "attempted river crossing" was accomplished anyway.

The "satellite images" referred to, left many people questioning whether those "scores of vehicles" were all really Russian or they were mixed with the Ukrainian ones left there earlier, or whether all those vehicles were really destroyed as Ukrainians claimed.

I wouldn't personally know, since I am not interested in such fine details - I only know that Ukrainians suffered the defeat trying to cross this very river a day ago, and probably not for the first time, so I can see why their damaged tanks/armored vehicles could be sitting in the same location from earlier times and mixed with "destroyed Russian tanks."

With that being said, of course Russian troops suffered the defeat with this particular pontoon, and of course there was a lot of commotion on the Russian sites regarding it.



But see what happens when I put it all in a bigger picture, VS the way the Ukrainian propaganda piece was originally presented?

Last edited by erasure; 05-15-2022 at 04:47 PM..
 
Old 05-15-2022, 03:20 PM
 
1,863 posts, read 5,150,243 times
Reputation: 1282
Quote:
Originally Posted by erasure View Post
So you are basically confirming now the long-standing lies of Ukrainian propaganda, that there is no such thing as LDNR army - it's all "soldiers of the Russian army?"

Congratulations.

Better later than never ( to admit that it were all lies.)
I on another hand already said on this thread earlier that it were NOT Russian troops operating near Kharkov that were retreating, but ill-prepared newbies from LNR. ( Their more seasoned fighters are in Donbass and Mariupol now and doing a fine job.)

But the same is happening to the Ukrainian army too now.

With shortage of the initially well-prepared men, who were killed in the first two months of war, now Ukrainian government is sending the cannon fodder to the front lines - ill-prepared people, whoever they can catch on the streets ( or the gas stations while filling out their cars, as I saw it happening in Western Ukraine.)
They too are sent to die now, to fill the gaps in the ranks.

So I was happy to see today on the military channels a group of Ukrainian recruits contacting certain people on-line and arranging the place to surrender, BEFORE they entered any fight, and before they are shot in the back by the likes of Azov for "betrayal."
And what they are saying, these Ukrainians, is that they are not cowards - they are simply not interested to die for the oligarchy and foreign interests.

And by the sound of it - they are not even the Russian speakers - they are the Ukrainian-speakers, even though they are still from the Eastern regions.

I know that all the rage here on this thread is that it's only the "Russian Ukrainians" that fight on the Russian side, and all "ethnic Ukrainians" of course support Kiev and Kiev only.

But let me tell you what I see on line IN REALITY.

In reality some of the ethnic Ukrainians from the Eastern part are the FIERCEST proponents of this Russian takeover.

They too see their country and people being used for the interest of the foreign powers, and they rally both ethnic Ukrainians and Russians alike around them to put a stop to it.
They actually think that their lands are safer with Russia for this matter.
Not only that; they believe that being Ukrainians, they are the inseparable part of the Russian culture. They believe that Tolstoy and Dostoeyvsky are as much "theirs" as someone like Gogol is part of the Russian classical writers. That they share in the common roots.

They believe that Ukraine comprise what's known as the "Russian Empire," as many other ethnicities that lived there for ages and contributed to the richness of the Russian culture.

And these people are a serious threat to Kiev's regime, they are the firebrands, and a lot of Ukrainians are listening to them, not just "the Russians."
Talking to yourself, again?

Talk talk talk, nobody is buying your pro-Russian nazi bullshiit, anyway. Ukrainians are not Russians, and have their own culture. You and people like you hate that to hear. It's like saying, Canada is the USA.

You are a (pro)Russian NAZIonalist. You can keep your Gogol and Tolstoy. But don't push into throats of Ukrainians your Russian culture. They have their own culture, whether you like it, or not.

Talking about Russian "culture"... It's all in the past. We know what today's Russia is: A corrupt third world country ruled by a dictator with pitiful population thinking they are the worthiest humans with an overblown sense of superiority for no reason. And you are talking about Ukrainian nationalists!

Who wants to share with what Russia represents now? Who can blame Ukrainians that they don"t want anything of it anymore?

Last edited by movingwiththewind; 05-15-2022 at 03:33 PM..
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