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Old 03-30-2022, 02:38 PM
 
Location: West Coast of Europe
25,947 posts, read 24,756,050 times
Reputation: 9728

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Quote:
Originally Posted by SlamDuncanitis View Post
Interestingly, Russian propogandists have called for 'Regime change' in the US.


We do that every 4 years. When's Russia gonna change theirs? Oh right, til' about 2036?

There is no change in the US because it doesn't matter who is president. The important people behind the scenes that actually run Washington remain the same regardless of who is in the WH or Congress. And those people are no better than Putin.

 
Old 03-30-2022, 02:39 PM
 
Location: Milwaukee, WI
3,368 posts, read 2,894,423 times
Reputation: 2972
Quote:
Originally Posted by SlamDuncanitis View Post
Interestingly, Russian propogandists have called for 'Regime change' in the US.
We do that every 4 years. When's Russia gonna change theirs? Oh right, til' about 2036?
Speaking about USA, I don't think there has been "regime change" since Bill Clinton came to the office. I mean, the talking heads in the White House changed, but the real decision makers were not.
 
Old 03-30-2022, 02:40 PM
 
26,789 posts, read 22,567,030 times
Reputation: 10040
Quote:
Originally Posted by Neuling View Post
Still, Russia has the Western type of democracy.

Sorry Neuling it does not.

It's more civilized of course in this respect (of civil liberties) than the S.U was, but it's definitely not the working multi-party system that you see in Western countries.

But Russians don't mind too much, since they feel more protected this way at this point in time, from the Western attempts to destroy their sovereignty.

This whole ordeal with the neighboring Ukraine - the way it has been used by the West as "anti-Russia project," only confirmed their security concerns.
 
Old 03-30-2022, 02:42 PM
 
106 posts, read 28,452 times
Reputation: 49
Quote:
Originally Posted by Neuling View Post
There is no change in the US because it doesn't matter who is president. The important people behind the scenes that actually run Washington remain the same regardless of who is in the WH or Congress. And those people are no better than Putin.
In a way, you're kind of right. The US does have it's own forms of Oligarchs. The US is still imperialist, I can admit that. I mean, I can admit that and not face 15 years in prison.


Unlike Russians.



America has a lot of problems, but not at this level:
https://www.youtube.com/shorts/jO3b02ljfpI
 
Old 03-30-2022, 02:42 PM
 
5,731 posts, read 2,195,632 times
Reputation: 3877
Quote:
Originally Posted by NoMansLands View Post
It would take a change in leadership for the EU to want to continue with Russian resources. Putin crossed the line of definition of modern civilization. Civilized nations no longer barbarically invade their neighbors and murder them in land grabs. It's not acceptable anymore.
Again, the EU is going to punish their own citizens for their reliance on Russian gas and lack of planning for this scenario? Why shut down your nuclear power plants? It’s incompetence.

This is not 1938, Russia is not a rising military and economic power, they are not attacking a NATO country. They are not driven by an ideology of global domination like the Nazis. I view this as a war between cousins, where Russia feels like it is protecting its eastern interests. Zelensky’s demands to the west are unrealistic and it’s time he comes to that realization now.
 
Old 03-30-2022, 02:46 PM
 
106 posts, read 28,452 times
Reputation: 49
Quote:
Originally Posted by erasure View Post
Sorry Neuling it does not.

It's more civilized of course in this respect (of civil liberties) than the S.U was, but it's definitely not the working multi-party system that you see in Western countries.

But Russians don't mind too much, since they feel more protected this way at this point in time, from the Western attempts to destroy their sovereignty.

This whole ordeal with the neighboring Ukraine - the way it has been used by the West as "anti-Russia project," only confirmed their security concerns.
Russia is the closest thing to 1984 in today's day and age.



I mean historically it always has been. Since it was Soviet, and still today.




https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1cG3PlcSiLA
 
Old 03-30-2022, 02:47 PM
 
2,690 posts, read 1,614,894 times
Reputation: 9918
Quote:
Originally Posted by Neuling View Post
People want to move to the US, Canada, Europe etc. because there are jobs and people earn more. And because everyone there speaks English. People don't emigrate to the US because of democracy. US democracy is a joke.

The reasons that there is good jobs, freedom, and every other perk of living in the USA is BECAUSE of how we run our country, it is all connected, and democracy is the backbone of our system. Nothing about the wages, good life, nice car home etc., would exist WITHOUT OUR DEMOCRACY. You call that a joke? Tell that to the billions of people who would like to emigrate and can only dream about it.
 
Old 03-30-2022, 02:52 PM
 
106 posts, read 28,452 times
Reputation: 49
Quote:
Originally Posted by NoMansLands View Post
The reasons that there is good jobs, freedom, and every other perk of living in the USA is BECAUSE of how we run our country, it is all connected, and democracy is the backbone of our system. Nothing about the wages, good life, nice car home etc., would exist WITHOUT OUR DEMOCRACY. You call that a joke? Tell that to the billions of people who would like to emigrate and can only dream about it.
I am the first to always criticize the US. Because it still does have many flaws such as voting restrictions, and police brutality. Aswell as geopolitical issues such as waging illegitimate wars in the middle east based on false pretense.


The difference is that I don't have to worry about being served polonium tea for posting the above. Or lose 15 years of my life.




But there are those that would want it to be that way. Mainly of the Christian right/Theocratic fascist variety.
 
Old 03-30-2022, 02:55 PM
 
Location: Milwaukee, WI
3,368 posts, read 2,894,423 times
Reputation: 2972
Quote:
Originally Posted by SlamDuncanitis View Post
In a way, you're kind of right. The US does have it's own forms of Oligarchs. The US is still imperialist, I can admit that. I mean, I can admit that and not face 15 years in prison.

Unlike Russians.

America has a lot of problems, but not at this level:
https://www.youtube.com/shorts/jO3b02ljfpI
Do you personally know any one who was jailed for speaking up? All those who criticized Putin keeps doing it for years and years. If not on the TV, but freely over the internet.


I don't know anyone.



Famous names?


Navalny? He had many warnings not to engage in riots. And his business dealings were less than stellar. Yet, he had 2 conditional profanations, before got jailed for good.


Nemtsov? Well, he was killed. But he wasn't really criticizing Putin or its regime, he wasn't threat to it at all. Reportedly, he had some beef with some Chechen criminals. Putin does not have to protect every oppositional politician of regional level.



Khodorkovsky? The guy challenged the leadership of the country and threatened the President. He had an opportunity to leave, but felt that he's untouchable for any crime. Apparently, not so. Pardoned though after 9 years and allowed to leave Russia.


Kasparov? Living comfortably in USA, I never heard that he's prohibited to entry to Russia if desired.


Every other one, I heard of - they are all there, still active, still doing what they like to do, to criticize.
 
Old 03-30-2022, 02:55 PM
 
2,690 posts, read 1,614,894 times
Reputation: 9918
Quote:
Originally Posted by ColoradoOnMyMind View Post
Again, the EU is going to punish their own citizens for their reliance on Russian gas and lack of planning for this scenario? Why shut down your nuclear power plants? It’s incompetence.

This is not 1938, Russia is not a rising military and economic power, they are not attacking a NATO country. They are not driven by an ideology of global domination like the Nazis. I view this as a war between cousins, where Russia feels like it is protecting its eastern interests. Zelensky’s demands to the west are unrealistic and it’s time he comes to that realization now.
The plan to green energy may obviously have to be shelved for awhile in Germany because of this war. Are the Germans willing to pay higher prices for gas to get off dependence on Russia? Absolutely. Same goes for the US, recent polls on whether we would pay higher prices for gasoline if it meant we could stop all import of Russian oil was about 75% in favor of. Yes, respect for freedom really does mean that people will open their wallets to support it.
Russia isn't attacking a NATO country, no, you are correct. They are attacking the very system of democracy by attacking their weaker smaller newly democratized nation next door. To us in the USA, that's comparable to the war of 1812, with us wanting to protect this young democratic nation from it's ugly fat bully of a step-brother.
I don't view you as taking this situation as seriously as you might consider that situations like this are a global threat to democracy everywhere.
There will be a land grab involved in this before it is over. Putin will steal land, and to do it, he is murdering people and destroying entire cities. Are you really ok with that?
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