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And I wasn't asking you , because your arguement wouldn't float in a bathtub. You have yet stop give any compelling arguement to support your very weak case. Your numbers didn't add up, that's why i refuse to discuss this with you. When the question id posed to a particular person, let that person answer it!
Your numbers do not add up and make no sense a I have already proven,
get through your head foster care does not start until after the baby is born. Anyone declaring they want to give their baby up for adoption, can find the adoption agency to pay the medical costs of the birth. the other numbers you used also have been pr oven false in your estimates. I played this game with you and your numbers are a figment of your imagination
Your numbers do not add up and make no sense a I have already proven,
get through your head foster care does not start until after the baby is born. Anyone declaring they want to give their baby up for adoption, can find the adoption agency to pay the medical costs of the birth. the other numbers you used also have been pr oven false in your estimates. I played this game with you and your numbers are a figment of your imagination
No my numbers ar done on a calculator, yours are pulled out of your wild imagination. What if these adoption agencies become full and can not take anymore children? You run the numbers then if you don't believe mine. Its all very obtainable knowledge, the cost of medical procedure and such. You are the one who said that the waiting list in texas was 13,000. I doubled that for adoption and you still have over 50,000 a yr not being adopted. That's every year. Once a family has adopted, how many more children do you think they will continue to adopt? My bet is the one or if luck two they want, so find about 35,000 more families a year who want to adopt. I'll even do you one better, i'll do the research for youand let you know. Like I said your numbers don't add up, let someone else try to convience me, because you can not.
And murder and burglry are illegal because of the malice implied against someone during the act of commiting these crimes. Look up the word malice and get back to me!
Im not trying to imose my ideas of morality on anyone. Believe me you let me choose who gets to live or die and alot of people won't like the out come. When you try to impose your morality on others, you ASSume those people believe like you do. What I was trying to do was like a polite mother slap your hand over something you know better than!
Lol, by saying "you cant impose your morality on others" yes, you are imposing your morality on others, just so you know. And the only thing i'm really assuming is that most people believe that killing another human being is wrong. (and obviously theres a lot of grey areas that come up like if they are sick, and things like that). But i still think that every human being should have the right to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness (whether the declaration is a legal document or not, doesn't matter). On a side note, thats why im not against homosexuality. I'm not a supporter of it, but it doesnt infringe on other's rights to life liberty and the pursuit of happiness, so they can do what they want.
Quote:
Originally Posted by trmihall01
So, in the case a woman doesn't want this child what makes you assume that she will raise it? What makes you think she is fit to be a mother, obviously she doesn't believe so. I think great, if she's not/can't be a good mother, better to not have the child then to have it and neglect it.If she is a drug addict, prostitute, 13 yrs old, etc... do you really want these people to raise a child, would you even let the baby sit your child.
Also another question i have is, if you make abortion illegal do you truely believe they will stop?
And last but not least I'll pose the same question to you that no one has been able to answer, How do we afford to feed, cloth, educated and provide medical care for all these unborn?
Before you say adoption, think about the state of our economy, if it gets worse, it is very likely that no one will be able to afford to adopt.
I ran the figures for 50,000 children not adpoted by the state of texas out of 77,000 abortions ( just to prove this point) the average cost of the birth on the state is $7,000 x50,000=$350,000,000. The birth defect rate is about 2333 of these childern and the cost for the average open heart surgery(since 10% of childern have a heart defect per cdc) 200,000x 2333=$466,600,000.Not counting food, clothes, medical care and check ups. Braces, accidents, the cost of a funeral for those 3% who will die before age 18. That doesn't include all the extra people eating, drinking, consuming water and other natural rescources, and breathing air.
That's just this year alone for the state of texas. Make a reasonable arguement for me as to how we can afford all this.
You are assuming that i am assuming that the mother is fit to take care of the child. I am not. I never said i thought that. And It doesn't matter. She can give it up for adoption. And to your point about the money, should we really allow the killing of humans to continue just because it might be a financial burden on us to let them live? Oh, and think about how when all those kids grow up, they will be contributing to the economy as well, working jobs, paying taxes, buying things from businesses. But it doesnt matter, even if none of them contributed to the economy, killing someone so that you save some money is wrong.
And until we can effectively transfer fetuses, it's the unfortunatly only true answer to an unwanted pregnancy.
Well, not really... being ready for a kid, and realizing that a human life can be brought into this world, before you engage in sex is the only true answer to stopping an unwanted pregnancy.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ray1945
An embryo does not have a brain, which imbues all of us with the qualities that make us a person.
False. It does have a brain, it is in its earliest stages, sure, but it is developing. And again, what are all those "qualities" that make us a person? you still havn't told me about all of those yet, im still waiting for an answer.
Quote:
Originally Posted by wjtwet
it solves both. Abortion solves nothing
While i agree with your stance on abortion, i have to say that adoption does not solve an unwanted pregnancy, it solves an unwanted child.
Lol, by saying "you cant impose your morality on others" yes, you are imposing your morality on others, just so you know. And the only thing i'm really assuming is that most people believe that killing another human being is wrong. (and obviously theres a lot of grey areas that come up like if they are sick, and things like that). But i still think that every human being should have the right to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness (whether the declaration is a legal document or not, doesn't matter). On a side note, thats why im not against homosexuality. I'm not a supporter of it, but it doesnt infringe on other's rights to life liberty and the pursuit of happiness, so they can do what they want.
An embryo is composed of human cells but IT IS NOT A HUMAN BEING. An abortion does not "kill another human being."
There is a law in my city that prohibits me from cutting down my oak trees. There are no laws that prohibit me from tossing acorns into the garbage, even though that little acorn possesses the potential of becoming a mighty oak. Using your logic, the law should apply to both the acorn and oak equally.
There is a law in my city that prohibits me from cutting down my oak trees. There are no laws that prohibit me from tossing acorns into the garbage, even though that little acorn possesses the potential of becoming a mighty oak. Using your logic, the law should apply to both the acorn and oak equally.
First of all please don't put those other words in when you quote my post, even when you put it in red, in kind of makes it look like i said it and i didnt.
Second of all, let me tell you what your example is proving. The acorn in this case would be the "sperm", and if it isn't already shooting out roots in the ground, then it is an acorn, not an oak tree, Same as sperm is sperm, not a human. Your example shows that it is okay to throw away sperm or something like that, but it does not justify killing another human being, and i know you said in your post that "its not a human being" but you still havn't proven to me how it is not a human being.
False. It does have a brain, it is in its earliest stages, sure, but it is developing. And again, what are all those "qualities" that make us a person? you still havn't told me about all of those yet, im still waiting for an answer.
That "developing" brain produces no brain activity - no brain function. Without brain function there are no qualities of 'personhood'.
My point is every pro- life person says ...well they can put it up for adoption. Here are some quick facts for you. In 2005 there were 820,151 abortions and 120,000 adoptions.The average waiting time for an adoption 2-3 yrs. Average cost to raise a healthy child with 237,000. Average cost to raise a sick child, astronomical, depending on the birth defect, but 7% of all children are born with a major birth defect. number of children born with autism 1/150. Adhd 18% cost of one month of adhd meds 123.00 and up.I'm not saying adortion is the solution, i'm just asking you to back up your stance. If adoption is your answer, show me where there are 820,150 people every yr who are willing to adopt. And if these children aren't adopted who will pay for them? We as a nation are already trillions in debt, where's the money gonna come from.
Adpotion was your solution, i just want you to realize that it's not really a realistic answer. I wish no one ever got pregnant with a child they didin't want, i wish no child ever had to be aborted or deformed or sick, but these are the faacts of life and ignoring them or refusing to acknowledge them won't make them go away.I'm all for education, birth control, trying to work together for a better solution ,etc..., but what no one wants to admit is that making it illegal won't make it stop, and are you willing to throw pregnant women in jail to prevent them from having one? The jails are already overcrowded with real criminals, and if you do throw them in jail, here we are again paying for it.
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