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I really don't care who gets what as long as everyone is alright.
I'm totally fine with taking my personal belongings, those things that are very clearly mine, and going to live in a small apartment. In fact I'm also OK with doing that, AND paying child support. I love my kids. I'm not only the breadwinner, I'm going to be making twice what I make now in a couple of years and my kids are teenagers.
It's looking like this is actually going to work, all of this. We've raised some difficult subjects and he has been coping ok even when his emotions are obviously vexing him. He is aware that control over his reactions is something he's got to work on. The progress going on here in the last few days is something I never would have hoped for a year ago, or before then. I think that there will be certain areas where he will still try to hold on and maintain some control, until he finds someone else...but he's definitely letting go a little bit at a time...and doing it with less bluster and threat than before.
And Jay, the only thing I can say to what you're putting out there, is by the time I was old enough and wise enough to know my arse from my elbow, it was too late. I was trapped. People should be stopped from making long term life altering decisions when they are 18-20 years old...I had no idea what I was getting into.
I can clearly relate to your problems. It isn't going to get better. You have to save yourself and your children. He does the suicide thing and gets out his guns to make you feel guilty and keeps him in control. I have been in your shoes and still am to a degree. My ex threatened suicide so often, I finally loaded the gun, gave it to him and said, "do it, so I can finally have some peace. I will finally be done with you." Did he do it, no, he realized I didn't care anymore. When he left for work the next morning, I packed what I needed and left, never looked back. I had a daughter, but he was not the father, so never had to contact him for anything.
Then 2 years later, I married again. Thought I had the greatest guy in the world. But he was super jealous and I kept telling myself, it was because he loved me so much. The first year was great, except for the jealousy. It's been hell every year since. I left several times. I got the calls, reminding me where the insurance policy was, just in case something happened to him. He has been a good father to my daughter and his sons, a lot of things he could have done differently, but for the majority, he has been a good dad. He never treats me with respect, we argue daily. I have an Iincurable disease, which makes me very ill and stress is the worst for causing me to be ill. Does it matter, no, he is selfish, controlling and acts like a brat.
Thirty years later, I am still here, like an idiot. Every day is hell, but it is my fault. I am in control of my own life, no one else is. I don't want the confrontation, I wish I could disappear in the middle of the night. I fall asleep without a warning, so I am afraid to drive and cause someone else harm. So I stay and I stay.
You have a job, you are responsible for your children and yourself. Get out before you become a statistic or like me. We make our life and happiness. It's in our control. TAKE YOUR LIFE BACK!
Do what you have to do to protect you and your children. Get a restraining order. Get separation papers immediately. Let the guidelines be laid as to how and when he visits the children. You cut off all ties unless it involves the children. No matter how hard it isin the beginning, it will get better. If hemakes good on his suicide threats, so be it. It's not your fault, and you will be free of him then.
I don't know if you are all aware, but when the kids in the situation are teenagers, unless you can offer clear proof of something, say, illegal...the judge asks the kids, "who do you want to live with?" and that is the most powerful piece of the picture they use to make these decisions. I know, because when I was 13, that's what happened to me, and I was allowed to go live with my crazy, jobless, hopping from one young foreign boyfriend to the next, utterly unfit MOTHER because I said that's what I wanted. Because of course at 13, I wanted the parent who wouldn't make me follow rules, and would let me do anything I wanted to. The reality is I wound up taking care of her crazy self, and her babies. This was over my Dad and Stepmom, who had good income, in a nice neighborhood, nice house just built, every indication of stability.
My husband has pretty much convinced my kids that I just want to lie and cheat and run around being a party girl, and that's the real reason I'm leaving. Nevermind that I'm not cheating, not lying, and anticipate spending most of my time doing full time work and full time college, not "partying"...it's what he thinks. I see condemnation in the eyes of my children, and I can't even tell them it's not true, because he's convinced them to see anything I say as a lie.
There is so much hurt in that household I can hardly even stand it. It's all I can do not to just disappear and not make contact with anyone who knows me again. And there are people here who think I am strong enough to take my children and go be homeless with them...what, kidnap them? He hasn't done anything illegal and HE STILL HAS PARENTAL RIGHTS. I mean you realize, if HE took the kids and disappeared, that is a crime...and if I do the same, it is a crime...right?
I can't prove that he has done anything illegal.
Just owning a gun, or strapping it onto your leg when angry, is not a crime. It's scary, and abusive, but it is not illegal.
I'm just saying. I have to be realistic about what I can and cannot do. Ruth4Truth tried to explain all of this several posts back, and a number of you have ignored her...she is right.
How did your kids come to view you as the bad person here? I am puzzled by this.
As a kid coming from a very horrific upbringing I had no confusion on who the bad parent was and there would have been nothing in the world the bad parent could have told me about the victim parent to make me think the victim parent was the bad one and a liar. They live under the same roof...this makes no sense to me.
They might be looking at the OP like that because they don't understand why she hasn't removed them from this situation long ago. If I was a kid, I would be pissed at the parent that was sane, that was keeping me in this hell.
He is very intelligent and knows the things to say to people to appeal to them and twist their loyalties. He had me believing that all of the control, all of the stuff I dealt with from him for YEARS was perfectly reasonable. He has been on several side missions to make me look like a bad person to our mutual friends (I don't have any local friends who are not mutual friends, and now he's made sure that they are HIS friends, and he's condemning me for talking to them about my problems, because I'm hurting them and causing them stress.) He tells the boys that I'm just plotting and scheming to get out because I want to sleep with other men, and that everything I say is a lie. They don't believe me now. None of it is true, but he has been the involved parent for so long that they have become used to relying on him, and they see how hurt he is that I'm leaving. They pleaded with me to love him and stop making him sad, and I'm still going away.
I didn't go to the grocery store this weekend, but we had plenty of food. Apparently we were out of some specific thing that my youngest wanted to eat. I overheard him telling his brother, "Mom says she cares about us, but it's a lie. She doesn't even buy us food anymore. She doesn't even care if we eat." I'm serious, we had PLENTY of food in the house. Good stuff, not just cans of beans, ok... I think we were maybe out of ice cream or something.
He has told them that once I'm gone they will have to text me if they want to see me because I won't care enough to come visit. He has turned them against me. It doesn't help that I'm the one who is always working and not home enough.
This has been the hardest part to get across to people...he doesn't HIT anyone. They don't see him beating me up. He doesn't put them through the things he puts me through. And he is a master of manipulation, he can make everyone see how hurt he is, and they think I'm a terrible person. He can even make me question myself, he's been doing it for YEARS. And another difficult concept to get across is that HE HAS NO IDEA HE'S DOING IT. He believes all of the things he convinces himself, and then others of. I can't prove I'm not cheating, so I must be. Why else would I be leaving him? I can't prove I haven't lied, so I must be. Why else would he be hurt? And I'm a woman, so duh, of course I'm doing those things, all women do. Beginning with the birth mom who "threw him away like trash." HE believes his rationale. Which is why he's so good at making other people believe it, too.
When I go, it will be with no support whatsoever. Because I can't make friends he doesn't know, he demands I account for all of my time. And if I bring a friend around him, I make another hostage he's got to hurt me with. But it's OK. Because I'm getting to the point where I'm strong enough to do this regardless.
I actually agree with your husband. If you knew it was a mistake from the beginning then it was your responsibility to tell him and not lead him on. This is all on you. If I were the courts, I wouldn't give you a thing. The gun fetish of his though does sound psycho. I'll give you that. Should never have become involved or stayed as long.
They might be looking at the OP like that because they don't understand why she hasn't removed them from this situation long ago. If I was a kid, I would be pissed at the parent that was sane, that was keeping me in this hell.
I was a kid in that situation and I saw my mom as a beaten down scared woman who was enduring the same hell as me and my sibling. It seemed to me that my mom could not get us out of there since she was being 100% controlled. A young child is not thinking along the lines of your post when the victim parent is also receiving the same abuse.
The other parent is not sane or they would not be in that situation. Women in that situation are terrified victims and there is a psychology going on that most don't understand especially if they have never experienced this type of situation.
I have a hard time understanding it myself even though I witnessed it with my mother. I would never allow anyone to abuse me or control me.
A lot of it has to do with the victim being beaten down so low that they are basically paralyzed and have zero self worth. Then there is the fear of the crazy violent partner hunting them down and causing great harm once they are found.
Maybe it would make it easier for people to understand if I put it this way...
Imagine I were male, and my husband were the wife.
I go to work, have a long commute and long hours. She stays home and cooks and cleans, but not in a way that anyone would be incredibly proud of...yet she DOES take great care of the kids.
Yet, over the years, she has become unstable. She needs constant validation, has terrible self esteem, and has started saying crazy things. She is paranoid, suspicious, accuses me of things I'm not doing. For a long time, I tolerate this and try to assuage her fears, I check in often, I talk her down when she's upset. Still, it is all about her, and never about me. She requires way above and beyond the normal level of accountability, and because it's hard to prove you did NOT do something, I'm under constant scrutiny and suspicion. Finally after one episode involving shouting, threats, and much drama, I really realize I just can't take it anymore. I have a friend of the opposite gender that I start getting close to...but I don't sleep with. I tell the wife about this, to try and illustrate just how much trouble the marriage is in, after all, the friend pushed me away and nothing is going on there. Wife still feels threatened, and goes on a campaign to isolate me from everyone we know. Talks bad about me to everyone. All I want is out, away from this crazy person who has claimed so much of my life already. And for the kids to be alright, that is the main thing.
I'm walking away...I'll leave her the house to raise the kids in, and pay child support...because you know what? Gender doesn't matter sometimes.
I do this little exercise here, to try and break the "battered woman, victim of abusive man" paradigm. Plenty of marriages have ended this way with the roles reversed. The only difference is, I might, assuming some things that I really can't/shouldn't assume about the kids themselves, be able to take the house and children simply because I AM the Mom. But I still don't think it's the right thing to do.
EDIT: The main difference is, I do believe him capable of violence in the right circumstances....but maybe that's not that big of an exception, because there are women out there who are capable of that, too.
They pleaded with me to love him and stop making him sad, and I'm still going away.
Is there any way to have a serious conversation with your sons in order to enlighten them that what you and your husband have is not love nor is it representative of what a healthy relationship is about?
Lay it out clearly for them so there is no confusion. Force them to use their brains and explain the situation that forces them to come to see the truth and sickness of their fathers conditioning's. If they are unable to do this then they are also just as messed up as their dad.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sonic_Spork
"Mom says she cares about us, but it's a lie. She doesn't even buy us food anymore. She doesn't even care if we eat." I'm serious, we had PLENTY of food in the house. Good stuff, not just cans of beans, ok... I think we were maybe out of ice cream or something.
He clearly has no respect for you and feels entitled to express this to his brother. I would continue focusing on moving out and worry about mending this relationship at a later time after the dust settles. I now see why you are leaving the kids with him.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sonic_Spork
When I go, it will be with no support whatsoever. Because I can't make friends he doesn't know, he demands I account for all of my time. And if I bring a friend around him, I make another hostage he's got to hurt me with. But it's OK. Because I'm getting to the point where I'm strong enough to do this regardless.
Clearly a very toxic situation you are in and the only way you are going to even have a chance to heal from all of this and find yourself again is by removing yourself from this situation.
You can't force your kids to respect you...they are going to have to figure it out for themselves. You can help by planting seeds for them to think about.
Keep strong and don't let negative posters and naysayers pull you back down. You will get through this and you can have a happy, fulfilled and free life.
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