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I think Pitt Chick expressed it best: Failure to launch is a red flag, regardless of sex or gender.
As always, there WILL be exceptions: Cultural differences, family situations, etc. But there is a reason we call those exceptions.
This doesn't mean, however, there does not exist a downside to the matter, and it is most strongly pushed in our Western culture, especially in America, for kids to GTFO when they hit 18. Hardly a way to promote the institution of 'family' and a reflection on the breakdown of the familial system overall.
I think Pitt Chick expressed it best: Failure to launch is a red flag, regardless of sex or gender.
As always, there WILL be exceptions: Cultural differences, family situations, etc. But there is a reason we call those exceptions.
This doesn't mean, however, there does not exist a downside to the matter, and it is most strongly pushed in our Western culture, especially in America, for kids to GTFO when they hit 18. Hardly a way to promote the institution of 'family' and a reflection on the breakdown of the familial system overall.
Yeah other cultures have it much better, leave school at 10 and support the olds for the rest of your life.
Why do too many women still look at American Men over 35, who don't have their own place like a scarlet letter?
Because it is an indicator of Peter Pan Syndrome, and its not sexy in Milan or Manila or downtown Bangkok either.
too many women - couldn't the problem best be defined as Not Enough Men?
I won't speak to Thai or Italian culture but you are wrong about Filipino culture. Should you leave home without a reason like moving to another province for work with no extended family around they will question your commitment to family in a culture where commitment to family not the opportunity to have extra marital sex without putting it in the face of the elders is honored. Even when married it is not a social no no to stay with one of the sets of parents given the economic realities and the need for often the widowed grandmother to have family around her
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bonnie Jean McGee
Yeah other cultures have it much better, leave school at 10 and support the olds for the rest of your life.
And when you reach elder status the same factors stay in play as the next generation, nieces and nephews if you didn't have children kick in to help rather depend upon the state to care for the extended family. Unlike general American culture where we push kids out at 18 or graduation of high school, whichever comes first and on the other end we send our elders to an elder community to finish their lives with generational peers and not their own grand and great grandchildren around.
It seems this way, except if you're under 35, or if you live in a place with good salaries and a below average costs of living. However, on the flip side, most men do not care if a woman doesn't have her own place, no matter what age.
Now if a man owns a house and rents rooms out, that's not a bad thing, seemingly, other than that, if a 35 or over man, doesn't have their own apartment or house yet, most Women out there judge that when it comes to dating.
This is one reason, why, I hope I'm wrong. Perhaps, some of these women, need to learn what's going on it a lot of major and popular, American Cities (look at the chart below)?
I don't see it getting better, before it gets worse, so let's be fairer to each other?
A guy may have a nice place and their own condo or house, but, if he's living paycheck or paycheck or worse, or working 60 hours or more a week, just to do so, how is that impressive in the female mind (even thought that shouldn't matter that much either)?
I know about the privacy thing and maybe having to work around romantic times, but, there's always hotels, if you're really that bent out of shape about it.
Because like it or not, genetics programs us in such a way that men have a need to kill the mammoth and drag it home...and women have the need to evaluate men based on their ability to kill the mammoth and drag it home. A job is the modern equivalent.
That is who we are as a species, and no amount of evolution or indoctrination is going to get us completely beyond that.
I think Pitt Chick expressed it best: Failure to launch is a red flag, regardless of sex or gender.
As always, there WILL be exceptions: Cultural differences, family situations, etc. But there is a reason we call those exceptions.
This doesn't mean, however, there does not exist a downside to the matter, and it is most strongly pushed in our Western culture, especially in America, for kids to GTFO when they hit 18. Hardly a way to promote the institution of 'family' and a reflection on the breakdown of the familial system overall.
In my neck of the woods we all wanted to GTFO at 18, and there were two viable options: living in a college dorm, or getting an apartment with a couple of friends. Being metro NY, apartments weren't cheap and most of us only made like $6/hour then, but we were willing to pay anything to start adulting. The ideal roommate trifecta involved pooling resources wisely: 1 would had a fake ID, 1 who worked in deli and could bring home free food, and 1 whose parents were redecorating their house and would give you their old furniture.
Last edited by Ginge McFantaPants; 02-27-2016 at 08:48 AM..
In my neck of the woods we all wanted to GTFO at 18, and there were two viable options: living in a college dorm, or getting an apartment with a couple of friends. Being metro NY, apartments weren't cheap and most of us only made like $6/hour then, but we were willing to pay anything to start adulting. The ideal roommate trifecta involved pooling resources wisely: 1 would had a fake ID, 1 who worked in deli and could bring home free food, and 1 whose parents were redecorating their house and would give you their old furniture.
Always, there is a yes-and-no to be considered.
On one hand, given my own situation whereby I lived like a slave -- I wanted to be gone as quickly as possible. My option was a college dorm. The downside was that I had been kept socially and emotionally all but sequestered, and when I was "out" with other children (we're all grown up at 18, but looking back we are all still such children) surrounding me, it was the "Catholic Schoolgirl Effect" and I exploded in utter mayhem that did not bode well for growing up.
In my own situation, back then:
- a farm, plenty of space, there should have been loads of options; we had nearly 1,000 acres, including houses on a couple of those places
- no need to worry about food, IF I lived at home or on one of our places
- would have required gas and a vehicle
BUT:
- in my case, my father was extremely aggressive and proactively sought ways to make me fail, so college would NOT have worked
- life was genuinely miserable for me. Even leaving aside college, growing up would have proved a harsh, downward spiral for me had I remained in that situation
Flash forward to my own son, now approaching 9 years of age, and how I hope things play out.
- 10 acres -- much less acreage, but I am already working on a small, livable "bachelor pad" my son might use in order to live at home but with some actual privacy for a young man
- Living at "home" with some rules and some privacy is a good way to get on his feet while learning the ropes for the world; no need for any of this "GTFO" attitude, enough to start learning to be a man without being tossed in at the deep end of the pool
- fewer bills, no insane need to finish college with $50K in debt
I realize some people come from untenable backgrounds where options are limited less by feasibility, more by the people with whom they must deal. That's my reasoning when it comes to modern America and the GTFO attitude. It's not that kids staying home longer isn't an option, it's that in our prevalently dismissive selfishness and nigh-mythological bent for the tale of the self-made man and independence, kids don't even seem to be welcome in their own families beyond 18.
It makes NO sense to me. It's entirely one thing to be supportive of kids becoming independent, helping them to stretch their wings and launch. It's another to push them off the builder's block because the timbers are nailed, even if we haven't caulked or tarred the belly of the ship.
Not that I think you're even remotely suggesting this; more, just fleshing out my own take on the matter, my questions regarding why we seem so determined to make it happen. Just when did family become such an untenable idea, let alone unpracticed?
On one hand, given my own situation whereby I lived like a slave -- I wanted to be gone as quickly as possible. My option was a college dorm. The downside was that I had been kept socially and emotionally all but sequestered, and when I was "out" with other children (we're all grown up at 18, but looking back we are all still such children) surrounding me, it was the "Catholic Schoolgirl Effect" and I exploded in utter mayhem that did not bode well for growing up.
In my own situation, back then:
- a farm, plenty of space, there should have been loads of options; we had nearly 1,000 acres, including houses on a couple of those places
- no need to worry about food, IF I lived at home or on one of our places
- would have required gas and a vehicle
BUT:
- in my case, my father was extremely aggressive and proactively sought ways to make me fail, so college would NOT have worked
- life was genuinely miserable for me. Even leaving aside college, growing up would have proved a harsh, downward spiral for me had I remained in that situation
Flash forward to my own son, now approaching 9 years of age, and how I hope things play out.
- 10 acres -- much less acreage, but I am already working on a small, livable "bachelor pad" my son might use in order to live at home but with some actual privacy for a young man
- Living at "home" with some rules and some privacy is a good way to get on his feet while learning the ropes for the world; no need for any of this "GTFO" attitude, enough to start learning to be a man without being tossed in at the deep end of the pool
- fewer bills, no insane need to finish college with $50K in debt
I realize some people come from untenable backgrounds where options are limited less by feasibility, more by the people with whom they must deal. That's my reasoning when it comes to modern America and the GTFO attitude. It's not that kids staying home longer isn't an option, it's that in our prevalently dismissive selfishness and nigh-mythological bent for the tale of the self-made man and independence, kids don't even seem to be welcome in their own families beyond 18.
It makes NO sense to me. It's entirely one thing to be supportive of kids becoming independent, helping them to stretch their wings and launch. It's another to push them off the builder's block because the timbers are nailed, even if we haven't caulked or tarred the belly of the ship.
Not that I think you're even remotely suggesting this; more, just fleshing out my own take on the matter, my questions regarding why we seem so determined to make it happen. Just when did family become such an untenable idea, let alone unpracticed?
There's definitely a balance that needs to be struck where kidults can venture out and find their independence, but still have that safety net of being able to return home (or at least to the Bank of Mom n' Dad) if/when they get in over their heads; being young and with no other responsibilities, it's the ideal time in life to screw up, fall flat on your face, and gain invaluable life experience from it.
The common scenario I saw was not so much on the parents wanting their kids to move out, but more of a situation where both parties had a hard time coming terms with the new dynamic of living as an adult under the parents' roof; that awkward balance of being legally allowed to do adult things... but not actually having the freedom to actually indulge in them in your parents house. The issue is compounded in a small home with thin walls. lol.
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