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If those words apply to specific individuals as foreordained to eternal salvation, then it follows that those individuals could never prove unfaithful or fail in their calling, for God's foreknowledge of them could not prove inaccurate and his foreordination of them to a certain destiny could never miscarry or be thwarted. Yet the same apostles who were inspired to write the foregoing words showed that some who were bought and sanctified by the blood of Christ's ransome sacrifice and who had tasted the heavenly free gift and become partakers of holy spirit and powers of the coming system of things would fall away beyond repentance and bring destruction upon themselves. (2Peter 2:1,2 20-22; Hebrew 6: 4-6; 10:26-29) The apostles unitedly urged those to whom they wrote: "Do your utmost to make the calling and choosing of you sure for yourselves; for if you keep on doing these things you will by no means ever fail" also, "Keep working out your own salvation with fear and trembling." (2 Peter 1:10,11; Philippians 2:12-16) Paul who was called to be an apostle of Jesus Christ ( 1 Corinthians 1:1), obviously did not consider himself individually predestined to eternal salvation, since he speaks of his strenuous efforst in striving to attain the goal for the prize of the upward call of God (Philippians 3: 8-5) and his concern lest he himself should become disaproved somehow. (1 Corinthians 9:27)
Similary, the crown of life offered such ones is granted subject to their faithfulness under trial until death. (Revelations 2:10, 23; James 1:12) Their crowns of kingship with God's Son can be lost. (Revelations 3:11) The apostle Paul expressed confidence that the crown of righteousness was reserved for him but only did so when he was certain that he was nearing the end of his course, having run it to the finish. (2 Timothy 4: 6-8)
It's against the TOS to copy and past without giving the source so I'll do it for you. WT god
Oh and by the way, did you know that the JWs, the organisation that you are 'training' to become one of, don't believe that 'God' is always omniscient or omnipresent. To be more specific...he is but only when he chooses to be so (work THAT one out folks). See, if you'd known that you could have saved yourself a lot of sweating trying to answer the questions about his omniscience. you could have waved 'em all away with a simple...'but God didn't want to be omniscient at that time so he didn't know what was going to happen'.
It's against the TOS to copy and past without giving the source so I'll do it for you. WT god
Oh and by the way, did you know that the JWs, the organisation that you are 'training' to become one of, don't believe that 'God' is omniscient or omnipresent. See, if you'd known that you could have saved yourself a lot of sweating trying to answer the questions about his omniscience. you could have waved 'em all away with a simple...'but God isn't omniscient so he didn't know what was going to happen'.
Easy huh?
I didn't copy and paste from any site online. I did however type some words from the pages of one of the Watchtower Bible and Tract Society books "Insight on the Scriptures".
And Rafius, that site you posted is not one of the Jehovah Witness sites. That is a site speaking against the witnesses. There are many sites like that.
It's against the TOS to copy and past without giving the source so I'll do it for you. WT god
Oh and by the way, did you know that the JWs, the organisation that you are 'training' to become one of, don't believe that 'God' is always omniscient or omnipresent. To be more specific...he is but only when he chooses to be so (work THAT one out folks). See, if you'd known that you could have saved yourself a lot of sweating trying to answer the questions about his omniscience. you could have waved 'em all away with a simple...'but God didn't want to be omniscient at that time so he didn't know what was going to happen'.
Easy huh?
To answer your omniscient or omnipresent mention. If he predestined every thing, there would be no reason for things like prayers, asking for forgiveness, trying to teach others etc. We really would have no freewill. Everything with us as humans would be pointless and so unfair. God isn't unfair though.
And Rafius, that site you posted is not one of the Jehovah Witness sites. That is a site speaking against the witnesses. There are many sites like that.
To answer your omniscient or omnipresent mention. If he predestined every thing, there would be no reason for things like prayers, asking for forgiveness, trying to teach others etc. We really would have no freewill. Everything with us as humans would be pointless and so unfair.
By jove! I think you're finally getting there.
Quote:
God isn't unfair though.
Isn't he? Punishing the innocent for the crimes of the guilty!! You call that fair?
Isn't he? Punishing the innocent for the crimes of the guilty!! You call that fair?
I see alot of unfairness in the world but I can't blame God, he didn't sin. He gave our perfect parents everything, they didn't think it was good enough. I blame them and I blame Satan but God will one day soon, end all suffering and the Earth will eventually be made into a paradise. I hang onto that hope because it's closer than what happened all those thousands of years ago, which we can not change, no matter how much we talk about it. The future is the most important and what we do now, is a matter of life and death.
I see alot of unfairness in the world but I can't blame God, he didn't sin. He gave our perfect parents everything, they didn't think it was good enough. I blame them and I blame Satan but God will one day soon, end all suffering and the Earth will eventually be made into a paradise. I hang onto that hope because it's closer than what happened all those thousands of years ago, which we can not change, no matter how much we talk about it. The future is the most important and what we do now, is a matter of life and death.
.......and you know this how?
How do you know that you may not have to wait thousands of more years (supposing it was going to happen at all)
.......and you know this how?
How do you know that you may not have to wait thousands of more years (supposing it was going to happen at all)
Look at the state of the world. Trust me. I'm sure we are not far off from the return of the Lord. IMO, I think he's coming in less than 5 five years. It could be this year for all we know.
Your team have been saying that for the last 2000 years.
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