Everything from nothin????????? (soul, hell, contradiction, Christianity)
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I am not sure what this means. Matter and energy can not be created or destroyed is a law of science but I am not sure how you go from that to thinking this means the light from your flashlight should not exist? Can you elaborate your thinking here a little for me?
I believe the light does exist. And I also believe the poster who states nothing exist is pretty far out on his tree branch. Which he would say does not exist either.LOL I wonder how many years of public school he attended? What a waste of tax dollars.
......if matter can be formed from such things as quantum fluctuations in vacuum fields,entropy swaps or what have u...how does nothing become inorganic matter with no inherent information encoded and then result in biological entities capable of consciousness, self awareness, and rational thought..there must be an answer...but "it just happened" is not very satisfying to me, though scientists might understand it...why is the universe not just a chaotic mess of rock and gas, or nothing at all???
I offered some possible answers to these questions in my earlier posts (#29 and #51). These might not be the right answers, but I think they are better than “God did it.” In any case, it would be helpful to me if you could indicate exactly what you see as the flaws in my approach. Here are snipits from each post:
#29
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gaylenwoof
Chaotic systems are, by their very nature, order-making. Furthermore, the order that emerges from chaos is intrinsically unpredictable, thus there can be no "divine plan" unless the "plan" is simply to set the ball rolling and see what happens.
#51
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gaylenwoof
The universe as a whole is a "perpetual motion machine" and what we understand as the laws of thermodynamics are statistical patterns that emerge from this perpetual motion.
So my rough answer to your final question "why is the universe not just a chaotic mess of rock and gas, or nothing at all???" would be this:
The universe is a chaotic mess, but chaotic messes tend to generate patterns, and we already know, via mathematical proof, that a chaos consisting of just a few simple rules is capable of generating infinite complexity (i.e., capable of generating as much or more complex order as we see in the physical universe today).
As for the "nothing at all" option, the very same question can be asked of a theistic theory: Why does God exist, rather than nothing at all? There is no reason that "God" is a better option for "uncaused cause" or "eternal nature of Being" than some sort of qualitative chaos.
my only argument to think that Krishna is real is through the science of mantra meditation...
I studied and practiced Yoga meditation for a couple of years and I have a great deal of respect for insights gained through meditation and various sorts of "divine revelation" but...
The human mind interprets experiences within a context. My own intuition is that you and many other mystics have experienced deep contact with the nature of "God" (or whatever one wishes to call the foundational source of qualitative experience/subjectivity). But various mystics from various traditions come up with significantly different conceptions of God (Jewish mystics, Christian mystics, various sorts of Eastern mystics, new age mystics, and so on) Why so many different views of an ultimate, unified reality? It's not because God is hiding, nor is it because one interpretation is correct and the others are all wrong. Rather, I would say it is more like the classic story of the blind men and the elephant. Each comes into contact with a different part. A leg and a tail have very different properties, and lead to different understandings of the elephant, but this doesn't mean that the elephant was not directly experienced in some fashion.
One problem is that people are so awestruck by their experience that they think their experience was the whole of the elephant, which (in their minds) implies that anyone who has an inconsistent experience must be wrong. In this way, a truly profound and real insight becomes warped into a "religion" with a "my way or the highway" view of the world. As soon as the mystic says "this is the whole and final truth" or "this is the one and only true path" then he/she enters into foolishness.
I believe the light does exist. And I also believe the poster who states nothing exist is pretty far out on his tree branch. Which he would say does not exist either.LOL I wonder how many years of public school he attended? What a waste of tax dollars.
I believe the light does exist. And I also believe the poster who states nothing exist is pretty far out on his tree branch. Which he would say does not exist either.LOL I wonder how many years of public school he attended? What a waste of tax dollars.
You were gullible enough to believe all the NAMI ark hoax stuff, which has been shown to be false. So you know, it's not unreasonable for someone to think you're going to claim other outrageous things as well.
I studied and practiced Yoga meditation for a couple of years and I have a great deal of respect for insights gained through meditation and various sorts of "divine revelation" but...
The human mind interprets experiences within a context. My own intuition is that you and many other mystics have experienced deep contact with the nature of "God" (or whatever one wishes to call the foundational source of qualitative experience/subjectivity). But various mystics from various traditions come up with significantly different conceptions of God (Jewish mystics, Christian mystics, various sorts of Eastern mystics, new age mystics, and so on) Why so many different views of an ultimate, unified reality? It's not because God is hiding, nor is it because one interpretation is correct and the others are all wrong. Rather, I would say it is more like the classic story of the blind men and the elephant. Each comes into contact with a different part. A leg and a tail have very different properties, and lead to different understandings of the elephant, but this doesn't mean that the elephant was not directly experienced in some fashion.
One problem is that people are so awestruck by their experience that they think their experience was the whole of the elephant, which (in their minds) implies that anyone who has an inconsistent experience must be wrong. In this way, a truly profound and real insight becomes warped into a "religion" with a "my way or the highway" view of the world. As soon as the mystic says "this is the whole and final truth" or "this is the one and only true path" then he/she enters into foolishness.
I can agree and think above is a very good thought. Hatha yoga was my interest with some of the meditation. I think the "my way or the highway" is an indication of not reaching the trueness in meditation. The buzz in a
busy life can become too loud. When a little stillness is achieved in quiet meditation the contrast becomes a learning experience. The elephant idea is a perfect analogy of almost everthing that man learns. Theres no way an effective venture to peace of mind is without meaning .
I offered some possible answers to these questions in my earlier posts (#29 and #51). These might not be the right answers, but I think they are better than “God did it.” In any case, it would be helpful to me if you could indicate exactly what you see as the flaws in my approach. Here are snipits from each post:
#29
#51
So my rough answer to your final question "why is the universe not just a chaotic mess of rock and gas, or nothing at all???" would be this:
The universe is a chaotic mess, but chaotic messes tend to generate patterns, and we already know, via mathematical proof, that a chaos consisting of just a few simple rules is capable of generating infinite complexity (i.e., capable of generating as much or more complex order as we see in the physical universe today).
As for the "nothing at all" option, the very same question can be asked of a theistic theory: Why does God exist, rather than nothing at all? There is no reason that "God" is a better option for "uncaused cause" or "eternal nature of Being" than some sort of qualitative chaos.
Just out of curiosity, if the organizing ....was predictable how could the process in creation remain un-determined ?
Universe out of simple rules. The distraction I have to this is in the gravity issue to unification. There is clearly superpartner involvement as well
clear suspicion of an all together new ...law of the universe.
The book is wide open in gravity re, sub-nuclear scales
To create this Planet and universe it takes energy and matter. Both of which on an physical and biological and down to the elements make us who we are. All the energy around us and inside us gives life to all objects we see and can't see in this existence. Alot of these theories just as the one I'm making up comes from inside us, our brain or just knowing on a natural level we are connected to everything.
This energy doesn't die because it would need another energy to destroy it. We as humans will die physically and our energy will be transferred to the energy of this universe and beyond that. I believe the physical can with energy see the past, present and future on a time warp level being that our connection to the energy of the universe is stronger then we think. This can explain over many thousands of years civilizations showing a connection the stars and using precise mathematical astronomic maps of the stars. In all the stars, planets, galaxies and time and space this plan, energy and chaos and randomness points you home.
The human experience is all we know.. disconnected, lost, cold, hungry, the sadness and the happiness of just living and at one time making it to your next meal. GOD sent his son to experience life as a human he would know what you know and what it was to be human. He would know the loss, the pain, the sadness and things that make us smile. With knowing and being lost without purpose let God's son experience why we as humans live with.
Hate, kill, rape, cheat, lie, steal, love, care, hope, survive another day hoping to find the answer to the energy that created the only world we ever knew. It is left to us to find our way in this life, it is short in the time line of eternity. Because we are alone as a people we look to fill that hole in knowledge and science to believe there is more. Some old to religion of which is basically the idea that some energy "GOD" is with you so you are not alone, not scared, not afraid to understand and hope for guidance. We all want to believe but with millions and years and a universe in change we still haven't understood our inner voice guiding us this is not GOD it is you. You your energy and those energies past and future time asking you, to listen. It is only in times of great stress and question do I ask for guidance. Even if its a simple possible outcome and even the choice I make will be and can be corrected with time and new choices for my future. Science creates laws and holds the theory of what it can prove but even they are listening to a inner voice helping them with the emotional emptiness of being alone this is their task and their order.
Fear drives those to extremes, alarming and controlling mankind to believe the answer to this state of being comes in the form of a text book or a bible. Both bible and science books are limited and both are from the minds of humans with unfinished thoughts and theories.
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