Incarnate Word Student Killed During Traffic Stop (Howe: landscaping, authority)

[majormadmax]

Originally Posted by dba07

And furthermore, it would be a fantastic world if we didn't have no knock invasions, or harmless pets and unarmed people shot by cops.

Someone who is beating someone else with a baton is not "unarmed."

You also seem to be unaware of the fact that an expandable baton can kill someone just as much as being shot.

Police officers are trained to use them in a manner calculated to reduce lethality, by aiming for the bony areas of the body: the wrist, elbow, collarbone, ribs, head and knee. Muscle strikes will cause pain, but not nearly as incapacitating as bone strikes.

However, in the hands of an untrained individual, their use--especially strikes to the areas of the head, neck or spine--are generally considered as probable lethal force.

Actually, the Texas Penal Code (§46.01) prohibits carrying "any instrument that is specially designed, made, or adapted for the purpose of inflicting serious bodily injury or death by striking a person with the instrument" by a civilian in public, it is a felony of the third degree (per §46.02).

[dba07]

Originally Posted by majormadmax

Someone who is beating someone else with a baton is not "unarmed."

You also seem to be unaware of the fact that an expandable baton can kill someone just as much as being shot.

Police officers are trained to use them in a manner calculated to reduce lethality, by aiming for the bony areas of the body: the wrist, elbow, collarbone, ribs, head and knee. Muscle strikes will cause pain, but not nearly as incapacitating as bone strikes.

However, in the hands of an untrained individual, their use--especially strikes to the areas of the head, neck or spine--are generally considered as probable lethal force.

Actually, the Texas Penal Code (§46.01) prohibits carrying "any instrument that is specially designed, made, or adapted for the purpose of inflicting serious bodily injury or death by striking a person with the instrument" by a civilian in public, it is a felony of the third degree (per §46.02).

I'm plenty aware how deadly they can be. Did he possess a weapon? You've got to be a pretty lousy cop to lose your weapon to an allegedly drunk individual.

My point stands. This better be investigated properly.

[majormadmax]

Originally Posted by dba07

I'm plenty aware how deadly they can be. Did he possess a weapon? You've got to be a pretty lousy cop to lose your weapon to an allegedly drunk individual.

My point stands. This better be investigated properly.

Doesn't matter how he acquired it, the fact that he did and was using it against the officer means he was armed and not "unarmed" as you claimed.

And don't worry, it will be investigated properly. Every shooting is...

[bspray]

Originally Posted by Mom2Feebs

This is true.



This is true.



This is not true.



We really don't know that yet. You could easily have written with much the same assumptions: "Regardless, someone lost their life because they were drunk and attempting to beat/strangle/murder a cop during a routine traffic stop."

Just sayin'.

So I am guessing you have some sort of proof that the student was drunk or were you saying the cop was drunk? I am guessing you are also clairvoyant and are able to determine that the student was attempting to beat/strangle/murder? We absolutely don't know that the cop was being honest about the much smaller person being able to take his baton from him. All we have is the word of someone that had just committed murder. I don't think it is a stretch to wonder if he perhaps fabricated some or all of his story. There isn't even any proof that the student was driving erratically.

All we have is the word of a cop that had just murdered someone. A cop that was incapable of performing a routine traffic stop. We also have several different sources stating that a significantly smaller, college student, on the dean's list at UIW was completely unaggressive by nature. Sure, why not take the word of a university cop who had 9 jobs in 8 different police depts over the last 7 years over the honor student? That is perfectly logical.

I would have a lot more respect for the law enforcement officers on this forum if they were honest and said this whole situation doesn't pass the sniff test and there is at least probably cause to investigate but no, they go on and on about the deceased being drunk, (no proof of that) how likely it was that the student was in the wrong and amazingly, that the student deserved to get shot. Absolutely friggin amazing. These are the people patroling the streets of San Antonio and so many sheep here are so quick to agree with them.

Just sayin'.

[bspray]

Originally Posted by majormadmax

Doesn't matter how he acquired it, the fact that he did and was using it against the officer means he was armed and not "unarmed" as you claimed.

And don't worry, it will be investigated properly. Every shooting is...

You have proof that the UIW student did this other than the word of the person that just killed the student?

[*mud*]

Originally Posted by bspray

So I am guessing you have some sort of proof that the student was drunk or were you saying the cop was drunk? I am guessing you are also clairvoyant and are able to determine that the student was attempting to beat/strangle/murder? We absolutely don't know that the cop was being honest about the much smaller person being able to take his baton from him. All we have is the word of someone that had just committed murder. I don't think it is a stretch to wonder if he perhaps fabricated some or all of his story. There isn't even any proof that the student was driving erratically.

All we have is the word of a cop that had just murdered someone. A cop that was incapable of performing a routine traffic stop. We also have several different sources stating that a significantly smaller, college student, on the dean's list at UIW was completely unaggressive by nature. Sure, why not take the word of a university cop who had 9 jobs in 8 different police depts over the last 7 years over the honor student? That is perfectly logical.

I would have a lot more respect for the law enforcement officers on this forum if they were honest and said this whole situation doesn't pass the sniff test and there is at least probably cause to investigate but no, they go on and on about the deceased being drunk, (no proof of that) how likely it was that the student was in the wrong and amazingly, that the student deserved to get shot. Absolutely friggin amazing. These are the people patroling the streets of San Antonio and so many sheep here are so quick to agree with them.

Just sayin'.

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if you don't mind, would you please elaborate??

this is getting good............
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[staunchcharacter]

Originally Posted by HeadedWest

It's working.

Actually, it's not working. It's a sad admission and says everything we need to know about this person.

[Mom2Feebs]

Originally Posted by bspray

So I am guessing you have some sort of proof that the student was drunk or were you saying the cop was drunk? I am guessing you are also clairvoyant and are able to determine that the student was attempting to beat/strangle/murder? We absolutely don't know that the cop was being honest about the much smaller person being able to take his baton from him. All we have is the word of someone that had just committed murder. I don't think it is a stretch to wonder if he perhaps fabricated some or all of his story. There isn't even any proof that the student was driving erratically.

All we have is the word of a cop that had just murdered someone. A cop that was incapable of performing a routine traffic stop. We also have several different sources stating that a significantly smaller, college student, on the dean's list at UIW was completely unaggressive by nature. Sure, why not take the word of a university cop who had 9 jobs in 8 different police depts over the last 7 years over the honor student? That is perfectly logical.

I would have a lot more respect for the law enforcement officers on this forum if they were honest and said this whole situation doesn't pass the sniff test and there is at least probably cause to investigate but no, they go on and on about the deceased being drunk, (no proof of that) how likely it was that the student was in the wrong and amazingly, that the student deserved to get shot. Absolutely friggin amazing. These are the people patroling the streets of San Antonio and so many sheep here are so quick to agree with them.

Just sayin'.

Uh...no dude. I said three things, and you're getting all of that from those three? Wow. Again, lots of assumptions, on both sides. Calm down. Jeez.

[WilGar]

Again, even if the student were drunk, the officer had no right to execute him. How an officer twice the size of the student let the situation get out of hand that he had to resort to lethal force is laughable, if it were not so tragic?

If the officer were so inept or so out of shape that he could not handle the situation singularly, then he should have remained in his car with the doors locked until the Alamo Heights police responded. He had the entrance of the apartment complex blocked.

I am also questioning the officer's account of incorrect cross streets to the AHPD.

Did he not have GPS?

Wass he so unfamiliar of the area, that he was unaware of where he was?

Was his only experience of driving on Broadway going to Whataburger or the donut shop?

[gtoman67z]

16 pages of speculation and subsequent accusations....suggest we take the unfortunate young man's parents advice and withhold judgement pending release of the investigation's results.