FEMA to confiscate food from local farms during "emergencies"? (farming, acre)

[FreedomThroughAnarchism]

Originally Posted by Themanwithnoname

I can't speak for what she's talking about, but it's in line with the current FEMA/Fed Disaster relief policies.

FreedomThroughAnarchism:
Not saintly Gov't...
Not practical from a logistical standpoint.

What concerns me more (at least when confining my concern to pragmatic issues) has less to do with seizures, as they are logistically difficult to accomplish on any wide scale, but more to do with legislation (particularly when the current jurisprudence pretty broadly allows that change) that lets government control things by simply passing the law.

The power to legislate broadly shifts the burden of forcing compliance from the government onto the citizens. That makes governments job orders of magnitude easier, as government doesn't really have to 'do' anything (meaning no "seizures" are really even necessary, per se'). Almost all of the work gets done for them, by the majority of citizens who do not wish to run afoul of the law, and who then dutifully comply.

Mass seizures of private property that is (or was, until a legislative shift) ostensibly considered legal (which again - is always subject to the winds of legislative change) are rare in the United States. While it occasionally happens, it is considered the far outset of government conduct (the exception, not the norm). Legislation, in contrast, that is where bulk of the practical threat lies. It provides a very pragmatic and effective mechanism to get what government wants, and though certain laws are often considered "unenforceable," that doesn't really change the fact that most people will still probably comply, because there are just enough people that equate legal with moral or ethical.

On any given day, I spend almost no amount of time worry that government might ban my Fruit Loops cereal under the guise of it being "unhealthy." I spend even less time worrying about them actually coming to seize my Fruit Loops cereal (And I bet that plenty of farmers prior to the Agricultural Adjustment Act of 1938 would likewise have never given a second thought to the almost laughable notion that anybody would ever tell a farmer that he couldn't do something as simple as grow wheat on his own farm for personal consumption). I do, however, spend quite a bit of time recognizing and having some appreciation of the gravity of the situation that they do, thanks to jurisprudence, have pretty broad authority to (a) legislate upon, or even (b) control via the regulatory regime (see: "4-Loco" alcoholic beverage for just a small taste of the latest regulatory regime control example), matters that skirt fairly close to liberties I have come to appreciate, such that even if they have not sought to make them the object of control at the immediate point in time, there are certainly politicians (and regulators for various agencies) out there who we all know for a fact, are quite keen to exert control over all manner of things. What is not a law today, or tomorrow, could be the object of control next year, or the year after that (a concern all the more worrisome when they do, in fact, have the power to pass such laws under current jurisprudence).

[Themanwithnoname]

Originally Posted by monkeywrenching

try reading executive order 10998. tells alot about what the feds can in fact do.

we can all thank slick willy for that eo.

Ya'll don't get me wrong. I Love my country, but I fear my Government.

However, Having spent 8 years in the Corps, and having worked in EMS, and now back in school for Emergency Management, and having worked regional and local exercises...


Door to door just isn't gonna happen.


FreedomThroughAnarchism:
There's alot I agree with in your last post.

What people CHOOSE to do is their own lookout. I'm just addressing what I'll be forced to do. (Through force or threat)

And there just isn't enough force to threaten...

[lifelongMOgal]

Originally Posted by monkeywrenching

try reading executive order 10998. tells alot about what the feds can in fact do.

we can all thank slick willy for that eo.

I had to look that one up. Thanks, at least I know my question wasn't completely left field.

John F. Kennedy: Executive Order 10998

[monkeywrenching]

Originally Posted by lifelongMOgal

I had to look that one up. Thanks, at least I know my question wasn't completely left field.

John F. Kennedy: Executive Order 10998

sorry, thought it was slick willy, not jfk.

[PaulHatchen]

Ya, I read it and it seems to be based more on one farmers opinion rather than actual facts.

[Mac_Muz]

I should say here now and forever that the stupidity of my part, was because i wrote in anger. The idea that anyone can just come to where I live, and take what they want so long as their jacket has 3 letters on the back just toasts my buns.

[lifelongMOgal]

Originally Posted by monkeywrenching

sorry, thought it was slick willy, not jfk.

From what I'm readying I think nearly every POTUS since Nixon has added in more controls via executive order for federal "emergencies".

I understand what previous posters are sying about it be logistically impossible. My concern is that it is not unheard of innot so distant past for the crops and land of farmers to be seized and nationalized or just flat out given to others. IIRC, Zimbawe and South Africa.

[Countrysue]

If the government does confiscate-to-redistribute food at a national level, what happens at the local level? Government confiscates agribusiness output, state confiscates family farm output . . . .

I don't think a person with a garden is necessarily in trouble, but I think local farms are.

I worry more that individuals who can't get the food they are accustomed to buying will start to complain about 'those greedy country people who are probably hoarding food so they can sell it at an inflated price'!

[ChrisC]

I think the above discussion is another good motivation for becoming a proficient forager for edible wild plants. I'm just getting started and I can see it's going to take me a couple of years, at least, to get even a minimum level of ability. It's nothing to take lightly. But, I'm pretty excited. I didn't realize the HUGE array of wild plants that can be eaten. Sure, I knew about dandelion and a few other "weeds," but there are so many others. Yeah, some are common weeds. But so many more out there. Thousands. From what I've read, the best choices actually taste better than the cultivated plants we currently eat.

I don't see the government being able to do a damn thing about someone eating "weeds." There are very few experts on the matter out there, so they wouldn't know which plants to confiscate. Most folks wouldn't consider eating "weeds" anyway.

It's a skill worth considering.

[Mac_Muz]

Originally Posted by Countrysue

If the government does confiscate-to-redistribute food at a national level, what happens at the local level? Government confiscates agribusiness output, state confiscates family farm output . . . .

I don't think a person with a garden is necessarily in trouble, but I think local farms are.

I worry more that individuals who can't get the food they are accustomed to buying will start to complain about 'those greedy country people who are probably hoarding food so they can sell it at an inflated price'!

I think it would create a mess. Since I do re-enactments and events called Ron de Voo And at both types of events there are days open to the public, and I have in excess of 30 years doing these events now. It is common to hear the strangest questions and comments.

The people have no clue where things comefrom. That isn't the case in these pages where the people do.

But I have met face to face people who wonder how you can cook over coals in a fire, a rel wood fire, People who don't know milk comes from cows and think it's made in plastic bottle or wax coated boxes. I mean really they do! They think meat comes in tidy styrofoam dishes wrapped in clear plastic too. Hell this stuff has a USDA Seal on it so it must be made by the Govt right?

I get comments as "I bet you will be happy when this event is over so you can go to a McDonalds and get REAL FOOD!

I ain't stepped a foot in a a micky D's in better than 2 decades! That stuff is pure posion, and used to give me a hangover. By God if I am going to suffer a hangover I am going to do something to deserve it! I prefer to go very hungery than eat that crap.

2 years back the Feds were talking about bannin little guys like me that grow things to eat harvest to harvest, since none of got the SEAL.

All I can say is let them try. I doubt the govt knows what harvest really is and when it can take place for that matter.

Sure no doubt, the hungery will say those who grow and labor to do so are just hording, while they infact have no idea how much work goes into it, because they don't and probably can't.

Here as of recent time, we have a odd house guest of the LL's. I am not sure about this city girl a bit. She was informed the food she is eatting was made here as was th soil. We have around 40 pounds of last harvest taters and 'New Taters' right now to harvest simply coming from excess soil in the compost.

So what does she do, but go buy a 10 pound bag anyway...... and one you can't grow a tater from if you try, I know because I tried. These store bought taters just turn to shoe sole lkeather if you plant them. They are treated with growth inhibitors and all mannor of insect killers not to be found in what I grow.

I won't eat them.

Yesterday she was weeding what was a flower garden my wife and I abandoned, and we gave to her for her own use which is to just grow thing people don't eat. She asked what to do with the weeds and the soils she raked out, and i said 'compost pile'. She looked stunned.

She places any items she wants in the common trash too, and I can't get her to stop. She puts in items not her own and that belong to anyone, which causes me to have to sort trash, but then she throws out items of further use as if it were nothing.

I cautioned her on doing that, and told her anything you can compost shall be composted. It doesn't sink in.

She doesn't know you can compost cotton, or first charr it. The same for papers and cardboard, and around here we need soil. There is and will be projects that require soil forever here. The soil she threw out was soil I made 3 years ago. I can make better stone free soil than can be bought.

To me this situation is most perplexing, as I never had to deal with a person of this mindset before. That is somehow, store bought stuff is the better stuff, and the home made stuff is worthless.

I expect the members of the powers who be are of the same mind set. They wouldn't know a ready taters in the compost from a tater full of chems and posion in a bad on the shelf.

Main steam food is just that fodder for the masses. The people who now are just finding out men grow breasts when they eat it. Fine by me , but don't expect me to eat it.

IMO in any city water you are self medicating too, there is simply all meds in the water these days. The Govt created that mess, and every single paper note there is in anyopnes wallet contains trace amounts enough of drugs to get anyone busted. The Govt created that too.

So any day the Govt wants they can come take my wallet test the notes and bust me for illicit drugs.

It's just another means of controll. I expect one day we will be 2 types of people, those who are controlled because they are petty criminals and the rest Govt workers. All for controll.

People just don't know. That same goes for paper notes. Most people alive today have never once handled a real dollar. You can't convince then of this no matter what is said. The last note which represented a dollar was printed in 1957. It was backed in silver. Ever since the poor excuse first as 'United States Note' last printed by the Feds, who evidently got nervous about printing fake money, so it was turned over to the Fedral Reserve, NOT any part of the Govt, has just become weaker and more feeble, but people won't listen.

People no longer understand wealth, and a month ago I watched a women drop 500 bucks on junk plastic in walley world as if it was nothing.

PC's TV's, cars and motor cycles are not wealth not even close. There is myraids of junk and clutter which is worthless and people buy this crap and want more every day. They just don't know.

I didn't know either, but after getting smashed to bits at work and getting cheated by AIG, then divorced for lack of ability to be a walking wallet, I found out. I found out what I needed to survive and then to live and I found it all in the forest.

I could be in partial disability but my stubborn pride won't allow for it.

With my Govt lable of Pre-existing condition I can not buy heath insurance or apply to any job and get hired. For a long time that confused me.

It still has an effect on me as I can't buy industrial insurance either. I just find ways and means around all that to live. I am determined to not end up any part of the problem, but it sure isn't easy.