FEMA to confiscate food from local farms during "emergencies"? (chicken, cows)

[Ode]

Originally Posted by Themanwithnoname

Methinks not.
Someone comes to my door, having all the cards on their side...

that's fine, they won this round. There will be tomorrow, and I don't keep all my eggs in one basket.

I know, right? To stand and fight because you have no other choice is one thing...If you know you or your family will definitely be dead in a matter of minutes so you may as well make them pay as dearly for that as you can is one thing. To initiate that level of conflict when you and yours could safely walk away is another thing entirely.

Mac states he has multiple camps (12) that are well stocked with survival supplies, food that is easily gatherable surrounding each camp, and the survival skills to utilize them for as long as necessary. He has also often stated that surrounding his home that he has plenty of natural food to forage and only has his garden because it is easier. No offense here, but many many times you have clearly stated you are capable of living off the land in comfort at any time including making your own clothing. If you indeed have these skills then defending a garden with deadly force seems an exercise in testerone-laden mannish puff-uppery. It simply isn't necessary. If you can live better and do have this forage surrounding you (and such a thing is indeed very possible, and can actually be planted by anyone as a just in case type of plan for emergencies), why throw away your life in such a needless fashion just because the garden is yours? It makes no sense.

One would think that if a person had that skillset along with the practical smarts to see something bad coming down the pike, that the garden would be lying fallow and all supplies aside from enough for only a few days would be in several safe and well-hidden locations rather than out in the open where it is plain to see. You would be better off uprooting everything in your garden and then making it look as if you hadn't had the time or energy to get around to planting that year. And holding out your hand and asking when they might be coming back to give you and your family your share of the local goods, because as they can clearly see you only have a few days worth of food left and you are worried.

If you must fight, fight smart not foolishly. Play their game on their terms and come out ahead instead.

[SCGranny]

Don't be silly. The WalMarts are still full of South American and Chinese imported foods. People are still donating to the Red Cross and other organizations. Other people are still getting their Welfare checks. There is no major disaster that would 'justify' even the loosest demand for martial law.

Yet.

[Ode]

Originally Posted by SCGranny

Don't be silly. The WalMarts are still full of South American and Chinese imported foods. People are still donating to the Red Cross and other organizations. Other people are still getting their Welfare checks. There is no major disaster that would 'justify' even the loosest demand for martial law.

Yet.

Yet being the operative word. I really don't see any disaster aside from something really huge and really bad that would have us see such measures being put into action. Which is why I believe that if such events were to transpire, any reasonably prudent person might see the possibility of officials coming to see what resources might be available on their property. It just doesn't make any sense to have a needless fight over a small patch of ground and its contents. Or your food stores for that matter. Any smart person, particularly in rural areas where you generally don't have a dozen or more neighbors able to see your actions, would simply find a way to hide their resources. It isn't a crime to put your own family first and make sure of their safety and health before donating excesses to charity for those who have nothing. I could easily feed my entire neighborhood for a day or three before my pantry would empty. After that we would all starve. On the other hand, I could feed my family for a few months from my pantry, though the meals would be quite boring. Barring the complete destruction of our pantry that is. Such a thing could happen. Look at Joplin...anyone there with any preparation for possible disasters lost their emergency supplies unless they were buried or in an underground shelter. How many people routinely bury their emergency supplies? I know I don't, they are kept in totes for quick access and moveability in the event those supplies are needed or we might have to evacuate.

[Countrysue]

I and my friends have cached food in our backyards. I don't do it for survival reasons, but because I have a small house with limited storage. Around here, outbuildings are taxed if they are larger than 10 x 10, or 100 square feet.

I have taken extra canned food and put it in a small garbage can, then buried the can. I buy a small garbage can with a lid, dig the hole, put in the can, then fill with food. A piece of plastic is placed over the top of the can, then the top is forced on to make a tight fit. Just fill in the hole. I have never had any of the cans break.

I have neighbors who put things in PVC pipe. Cap both ends, and bury. I can't vouch for that, never used it.

[Mac_Muz]

Originally Posted by Ode

I know, right? To stand and fight because you have no other choice is one thing...If you know you or your family will definitely be dead in a matter of minutes so you may as well make them pay as dearly for that as you can is one thing. To initiate that level of conflict when you and yours could safely walk away is another thing entirely.

Mac states he has multiple camps (12) that are well stocked with survival supplies, food that is easily gatherable surrounding each camp, and the survival skills to utilize them for as long as necessary. He has also often stated that surrounding his home that he has plenty of natural food to forage and only has his garden because it is easier. No offense here, but many many times you have clearly stated you are capable of living off the land in comfort at any time including making your own clothing. If you indeed have these skills then defending a garden with deadly force seems an exercise in testerone-laden mannish puff-uppery. It simply isn't necessary. If you can live better and do have this forage surrounding you (and such a thing is indeed very possible, and can actually be planted by anyone as a just in case type of plan for emergencies), why throw away your life in such a needless fashion just because the garden is yours? It makes no sense.

One would think that if a person had that skillset along with the practical smarts to see something bad coming down the pike, that the garden would be lying fallow and all supplies aside from enough for only a few days would be in several safe and well-hidden locations rather than out in the open where it is plain to see. You would be better off uprooting everything in your garden and then making it look as if you hadn't had the time or energy to get around to planting that year. And holding out your hand and asking when they might be coming back to give you and your family your share of the local goods, because as they can clearly see you only have a few days worth of food left and you are worried.

If you must fight, fight smart not foolishly. Play their game on their terms and come out ahead instead.

Little bit of error which is my fault. The 12 camps are not well stocked, they are 3 days MRE's and assorted small supplies, as sewwing kits, spare small knives, some medical supplies like kotex in case i get shot or cut myself with my own axe. A 1/2 pint each of 151 Bacadi rum or graves 100 % for either med uses or just saying the hell with it, and getting slammed if I happen to feel like, which is not my norm a bit, but in SHTF I might.
There is bits of raw hide as apx 12 inch circles rolled up in each ammo box. This raw hide can be used for lashing of a bow drill string. Bow drill stings are the hardest tool for me to get in SHTF. All the rest of that tool set is easy to come by. Cotton and synthetics are slippery and slippery strings are not much use in bow drill fires. The wrong string is useless. because it will break or it will slip. So with a 12 inch circle I can slice off string material going round and round the circle for around 6 + feet, fold that in 1/2 and cord the now 2 strings to be one round string almost twice as thick.
There are files, flints and steels (18th century type), just about anything you can fit into a ammo box made of steel and with a air tight seal.

Each camp is designed to be lost, and just force a move to the next if that happens to be. The idea is I can stay at each one, which is higher that most surrounding points and also has natural fresh drinking water, for 1 month. Since there is 12 camps, and 12 months I can stay out a year, adding what else I know.

Almost none would would know they were standing in a camp setting of mine, and i am sure over the years people have, because I find trash they drop.


Gathering depends on the season. I can gather fiddleheads in early spring, but not after. I can tap sugar maple in earlier spring but not after, except for a very short 'run' in late October, and that's a maybe. If you hunt deer, and find a 'rub', bark scrapped off a tree, and that tree happens to be a sugar tree you can see and then tast amber beads of sugar at that time. This would never be commercial, or even much for a hobbist.

At other times depending, there is mushrooms, cat tail sprouts, later cat tail roots, and so on, but gathering is only done in what ever's seasons.

You can bank on getting cold, wet, tired and hungery.

You can not count on fresh meats, fish or fowel anytime. Any time you have such it is a luxury, and should be used as much as possible.

All this is making me hungery, I think maybe I will have dandilion leaves and milkweed pods for breakfast ;D

Harvesting every possible item any animal has to offer. Fish can make a good glue. Snakes have meat, hides and smaller bones to be made into tools or fishing equipments. Deer are a walking tool chest and supplies.

Antler is the traditional stone knappers best friend. Rounded river rocks made of granite are another knapping tool a hammer stone, but these don't do refined work.

The other day I made a stone blade from 'Blue Stone' a fairly local stone created by the Ossipee Volcano. I have been using that blade to harvest moss, apx 200 sq feet of the stuff, for my lenai. So far glancing it on other rocks cutting moss free from the ground no damage has occured to this blade yet.

Bugs are edible and I have eatten some I don't even know what they were Some are better than others. Some seem to be better than they are which depnds on just how hungery you are.

And so on.

The Garden. I just figure i made the soil, did all the labor and that it is illegal for anyone to just come here and take it.

Depending on how that might happen, would surely influence how I saw fit to defend it best. Sure 100 fema agents could show up and clean me out in a few hours. That would be easy.

But that might start a war. I would know ahead of time because thousands of others would have already been raided, and I would prefer to share with them more than the predators of Govt.

Fema should know some people are not helpless and would fight back. Liberty and Freedom are best fought over a set of iron sites, than by tuckin tail to run and hide, but then it depends. Maybe fighting another day is better, but rolling over isn't going to get you there either.

And yes I do hand sew from head to toe. I can machine sew too.

If anyone wants they can go to this link
Pictures by Mac_Muz - Photobucket


All albums are open: and even kiddie safe... unless pics of weapons are tabboo.

There you can see a lot of things my hands made. If it looks like you can't buy it at walmart there is a good chance I made it.

Knives, silver work, all sorts of clothing, some black powder guns, powder horns, the Balmora hats, glass and stone points... My wifes dresses I do the bead work too.

All that stuff is just the tip of a iceburg.

Some items are real antiques. All the trade beads are, the French and Indian War French Partisian is, so if there is a question on if I made it just ask.


Each camp is designed to be lost, and just force a move to the next if that happens to be. The idea is I can stay at each one, which is higher that most surrounding points and also has natural fresh drinking water, for 1 month. Since there is 12 camps and 12 months I can stay out a year, adding what else I know.

[Mac_Muz]

Originally Posted by Countrysue

I and my friends have cached food in our backyards. I don't do it for survival reasons, but because I have a small house with limited storage. Around here, outbuildings are taxed if they are larger than 10 x 10, or 100 square feet.

I have taken extra canned food and put it in a small garbage can, then buried the can. I buy a small garbage can with a lid, dig the hole, put in the can, then fill with food. A piece of plastic is placed over the top of the can, then the top is forced on to make a tight fit. Just fill in the hole. I have never had any of the cans break.

I have neighbors who put things in PVC pipe. Cap both ends, and bury. I can't vouch for that, never used it.

I am not sure where you live and I don't need to know. But I have the idea you live in NH... Even if that is wrong there are grain stores now carrying used Greek Origin Food safe 55 gallon plastic drums/barrels.

Clarks in NH has these for 16 bucks each. The barrels are a earth red brown color, have large covers with seals (check for the seals as some are missing) there is a large lock ring that screws on and in theory these are air tight.

The mouth of the barrel is large enough with some wiggling I could crawl into one, but I am far to stiff to fold up and be entirely in one, but a 12 year old kid sure could. That is for telling a size, don't go stuffing kids in any barrel drums.

I bought 2 for maple sugar sap storage, then more for leather storage, which takes the space of 2.5 barrels. My wife says we are storing winter clothing in one set aside for sap, but right now it is collecting solar heat for the green house tent, but that is about a done deal, so it's open for winter clothing.

Since you dig up a hole in the ground you could lay in these barrels so the covers are just above the ground and build a tent platform for a screen house to cover them. Maybe done in differetn ways depending on the type of 'stores' adding a layer of straw as top most insulation would be of some use, but i can't say.

I used hay when I had a horse at primitive events as a cooler, and could keep foods on ice for over 10 days and not carry a modern cooler. If there is a hill on your place you might consider laying thse on their sides too and have another way to camo the covers.

[Ode]

Mac, if you feel that your local resources are not sufficient for your needs, start planting in your area with things that need no tending to prosper and will self-propogate. Wild leeks, onions, garlic. Berries. Sunchokes. Nut trees. Various starchy wild tubers and plants. Queen Anne's lace, aka wild carrots. Jerusalem Artichoke. You can also find what domestic plants that are usually grown for ornamental purposes can be eaten, and plant a wild garden with as many of these as possible. Landscape with some sand cherry bushes. Buy chamomile and pineapple plant seeds, and sow them throughout your lawn. In shaded areas plant wild strawberries. Get mushroom starts and put them throughout the woods in the deadfall. Buy a few batches of pheasant and quail eggs, hatch them and raise them then let them go. How about ducks and turkeys?

You might not actually need any of these, in all probability you won't. If so, you have some wildlife to admire, and maybe even hunt on occasion. You will have wild plants to enliven your landscape but can also be harvested if you wish.

And for your caches, why not add some 550 paracord, and firesteels? Or maybe a fire piston? How about some tinder? You do have cattails you said, the fluff makes an excellent tinder. But you could just as easily make some char cloth, which will store forever.

[Countrysue]

We have a camp further north from where we live. Basic supplies are cached there.

Everything else is in our bug out bag. By the way, the first time we tried to load the originial bug out bag stuff, we discovered it wouldn't all fit!

We cached stuff at the camp, deleted them from our bug out bag and made sure we could fit the remainder in our car!

We bury the small, plastic cans you can buy at feed and hardware stores. I think they are 32 gallon cans. None of them have ever been disturbed. Forcing the lid down over a piece of plastic makes a suitable seal. Nothing has ever spoiled.

Right now, we are living in a small town on the north side of Lake Ponchartrain, opposite New Orleans. We plan to make the camp our retirement home. It is far enough from a small city that I feel safe; close enough that we can get medical care.

Unlike the government, we learned from Katrina.

[Mac_Muz]

Ode you a Buck Skinner? You have done considerable study. And yes I have planted wild plants where they will grow spreading out resources. I make 18th century fint and steel sets. I run a hand crank Buffaloe Forge. I commonly use cotton rags as old dish towels and that like for shop rags, then char cloth them.

I suspect you know this, but if you don't it is possible to char the cloth and not totally cook all of it, leaving it a dark brown that will burst into flame on the charr it self with no other tinder.

Another trick I pull sometimes to make char with a bow drill and stop before I have built a coal, and then use that char to catch spark from flint and steel sets.

At this point I know we both could write a book and still not get it all. I have and do use 550 cord, but thatr stuff is lousey for a bow drill string. Yeah it can be done, but so can a board and splindle made of hard rock maple, but no one would want to.

I have seen fire pistons before and consider them a gimmick, but I have enough interest to build one. I have access to touch wood too, a fungus that can catch spark un-charred.

With that or charred cloth I can get spark from my Swiss Army Flintlock tool

I am a Buck Skinner and a Historical Re-enactor, and have been for so long it has past any hobby stage and become a life style.

A disclaimer needs to be mentioned on Queens Anne's Lace. You can eat it, but only in moderation. Same thing for Bracken / Brake fern.

We have so-called wild turkey here now, the state brought them back and they are doing well. We have natual woodcock and ruffed grouse too, but no matter how many there are, still one can not count on having them every day for foods.

You have no profile, so may I ask a state where you are, so I can get a rough idea on what's what?

Anyway, I have Beech Trees, red, black, and pin oak, but no white, so while all these nuts can be eatten, the local oaks need blanching.

The slowly coming along flower garden also has herbs. The reason this garden is slow is the main garden got too big and is almost a full time job for 2 as it is now. The day lillys take a 2nd seat under eatting, compared to more normal foods as corn and taters and that like.

The upper 1/2 of NH is loaded with wild foods, but to get them you have to hunt and gather, and so staying in just one place won't really work.

If you eat every fiddlehead in a lot, then that lot is gone.

This is how I harvest touchwood. I use a small folding hand saw and cut off what i want, leaving the rest to grow back over time. The only time I take it all is if the tree has died and is laying on the ground. I am not sure it's wise to infect other trees, so I don't.

Jas Townsend on line sells it or they did. Touch wood can be used as a tea drink and to hamper skeeters and is said to be used to treat cancer. I think I won't try that treatment, since I have to get cancer first.

Besides not being able to create a 100% full list which atleast for me is impossible, I know a few other tips I feel are best kept a secret. These might be related to plants for hunting wild game, where toxins are created to stun game, and in the wrong hands would be over used in a wrong way. I had to work to learn, just like you, so you must be able to understand that.

Man there is everything to learn, which stones make which tools, which woods make the best of what ever, and how to tell these trees no matter the time of year. All the plants and which are good for eatting, which are good for meds and which are just a fun old High high high... I don't do that last bit. And then Book learning is just that. Next comes hands on.

I was at the Washinton DC Smithsonian and saw their idea of the fire drill board set up! LOL what a disaster that would be. Theirs was a ivory wallrus tusk with a larger rib bone drill. That much was fine, but the tinder was scattered all over the top of the board and wrapped on the splindle. Turning the splindle would have scattered the tinder any place other than where you would want it.

No one reading any book and then not building a bow and board to mess with, will take a year to get it figured out. There is 1 right way, and 1,001 wrong ways. I know a few guys faster than me, but I get fire in 120 seconds with time to rest every time I want a fire this way.

Face to face I can teach anyone semi fit to do this in around 3 hours. I think I could teach this in 3 weeks on line, but so far no one has asked or wanted to when offered.

With stone mounted to a spindle I have drilled sea shells and made earrings for my wife. Which reminds me I must get time to finish my coyotte toe bones choker

[Mac_Muz]

Countrysue that's right you suffered Katrina. I have CRS.