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17.4 million people haven't changed their minds and I think the result of any second vote would be exactly the same, even some remain voters just want it done and over with. people have had 45 years of deciding what they think of the EU and knew very well what they were voting for.
Actually they don't have to, parliament is sovereign in this country (for better or worse, but that's another debate) and referendums are only advisory. Of course not all 17.4m people will have changed their minds, but some, mostly among those who voted leave thinking we would get the nice easy deal promised by many in the leave campaign preserving many of the trade advantages of the EU while getting rid of free movement etc, will have changed their minds now its obvious that isn't going to happen and a no deal is the only realistic form of Brexit on the table. Plus there are the shifting demographics as people who were 15-17 at the time of the referendum can now vote while around 1.5m mostly older voters in 2016 are no longer with us.
As Nigel Farage said in 2016 before the referendum 'a 52-48 result will leave it very much unfinished business', he was right.
We can talk about the ins and outs of this issue until we are blue in the face. But, the one thing I know, is that we are going to leave the EU. The Tory government have twisted in the wind, and sacrificed two Prime Ministers on the alter of Brexit.
The EU election results tomorrow night will focus minds. Nigel Farage has swore to destroy the Tory party if they don't implement the 2016 vote result. They know now, he has his finger on the pulse of angry citizens.
I am now sure, we will leave the EU, with or without a deal. It's all about damage limitation now.
Liam Fox has called for a clearing out from Downing Street of advisers still harbouring doubts over us leaving the EU.
The new PM has to surround him or her self with can do people, instead of closet remainers. The Tories know they are in big trouble now, and could be decimated in a General Election.
Time to get on with it, and end our time in the EU. We have time to prepare as best we can, then leave without a deal at the end of October.
Until the will of the people from the 2016 vote is carried out, politics cannot move on in this country. I think the penny has finally dropped. We need someone with guts and determination now to lead. I just hope and pray, the Tories can find someone up to the task.
I think even the EU know now that a General Election, installing a craven Corbyn as PM is not going to happen. There is not going to be a second vote. They are not going to get their £39 billion eagerly anticipated. Let them do their worse, we will survive it, and prosper in the long run.
Actually they don't have to, parliament is sovereign in this country (for better or worse, but that's another debate) and referendums are only advisory. Of course not all 17.4m people will have changed their minds, but some, mostly among those who voted leave thinking we would get the nice easy deal promised by many in the leave campaign preserving many of the trade advantages of the EU while getting rid of free movement etc, will have changed their minds now its obvious that isn't going to happen and a no deal is the only realistic form of Brexit on the table. Plus there are the shifting demographics as people who were 15-17 at the time of the referendum can now vote while around 1.5m mostly older voters in 2016 are no longer with us.
As Nigel Farage said in 2016 before the referendum 'a 52-48 result will leave it very much unfinished business', he was right.
Actually among my friends and associates the reverse is true. I never voted for Brexit, and to be honest could have gone either way, but given the manner the EU has conducted itself, I'm firmly leave, as has happened with most I know whose position has changed. Sure I know leavers who are still leavers, and remainers who are still remainers, but the majority whose position changed went from remain to leave.
Whether that's just because of British bloody mindedness, or like me not wanting to tie the destiny of the country to a self demonstrating herd of donkeys in Brussels, is debatable, but what isn't is the numbers. I'll also add, that quite a few only admit their leave opinion to close friends, since there has been a campaign to paint the Brexit camp as xenophobic alt-right. I suspect if polled in an opinion poll, they'd abstain, or lie.
Actually among my friends and associates the reverse is true. I never voted for Brexit, and to be honest could have gone either way, but given the manner the EU has conducted itself, I'm firmly leave, as has happened with most I know whose position has changed. Sure I know leavers who are still leavers, and remainers who are still remainers, but the majority whose position changed went from remain to leave.
Whether that's just because of British bloody mindedness, or like me not wanting to tie the destiny of the country to a self demonstrating herd of donkeys in Brussels, is debatable, but what isn't is the numbers. I'll also add, that quite a few only admit their leave opinion to close friends, since there has been a campaign to paint the Brexit camp as xenophobic alt-right. I suspect if polled in an opinion poll, they'd abstain, or lie.
I would guess there is a similar attitude in America about Trump. Most agreeing with their left wing friends and work colleagues, that he has to be voted out, then quietly voting for him when the time comes.
I believe you are right about the EU, and their attitude before, and after the 2016 vote. Plus the way they treated Theresa May. She should never have gone running when they crooked their fingers. I try and picture Margaret Thatcher being treated in a similar manner. She wouldn't have put up with half what Theresa May did.
The leave voters are hardening in their attitude now. As you say, British bloody mindedness is coming into play. It's the 75th anniversary of D-Day on June 6th. This should remind us of the sacrifices made by a previous generation for us who were yet to be born. It's time we stood up for ourselves, and showed some guts.
Actually among my friends and associates the reverse is true. I never voted for Brexit, and to be honest could have gone either way, but given the manner the EU has conducted itself, I'm firmly leave, as has happened with most I know whose position has changed. Sure I know leavers who are still leavers, and remainers who are still remainers, but the majority whose position changed went from remain to leave.
Whether that's just because of British bloody mindedness, or like me not wanting to tie the destiny of the country to a self demonstrating herd of donkeys in Brussels, is debatable, but what isn't is the numbers. I'll also add, that quite a few only admit their leave opinion to close friends, since there has been a campaign to paint the Brexit camp as xenophobic alt-right. I suspect if polled in an opinion poll, they'd abstain, or lie.
Well, let's say we hold a vote on it to check if you are correct or not! Otherwise that's just an interesting anecdote.
Well, let's say we hold a vote on it to check if you are correct or not! Otherwise that's just an interesting anecdote.
No point, a majority was inconclusive according to folks who want a second referendum.
Another majority regardless of the decision will be equally inconclusive.
That's the issue of claiming the first result was inconclusive. Using the same method to measure the same criterion using a self stated compromised method is futile. Don't you agree?
It wasn't inconclusive because of the narrow margin, it was inconclusive because of the very loose notions of what 'leave' would actually entail. Now we know with much greater certainty what leave will look like, and what it definitely can't look like, so the vote will be one on concrete realities rather than vague and often contradictory ideas.
And sure, if in 5 years time the public changed their mind and wants to leave then have another vote on it.
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