[flu189]

I personally don't miss living in NYC, but have some great memories and then some not so great ones of growing up there. I was always interested in the history and infrastructure. For those from NYC, and especially those who remember NYC from 30 or more years ago I recommend you go to the Forgotten ny website for great profiles and pictures from all five boroughs.

[sevdie]

I agree with you. For me there were some good times and some horrible pure heck times. I would never live in NYC again, but at the same time I would not trade my being born and raised there for ANYTHING at all. I will check out the site you suggested. Thanks.

[giselle]

I always love visiting NYC, but when I am there, my entire being is in complete overdrive. If I lived there, I would implode.

[NYtoVT]

I don't know if this subject has been touched on yet but as the screen name implies I moved here from NY. In the area that I came from in NY, you couldn't tighten a doorknob without a long and ardous process that involved hearings before any number of boards and commisions along with notification to neighbors within what seemed like a 10 mile radius. Over-regulation ?. Sure appeared that way. I came to Vermont and was interested to see that in many towns (especially the sparsley populated ones), land use was only very generally regulated. As long as you conformed to the very general use of the zone you were in (1 family in a one family zone, etc) you were OK. You buy your home, enjoy the peace and tranquility that is Vermont and life is good. Now what happens if a property that adjoins you is sold and the new owners decide to grade their back yard and put in an ATV track. They ride ATV's with their attendent noise with no concern for your peace and quiet that you came to Vermont for in the first place. What can you do about it ?. Basically nothing. Sure, you can talk to them and ask them to tone it down but if they thumb their nose at you you're basically out of luck. Going before the local Selectboard with your complaint will be fruitless because of the lack of regulations. There ARE very general noise regulations but if the ATV riders are within the limits of the law, they can continue to make your life miserable.
What happens if your new neighbors decide to let the property fall into disrepair (which can happen quickly here) ?. The manicured lawns that the old neighbor worked so hard to create and maintain are now scarred and leveled for their ATV track. They now have 5 junk cars on the property and the reason you moved to Vermont is now just a memory. You basically have very little recourse.
The bottom line is that in at least the semi-rural areas, you are NOT guaranteed that what you buy now will have the same appeal in the future.
Some towns that I am familar with have JUST started to enact junk ordinances but enforcement is spotty amd selective.
I guess this all boils down to one thing. I disliked NY for all the regulations that local governments put on land use. I would suggest however that some basic regulation is in order. I'm sure the old-timers here will say that more research should have been done. I agree.

[middle-of-nowhere]

I'm not originally from the NYC area, but I have lived in large cities for all but 4 years of my life. I was born and raised in a city of 10 million people in Asia, then I moved to the NYC area. I also partially lived a few months in DC and studied for 2 years in Buffalo, NY. For me, Buffalo was already a "really small town" just the first time I was there.

I've been in Burlington for almost a year now, and I'm really just starting to get adjusted. If anything, I think it's only really hitting me now how much I do miss the big city. Small college towns, such as Burlington, used to fascinate me and when I landed a job at the state's largest employer, it seemed like a great deal. The first time you see Church Street and the Waterfront, it will wow you.

Fast forward 9 months later: Now, I'm terribly missing New York, or any other large city for that matter. Everytime I drive down to Boston or New York, I always wish I could go back to that type of life. I miss the fast-paced atmosphere. I miss being able to choose among so many different activities in the weekends which you don't have to take your car to. I miss mingling with younger people with greatly different backgrounds. I miss Chinatown, Central Park, the Subway, Broadway, South Street Seaport, and so much more.

Living in Vermont does have it's advantages. And for people who do love a small town atmosphere, Vermont does seem to have lots of "big city"-like things to do, but on a much smaller scale. I do actually find Vermont a bit more lively than Buffalo, a metro area of much greater size than the Burlington area. People also are generally nicer, which is always good... I wish the people in New York were nicer to each other. But really, everything else counted, I really miss New York a lot.

[arel]

New York is a pretty angry place at times. Just check out the NYC forum and see how nasty some of the threads can get, especially with regard to racial issues. The only nastiness I experienced in Brattleboro was being tailgaited and honked at - by a car with New York license plates.

I live in southern Brooklyn, which is more suburban and provincial than Manhattan and some other parts of Brooklyn. If I want to do anything, I have to travel for about an hour to get there by train. And often the trains are late and/or crowded. Sometimes they stop and stay put for a while. On the weekends they often detour. If I take the car, I have to worry about losing time in traffic and in looking for parking. Yesterday, I missed doing things I had planned, simply because I was tired and didn't feel like dealing with any of that.

When I visit my friend in Brattleboro, she talks frequently about all the things to do there. And she lives within walking distance of Main Street. We can get to Brattleboro places in about 10 minutes, including the time spent parking the car. That's an amenity I do not have in NYC.

But, truthfully, I do find the slowness and of life in Vermont a little irritating at times. But does that mean Vermont is too slow, or that I, the New Yorker, need to calm down?

Regarding food, there is great food in Vermont. But there is not the extraordinary diversity of restaurants that there is in New York. But how many restaurants do you need? In Brattleboro, there is Italian, Chinese, Thai, Indian, American and more that I haven't seen. There is fine dining, there are other places. There is the Food Co-op. There is the Farmers' Market. We have farmer's markets in New York, too. One is an hour away from me, in Union Square. The other I know of is in a school yard about 2-3 miles away from me. Probably good stuff (I haven't gone there, but I know the area.) But it is in an ugly setting.

You don't have the world class museums, world class arts and world class everything else in a small town that you have in a place like New York. And you don't have the sheer magnitude of choice in food or activities. But, realistically, how much choice do you really need, unless you have specific tastes that can only be met in a big city? Brattleboro has a cosmopolitan population, lots of local arts, and (well, I have to admit this) relative closeness to NYC.

Now, if only the local bagels didn't taste funny.

[chaz longue]

Originally Posted by NYtoVT

I don't know if this subject has been touched on yet but as the screen name implies I moved here from NY. In the area that I came from in NY, you couldn't tighten a doorknob without a long and ardous process that involved hearings before any number of boards and commisions along with notification to neighbors within what seemed like a 10 mile radius. Over-regulation ?. Sure appeared that way. I came to Vermont and was interested to see that in many towns (especially the sparsley populated ones), land use was only very generally regulated. As long as you conformed to the very general use of the zone you were in (1 family in a one family zone, etc) you were OK. You buy your home, enjoy the peace and tranquility that is Vermont and life is good. Now what happens if a property that adjoins you is sold and the new owners decide to grade their back yard and put in an ATV track. They ride ATV's with their attendent noise with no concern for your peace and quiet that you came to Vermont for in the first place. What can you do about it ?. Basically nothing. Sure, you can talk to them and ask them to tone it down but if they thumb their nose at you you're basically out of luck. Going before the local Selectboard with your complaint will be fruitless because of the lack of regulations. There ARE very general noise regulations but if the ATV riders are within the limits of the law, they can continue to make your life miserable.
What happens if your new neighbors decide to let the property fall into disrepair (which can happen quickly here) ?. The manicured lawns that the old neighbor worked so hard to create and maintain are now scarred and leveled for their ATV track. They now have 5 junk cars on the property and the reason you moved to Vermont is now just a memory. You basically have very little recourse.
The bottom line is that in at least the semi-rural areas, you are NOT guaranteed that what you buy now will have the same appeal in the future.
Some towns that I am familar with have JUST started to enact junk ordinances but enforcement is spotty amd selective.
I guess this all boils down to one thing. I disliked NY for all the regulations that local governments put on land use. I would suggest however that some basic regulation is in order. I'm sure the old-timers here will say that more research should have been done. I agree.

Great post

But I guess you haven't gotten the message that the "eco nuts" have ruined VT with thier "over regulation"...

[chaz longue]

"You don't have the world class museums, world class arts and world class everything else in a small town that you have in a place like New York. And you don't have the sheer magnitude of choice in food or activities. But, realistically, how much choice do you really need, unless you have specific tastes that can only be met in a big city? Brattleboro has a cosmopolitan population, lots of local arts, and (well, I have to admit this) relative closeness to NYC."

I'd only make one revision to your thoughtful post, Arel, and it's not so much a disagreement as a clarification: It's not that we don't have "world class museums, world class arts and everything else..." in VT.
It's that there's just not the staggering variety in VT that NYC has to offer.

Thanks,
David

[chaz longue]

Originally Posted by middle-of-nowhere

I'm not originally from the NYC area, but I have lived in large cities for all but 4 years of my life. I was born and raised in a city of 10 million people in Asia, then I moved to the NYC area. I also partially lived a few months in DC and studied for 2 years in Buffalo, NY. For me, Buffalo was already a "really small town" just the first time I was there.

I've been in Burlington for almost a year now, and I'm really just starting to get adjusted. If anything, I think it's only really hitting me now how much I do miss the big city. Small college towns, such as Burlington, used to fascinate me and when I landed a job at the state's largest employer, it seemed like a great deal. The first time you see Church Street and the Waterfront, it will wow you.

Fast forward 9 months later: Now, I'm terribly missing New York, or any other large city for that matter. Everytime I drive down to Boston or New York, I always wish I could go back to that type of life. I miss the fast-paced atmosphere. I miss being able to choose among so many different activities in the weekends which you don't have to take your car to. I miss mingling with younger people with greatly different backgrounds. I miss Chinatown, Central Park, the Subway, Broadway, South Street Seaport, and so much more.

Living in Vermont does have it's advantages. And for people who do love a small town atmosphere, Vermont does seem to have lots of "big city"-like things to do, but on a much smaller scale. I do actually find Vermont a bit more lively than Buffalo, a metro area of much greater size than the Burlington area. People also are generally nicer, which is always good... I wish the people in New York were nicer to each other. But really, everything else counted, I really miss New York a lot.

I adore NYC too.
But since it's closer (and in a weird way, can seem even more cosmopolitan), have you spent much time in Montreal?

[middle-of-nowhere]

Originally Posted by chaz longue

I adore NYC too.
But since it's closer (and in a weird way, can seem even more cosmopolitan), have you spent much time in Montreal?

I've been to Montreal a few times and it's a wonderful city to visit, but crossing the border is a hassle from time to time. Also, a lot of my friends in the area are on work visas, and for some complications, they can't readily go to Canada. At least not yet. I also don't know anyone in Montreal.

When your heart pines for NY, no other city just cuts it. I'll make an exception though for Boston, I really love that city too... and it's closer to drive than NY from Burlington.