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I experience the same confusion over sentiments like after a disaster, where many people have killed, someone was lucky to survive and they say "God was watching out for me." And ... what about the people who died? I'm sure they'd love the chance to be alive and say the same thing.
“If you pray for rain long enough, it eventually does fall. If you pray for floodwaters to abate, they eventually do. The same happens in the absence of prayers.”* (much like a broken clock having the correct time twice a day
-- Steve Allen (1921-2000)
"If you talk to God its call prayer. If God talks to you its called paranoia."
--* Anon.
*"The definition of "atheist" does not encompass anything more than a non-belief in god. There are no atheist rituals, holidays, worship ceremonies, mantras, prayers, holy books, priests, or anything else that is normally associated with religion (even though not all religions have all these things, atheism as an idea incorporates none of these things)."
*-- Anon.
“The next time believers tell you that 'separation of church and state' does not appear in our founding document, tell them to stop using the word 'trinity.' The word 'trinity' appears nowhere in the bible. Neither does Rapture, or Second Coming, or Original Sin. If they are still unfazed (or unphrased), by this, then add Omniscience, Omnipresence, Supernatural,Transcendence, Afterlife, Deity, Divinity, Theology, Monotheism, Missionary, Immaculate Conception, Christmas, Christianity, Evangelical, Fundamentalist, Methodist, Catholic, Pope, Cardinal, Catechism, Purgatory, Penance, Transubstantiation, Excommunication, Dogma, Chastity, Unpardonable Sin, Infallibility, Inerrancy, Incarnation, Epiphany, Sermon, Eucharist, the Lord's Prayer, Good Friday, Doubting Thomas, Advent, Sunday School, Dead Sea, Golden Rule, Moral, Morality, Ethics, Patriotism, Education, Atheism, Apostasy, Conservative (Liberal is in), Capital Punishment, Monogamy, Abortion, Pornography, Homosexual, Lesbian, Fairness, Logic, Republic, Democracy, Capitalism, Funeral, Decalogue, or Bible.”
-- Dan Barker* (1949)
“I noticed that all the prayers I used to offer to God, and all the prayers I now offer to Joe Pesci, are being answered at about the same fifty percent rate. Half the time I get what I want, half the time I don't...Same as the four-leaf clover and the horseshoe...same as the voodoo lady who tells you your fortune by squeezing the goat's testicles. It's all the same...so just pick your superstition, sit back, make a wish, and enjoy yourself...”
-- George Carlin (1937-2008)
‘If God listened to the prayers of men, all men would quickly have perished: for they are forever praying for evil against one another.”
--* Epicurus* (341-270 BC)
“A prayer is an attempt by a petitioner to convince an all-knowing and all-powerful* ‘invisible friend in the heavens’ to change his game plan to one which is more beneficial to their own.”
-- Kent Forrest (1942- )
"I have relatives who say that their "God" can do ANYTHING when addressed by a loving believer. They claim their prayers have been answered for cancer cures, money, common colds, etc. So it has always been a challenge to them when I ask them to pray for the return of a lost limb by a young veteran friend. Evidently "God" has a hard time dealing with observable issues."
-- Kent Forrest (1942- )
Just a few quotes From my hobby of collecting quotes over a lifetime
Location: NYC based - Used to Live in Philly - Transplant from Miami
2,307 posts, read 2,766,789 times
Reputation: 2610
Quote:
Originally Posted by mordant
I always heard it told as "yes, no, or not right now". When put this way it makes the result of prayer completely identical to random happenstance, but they don't seem to see the irony in that. I think that you get so beaten down by these illogical non-sequiters that you just don't even engage your brain.
I am configured such that when I was a Christian, after a decent sampling of prayer results, maybe the first 30 or so, I never really expected god to actually do anything as he was way too unreliable / random. It became a sort of open secret among believers, who come, I think, to regard prayer as more a wish and a hope than an actual request in an actual response queue. The proof being that no one actually lives as if an answer is forthcoming. You pray for healing but still take them to the hospital for cancer treatments. You pray for "wisdom for the doctors" but you still get a second opinion. You pray for their survival but still are filled with anxiety about their likely demise. You grieve as if there were an afterlife but unless you are on death's door yourself an afterlife is cold comfort after all the broken promises of protection, help in times of trouble, health, prosperity, wisdom, guidance and comfort.
I was willing to go along to get along until there were some things in my life that I really, really needed and when I didn't get them, people I cared about suffered greatly and even died. After that I couldn't abide it at all. I saw no reason to keep up the fiction either for my benefit or anyone else's.
I agree with the highlighted part in red. I grew up in a christian family and still call myself a christian. But what you describe in red is really what I feel. I even asked my pastor about it.
I can just replace Christian God to any other God that I want; say that bag of Doritos I have on the table. I can pray to it as my god and ask that tomorrow it will be raining. If it is raining tomorrow, then yes God Doritos answer my prayer. If it is not raining, then the God Doritos say either it's not the time yet to rain or simply no. So if that's the case, how do you know the Christian God we pray to is the real one, not that bag of Doritos or that crazy bag lady on Market Street. I can't really articulate what I try to convey - but you guys get the point.
Anytime I ask this to my pastor at church, he always deflected.
OH well maybe that's why I become cynical...
Location: NYC based - Used to Live in Philly - Transplant from Miami
2,307 posts, read 2,766,789 times
Reputation: 2610
Quote:
Originally Posted by karen_in_nh_2012
Actually, the God of most religions (including fundamentalist Christianity) seems to be a nasty, mean jerk. I've never understood why people feel that such a "god" is worth worshipping?
Do you seriously believe what you write? It makes no sense.
Thanks, all, for letting me vent!!
I also feel that way. Here's my rant now.
As a gay man who am a Christian, there are alot of times I ask that to myself.
So God created me to be gay, and now He wants me to live as a celibate until I die since having a homosexual relationship with my partner is sinful?
Basically He wants me to live partner-less and end up taking care of myself when I am old and unable to do anything? He wants me to die in loneliness since I am sure by then my parents are gone and I cannot have a life partner?
That is a cruel God. So basically He created me this way so that I can suffer.
I swear sometimes the only reason why I am a christian is because my parents are. And I have a slight hope that once I die, I we will be reunited with them somewhere above.
In that any and all assertions made about the existence or character of god can only be ungrounded assertions, all religious answers are going to be silly. Any attempt to explain god's motivations for something will always be the explainer's guess. never anything substantial and backed by evidence. Any attempt to identify the hand of god at work, any attempt at explaining the structure of the deity..all guesswork based on the assumption that god's motivations are congruent with human motivations. The Holy trinity is a silly idea, predestination is a silly idea, virgins waiting in the afterlife for martyrs to blow themselves up is a silly idea, heaven and hell are silly ideas, that god loves you or to what degree he does so is a silly idea.
When it comes to theology, it is an equal opportunity dynamic, everyone can be ridiculous and no one is any more ridiculous than anyone else.
I also feel that way. Here's my rant now.
As a gay man who am a Christian, there are alot of times I ask that to myself.
So God created me to be gay, and now He wants me to live as a celibate until I die since having a homosexual relationship with my partner is sinful?
Basically He wants me to live partner-less and end up taking care of myself when I am old and unable to do anything? He wants me to die in loneliness since I am sure by then my parents are gone and I cannot have a life partner?
That is a cruel God. So basically He created me this way so that I can suffer.
I swear sometimes the only reason why I am a christian is because my parents are. And I have a slight hope that once I die, I we will be reunited with them somewhere above.
Time to come over to the dark side!
This is it, your one and only life. No evidence of an afterlife and god belief is all a lie. Nothing is planned for you so just live for today and enjoy what you can get out of it.
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