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What I find interesting about the Tea Party and the race issue is that their racial slip ups occur so regularly and yet are denied by their adherents. Let's get real here, we've had fiscal conservatives in this country since the very beginning and nobody called them racist. I have no beef with fiscal conservatism and read columns by them all the time. I like and admire George Will and liked and admired Bill Buckley. Heck I could even see the good points of someone like Barry Goldwater. I even agree with some of their views, not often, but I could understand their point and admire the cogent way in which they argued them. I've not heard anyone call any of these men racist and I would submit that they were very much the standard bearers for fiscal conservatism. I've watched Republican conventions and other gatherings for years, and even when Reagan launched his presidential bid in Philadelphia MS where Goodman, Schwerner and Chaney were martyred you didn't see signs and the type of racial polemic you see at Tea Party gatherings. You don't see people showing up with AK-47s talking about "Taking Their Country Back." During the run up to the health care debates I was absolutely terrified that someone was going to be killed.
Yet every time you turn around some Tea Party leader or favored candidate is caught demonstrating the type of blatant racism that we haven't seen in this country for decades. Whether it's circulating photos of the First Lady morphed into a gorilla or showing the front lawn of the White House as a watermelon patch there's no way to mistake these people's mindset. Even if it were the "lunatic fringe" of the movement that initiates this stuff why is it being passed on by its leaders. If it were an occasional "slip," much like Trent Lott's comments about Strom Thurmond I could ignore it as individuals "going rogue," but it happens continuously.
And this issue has hit home strongly with me. Two dear friends of mine have been caught up in the Tea Party frenzy. It hurts and troubles me deeply. They are both fiscal conservatives that I've been friends with for more than a decade. The fact that they're willfully ignorant of this group's issues with race has driven a deep wedge between us. I fear, and have feared for some time that if we don't get a grip on this situation this country is going to find itself knee deep in a civil war.
Last edited by RoslynHolcomb; 10-14-2011 at 09:39 AM..
Oh please. You are effin kidding me, right? How about a credible source with some actual facts and not BS supposition?
"The data suggests that people who are Tea Party supporters have a higher probability"—25 percent, to be exact—"of being racially resentful than those who are not Tea Party supporters," says Christopher Parker, who directed the study. "The Tea Party is not just about politics and size of government. The data suggests it may also be about race."
If you look at the actual statements, policies, and candidates who are aligned to the tea party, it is not in the slightest about race. It is about gov't spending and taxation run a muck. Now, if some ignorant people interpret that in ways that are not intended, then that's their own issue. If saying the gov't taxes and borrows too much and spends too much is racist, then count me in and order my white sheet. Some people can make everything and anything about race because it obscures from the true substance.
Oh please. You are effin kidding me, right? How about a credible source with some actual facts and not BS supposition?
"The data suggests that people who are Tea Party supporters have a higher probability"—25 percent, to be exact—"of being racially resentful than those who are not Tea Party supporters," says Christopher Parker, who directed the study. "The Tea Party is not just about politics and size of government. The data suggests it may also be about race."
If you look at the actual statements, policies, and candidates who are aligned to the tea party, it is not in the slightest about race. It is about gov't spending and taxation run a muck. Now, if some ignorant people interpret that in ways that are not intended, then that's their own issue. If saying the gov't taxes and borrows too much and spends too much is racist, then count me in and order my white sheet. Some people can make everything and anything about race because it obscures from the true substance.
I guess you can't read very well, because you seem to be having trouble making the distinction between Tea Party and Tea PartiER.
But see Neil, here's the thing. If the TP was really about fiscal conservatism where were they when true fiscal conservatives were screaming from the rooftops as George Bush was running up deficits like sailors on shore leave? He ran up deficits not seen since Reagan. If they have beef with health care reform I would think they would've been immolating themselves on the White House lawn when Bush expanded Medicare prescription drug benefits, thus running up insane deficits because he cut taxes at the same time. Yet, somehow there's no Tea Party, no "taking their country back," no AK-47s, etc...until Obama was elected. I find their timing more than a bit suspect, especially when you combine it with candidates like Ron Paul who have a history of making questionable racial statements. And if people really made a habit of calling fiscal conservatives racist then the ones I named would've been draped in sheets a long time ago, yet they haven't been. Because true fiscal conservatives are fair and even minded. They call out BOTH PARTIES when they get out of line. These people aren't fiscal conservatives, they're just Republicans and not particularly bright Republicans at that. Their motives are totally transparent to anyone who cares to look.
Quote:
If you look at the actual statements, policies, and candidates who are aligned to the tea party, it is not in the slightest about race. It is about gov't spending and taxation run a muck. Now, if some ignorant people interpret that in ways that are not intended, then that's their own issue. If saying the gov't taxes and borrows too much and spends too much is racist, then count me in and order my white sheet. Some people can make everything and anything about race because it obscures from the true substance.
Last edited by RoslynHolcomb; 10-14-2011 at 10:09 AM..
It is about gov't spending and taxation run a muck.
Really? Taxation has run a muck? Are taxes much higher now than they were previously? Please explain.
I saw on the news last night a quote from a call-in viewer regarding the transit spending here in Atlanta. His quote was "Why do taxes have to go up? Taxes ALWAYS go up! They NEVER go down!" This is one of the single most ignorant statements I've heard in a long time, and part of the complete misinformation being spewed by many groups.
Taxes, at least income taxes, are at their lowest level almost ever. The last time taxes were this low was in the few years before the Great Depression (I'm sure there was no correlation whatsoever). And during the 50 years after that, they were nearly double what they are now (and for some time even more than that), and the country did just fine....dare I say much BETTER than it's doing now. So spare me the BS about how taxes are too high and lowering them will help everyone. It's a complete falsity proven time and time again.
Oh please. You are effin kidding me, right? How about a credible source with some actual facts and not BS supposition?
"The data suggests that people who are Tea Party supporters have a higher probability"—25 percent, to be exact—"of being racially resentful than those who are not Tea Party supporters," says Christopher Parker, who directed the study. "The Tea Party is not just about politics and size of government. The data suggests it may also be about race."
If you look at the actual statements, policies, and candidates who are aligned to the tea party, it is not in the slightest about race. It is about gov't spending and taxation run a muck. Now, if some ignorant people interpret that in ways that are not intended, then that's their own issue. If saying the gov't taxes and borrows too much and spends too much is racist, then count me in and order my white sheet. Some people can make everything and anything about race because it obscures from the true substance.
Neil, there are plenty of credible sources on this. Again, you should be careful to distinguish the claim here:
It's not that data suggests the Party as a whole is "racist"; but a significant number of their leaders and members have problems with race. You can choose to ignore the data, but this isn't really a matter of opinion. It's fact.
Here's another summary of recent findings, and I'll quote the relevant portions of the NY Times article for you:
And while the public image of the Tea Party focuses on a desire to shrink government, concern over big government is hardly the only or even the most important predictor of Tea Party support among voters. So what do Tea Partiers have in common? They are overwhelmingly white, but even compared to other white Republicans, they had a low regard for immigrants and blacks long before Barack Obama was president, and they still do.
More important, they were disproportionately social conservatives in 2006 — opposing abortion, for example — and still are today. Next to being a Republican, the strongest predictor of being a Tea Party supporter today was a desire, back in 2006, to see religion play a prominent role in politics. And Tea Partiers continue to hold these views: they seek “deeply religious” elected officials, approve of religious leaders’ engaging in politics and want religion brought into political debates. The Tea Party’s generals may say their overriding concern is a smaller government, but not their rank and file, who are more concerned about putting God in government.
The parts in bold suggest that the actual MAKEUP of the party is much less about fiscal conservatism than about social issues. (Again, to be crystal clear here: I am NOT just "making this all about race." My point is broader than that: the Tea Party is more about a social conservative agenda than their publicly stated fiscal agenda.)
And Neil, to back up this survey, check this conservative's assessment of this NY Times piece and accompanying survey:
Taxes, at least income taxes, are at their lowest level almost ever. The last time taxes were this low was in the few years before the Great Depression (I'm sure there was no correlation whatsoever). And during the 50 years after that, they were nearly double what they are now (and for some time even more than that), and the country did just fine....dare I say much BETTER than it's doing now. So spare me the BS about how taxes are too high and lowering them will help everyone. It's a complete falsity proven time and time again.
It is a matter of perception. Whether taxes are actually lower is beside the point -- people believe they have run amok and that's what shapes reality. You can pull out "facts" all day long but if people don't buy it what difference does this so-called "hard data" make?
I guess you can't read very well, because you seem to be having trouble making the distinction between Tea Party and Tea PartiER.
I see...is that like Trekie and Treker? Or maybe dummy and dummmer?
I read very well, but thanks for your concern. What I cannot comprehend is your twisting and bending facts to try and fit some misguided hypothesis. To that I plead guilty.
It's not that data suggests the Party as a whole is "racist"; but a significant number of their leaders and members have problems with race. You can choose to ignore the data, but this isn't really a matter of opinion. It's fact.
And perhaps some individuals have racist leanings, but so do those on the left. Doesn't Al Sharpton have racist leanings? What about Louis Farrakhan? What about Jeremiah Wright? Remember Jesse Jackson and "hymie-town" and on and on.
There are examples of misguided individuals on both sides of the political spectrum who view things through a racial prism. The FACT is that nothing in the Tea Party platform has anything to do with race.
I see...is that like Trekie and Treker? Or maybe dummy and dummmer?
I read very well, but thanks for your concern. What I cannot comprehend is your twisting and bending facts to try and fit some misguided hypothesis. To that I plead guilty.
Examples?
BTW, you spelled trekkie, trekker and dumber wrong.
Last edited by JPD; 10-14-2011 at 12:46 PM..
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