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Note that I'm not arguing that more guns = less safety. I'm simply saying that, because of accidents and potential for misuse, I err on the side of decreasing arms ownership in public.
i'm not going to try to convince you that the public doesn't need anymore guns. but i am going give you personal reasons why i've changed my mind about gun ownership.
i've had the same thoughts about guns such as yourself for most of my life. all i was concerned about were the gun accidents and deaths i hear about in the news. i've told my wife that i didn't want guns near our kids. as a typical anti-gun parent, i ignored all the statistics about how guns saved victims lives and listened to the media about the bad things that can happen when guns are involved. once violence knocks on your doorstep, everything changes. the potential for accidents becomes insignificant. i've already mentioned about my uncle being murdered and the failed home burglary attempt while my family slept.
being armed is not about feeling safe. i already felt safe before i owned firearms, but being armed at the right time and at the right place has saved other people's lives. it became hard for me to rationalize that there was no place for carrying guns in our safe civilized society.
my fear of guns have diminished. there are more parents like me considering gun ownership after having been victims. i was surprised to learn that my mom carries/conceal. she is a medical doctor and told me my aunt was raped one night walking home from work (from the hospital). also, my aunt eventually got licensed and purchased a firearm. it came into use when a group of burglars broke into her home. she locked her bedroom then fired through the door. the intruders fled.
the potential for misuse in public is confusing. the cdc and fbi doesn't show statistics on misuse of firearms in public areas. the ones i am aware of is shooting into the air during certain festivities, but those are usually held in private property.
a little FBI stat:
Florida: concealed carry helps slash the murder rates in the state. In the fifteen years following the passage of Florida's concealed carry law in 1987, over 800,000 permits to carry firearms were issued to people in the state.13 FBI reports show that the homicide rate in Florida, which in 1987 was much higher than the national average, fell 52% during that 15-year period -- thus putting the Florida rate below the national average. 14
you won't see that in the news. also, the larger number of bathroom fatalities is much higher than accidental gun deaths (CDC), this won't hit the headlines either. statistics show that guns are used more often in teen suicides over the other methods. this is sad, when i was an anti-gun household, i believed that banning guns would reduce the teen suicide rates.
you mentioned that misfires are a great concern. when i was an anti-gun parent, this also concerned me. then i learned that a misfire is when a bullet fails to fire. i felt a bit embarrassed thinking that misfires caused accidental death. the true terminology is an accidental discharge: when the hammer or striker is released unintentionally causing the firearm to fire a bullet. basic gun safety will eliminate death/injuries caused by accidental discharge. it is already illegal to point loaded firearms at people in gesture. if gun laws are followed, accidents should not happen. this doesn't mean that since some people do not follow gun laws that guns should not be permitted to be carry in public. this would be the same as saying that drivers do not obey traffic laws, therefore, cars should not be driven on public roads.
as i mentioned, once i learned more about firearms, the less i started fearing them.
Exactly Alex... Its just like I said about the reason college kids get robbed. Criminals KNOW they arent armed and are easy targets. You change the scenario to where the kid they're possibly trying to rob could be armed and they think twice. I dont know how or where some of these people grew up but thats simple logic with my background. Robbers were lurking, but if they knew or thought you were strapped they didnt bother you. How that's hard to comprehend I dont understand.
A lot of people are willing to put their lives in the hands of the police but im not one of them... especially since by the time they arrive its generally too late.
I take your points and personal story, alex. I'm more inclined to be fine with firearms possession at home. And I certainly think that capable people will know how to use guns correctly.
I'm just not persuaded that gun possession in and of itself reduces the threat of violence.
Quote:
Originally Posted by brownhornet
Exactly Alex... Its just like I said about the reason college kids get robbed. Criminals KNOW they arent armed and are easy targets. You change the scenario to where the kid they're possibly trying to rob could be armed and they think twice.
How do you know this? Isn't it just as possible that the presence of the gun on the victim might induce an armed robber to shoot first? What if the robber had no intention of shooting until THEY felt threatened by the presence of the gun?
I take your points and personal story, alex. I'm more inclined to be fine with firearms possession at home. And I certainly think that capable people will know how to use guns correctly.
I'm just not persuaded that gun possession in and of itself reduces the threat of violence.
no need to persuade you. we have the 2nd amendment there if you ever become a victim and decide to join the others wanting to either carry or keep at home. i truly hope you never become a victim.
I take your points and personal story, alex. I'm more inclined to be fine with firearms possession at home. And I certainly think that capable people will know how to use guns correctly.
I'm just not persuaded that gun possession in and of itself reduces the threat of violence.
How do you know this? Isn't it just as possible that the presence of the gun on the victim might induce an armed robber to shoot first? What if the robber had no intention of shooting until THEY felt threatened by the presence of the gun?
Where did you grow up? I know this because of being around a criminal element pretty much everyday of my life. I know how they think and how they handle themselves... and who they target. Which for the most part are people they know cant defend themselves against a gun. Thus so many of the GT students being robbed because they know guns arent allowed on campus. People that scream that guns should be illegal mess dont seem to realize that the only thing that would do is make people easier targets for criminals. Just because the stores wont sell them doesnt mean the streets wont.
(1) In the last 50 years, how many people have been wounded or killed as a direct result of gunfire in commercial airport terminals?
(2) How many people have traveled through commercial airports in that time?
Good questions.
At the risk of some posters gleening a "the sky is falling" inference from this, let me say that I haven't heard about any gunfire at an airport terminal. What I hear people talk about however, is that there is a concern regarding victimization while walking to and from the terminal while inside the parking garage. A weapon isn't of any use if it's lockled in the vehicle. These same folks want to be in compliance, so with the concealed permit now allowing them to carry while walking to and from the garage, it makes sense to them.
At the risk of some posters gleening a "the sky is falling" inference from this, let me say that I haven't heard about any gunfire at an airport terminal. What I hear people talk about however, is that there is a concern regarding victimization while walking to and from the terminal while inside the parking garage. A weapon isn't of any use if it's lockled in the vehicle. These same folks want to be in compliance, so with the concealed permit now allowing them to carry while walking to and from the garage, it makes sense to them.
So let me make an observation and ask these questions.
First, I fly in and out of Hartsfield all the time, at all hours walking to and from my car, and I have never felt unsafe or thought I might be in the slightest danger. Never...not once. I have never seen anyone except employees, cops or TSA, and other travelers with baggage. Who are these nefarious people that gun zealots are so worried about at the airport and where are they hanging out? It's not at the South Terminal or the South Parking decks, I can tell you that.
Now, let me ask questions. So we ascertained that not much gunfire is being heard at Hartsfield. What crime is occuring? Pickpocketing? Petty larceny? Can you legally shoot someone for that in GA?
How many armed robberies or use of a weapon in a crime has occured at Hartsfield in the last year? 1/hr? 1/day? 1/wk? 1/Mo? 1/yr? None? In the interest of not sounding like the sky is falling, can you tell us what is the true scope of the violent crime problem at Hartsfield?
Now, at the same time, I'd be curious to know how many people were killed or seriously injured with legal guns in GA, due to improper use or care? I would bet that number by far exceeds the total number of violent felonies committed at Hartsfield in the same period.
I would submit...wholly anecdotally of course, that the greater risk is from idiots with legal guns who don't use them or store them properly, than from any risk of violent crime at the airport.
I wonder how many Georgia Tech students would agree with this? I swear some of you people are slow.. why do you think so many of them get robbed? Because people KNOW that they are unarmed and cant defend themselves. You can tell pretty easily on here who grew up in a bubble outside of reality.
Since most college students fall into the "under 21" age range, they aren't allowed to carry a concealed weapon anyway. The best way to fight campus crime is with our pocketbooks. Unless the schools ramp up security, and keep the pressure on the city to patrol the surrounding areas, the poor publicity will cut into their applications.
So let me make an observation and ask these questions.
First, I fly in and out of Hartsfield all the time, at all hours walking to and from my car, and I have never felt unsafe or thought I might be in the slightest danger. Never...not once. I have never seen anyone except employees, cops or TSA, and other travelers with baggage. Who are these nefarious people that gun zealots are so worried about at the airport and where are they hanging out? It's not at the South Terminal or the South Parking decks, I can tell you that.
Now, let me ask questions. So we ascertained that not much gunfire is being heard at Hartsfield. What crime is occuring? Pickpocketing? Petty larceny? Can you legally shoot someone for that in GA?
How many armed robberies or use of a weapon in a crime has occured at Hartsfield in the last year? 1/hr? 1/day? 1/wk? 1/Mo? 1/yr? None? In the interest of not sounding like the sky is falling, can you tell us what is the true scope of the violent crime problem at Hartsfield?
Now, at the same time, I'd be curious to know how many people were killed or seriously injured with legal guns in GA, due to improper use or care? I would bet that number by far exceeds the total number of violent felonies committed at Hartsfield in the same period.
I would submit...wholly anecdotally of course, that the greater risk is from idiots with legal guns who don't use them or store them properly, than from any risk of violent crime at the airport.
The issue here is politics and not safety.
You sound as if you feel safe at the airport and adjacent parking garages and lots.
I have no idea regarding the "true scope of the violent crime problem at Hartsfield" and I couldn't tell you "how many people were killed or seriously injured with legal guns in GA, due to improper use or care."
Frankly I'm not concerned with such questions as they have no bearing on this issue. My experience tells me and has taught me to always be prepared, again, as chance favors the prepared person. You keep bringing up issues and questions that have no bearing on a citizens' right to self-protection, to wit, the above quotes. You still have not made a compelling arguement regarding why citizens should not be afforded the ability to carry a handgun for protection. Just because you have never been victimized at the airport doesn't mean no one will. I hate to bring up the "just bacause you haven't seen a baby hummingbird doesn't mean they don't exist" point, but it kinda fits.
You are correct in that it does appear, unfortuantely, that politics is the issue here instead of safety, which has caused much focus to be lost.
Last edited by axemanjoe; 05-18-2010 at 12:23 PM..
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