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Old 03-29-2010, 06:24 PM
 
Location: Fort Smith, Arkansas
1,466 posts, read 4,358,952 times
Reputation: 1070

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Snort View Post
Why not create a blimp/submarine? If the blimp happens to go down at sea, you can just dive beneath the waves and continue on the journey. I think the versatility of a hybrid craft like that would become a commercial success.
Kind of like the "Ride The Ducks" cars, but he could call it "Ride The Swan" instead.
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Old 03-29-2010, 07:47 PM
 
Location: Boise, ID
1,356 posts, read 6,025,851 times
Reputation: 944
Quote:
Originally Posted by I'm The Supporter View Post
If I'm not being helped anymore I'm not going to have anything else to say. And I don't care about the technicalities because I did start it so I am the owner of it. The world can read it and comment on it, but they didn't get to it first. And I don't care what anyone says anymore because this dumb kid who lives in a small town in the middle of the woods is going to build it and fly it.
Can you post some photos? We would love to see the progress.
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Old 03-29-2010, 08:26 PM
 
Location: Leadwood, Missouri
152 posts, read 303,495 times
Reputation: 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by Snort View Post
Why not create a blimp/submarine? If the blimp happens to go down at sea, you can just dive beneath the waves and continue on the journey. I think the versatility of a hybrid craft like that would become a commercial success.
I have a problem with being under the sea and the whole thing imploding on me or something going completely wrong on me at that. I will not be on a submarine. That is why I am not trying for the Navy.
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Old 03-29-2010, 11:35 PM
 
Location: The High Seas
7,372 posts, read 16,011,284 times
Reputation: 11867
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr. Foosball View Post
Kind of like the "Ride The Ducks" cars, but he could call it "Ride The Swan" instead.
That's pretty much the idea. Maybe the gondola could be made in the shape of a duck, like in the photo. It could dive underwater and then paddle with most of the body above the water if you wanted to get a view of things and look around for islands to visit.


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Old 03-30-2010, 12:34 AM
 
Location: Beautiful Downtown Rancho Cordova, CA
491 posts, read 1,261,373 times
Reputation: 402
Quote:
Originally Posted by I'm The Supporter View Post
One, I am just myself. No kids of my own nor a wife or girlfriend (even though I would love to have a family of my own). Two, I am about a month off from my 21st birthday. Three, I don't care if this is a pipe dream. I'm going to pursue this with every fiber of my being. I hate the factory I work at and I never want to look at another factory again. Four, I have to have the requirements from the FAA to make it certified. I also have to be certified in order to fly it otherwise I'm just going to be escorted to the ground every time I get to the proper height. Personally, I don't care who I **** off with this idea. The fact is is that I want to get out of the area I live in, travel the world, and fly. I want to wander. It's what I do. So are there any REAL thoughts or advice that I can receive on how I should go about this or who I should contact for construction thoughts?
Ok, this is some real advice. Even if you had trouble getting through to the FAA, you are going to have to get their requirements. There are people at the FAA who can and will help you. I suggest you set aside a whole day if necessary and call every phone number you can find for them and keep asking for information and/or who can help you until you get it.

Also, I can't believe that you couldn't at least find some information by Googling it.
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Old 03-30-2010, 05:12 AM
 
34,254 posts, read 20,533,523 times
Reputation: 36245
Quote:
Originally Posted by Snort View Post
Why not create a blimp/submarine? If the blimp happens to go down at sea, you can just dive beneath the waves and continue on the journey. I think the versatility of a hybrid craft like that would become a commercial success.
Cool. Then he can wear those Captain Nemo clothes and make a fashion statement too.
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Old 03-30-2010, 05:27 AM
 
Location: Londonderry, NH
41,479 posts, read 59,768,722 times
Reputation: 24863
I suggest you contact the Experimental Aircraft Association in Oshkosh, Wisconsin. they are the brotherhood of individual aircraft designers and builders. They have local chapters all over the country and will be glad to help you learn building methods from wood and cloth to the latest fiber reinforced plastic composites. Although these folks are mostly involved with fixed wing aircraft the building techniques apply to all structures. I suggest you start with a scale model to work out structural and control systems along with researching the techniques used by the pioneers in the early 20th Century. The materials may have changed but the physics and engineering have remained the same.

Unlike some folks I would like to encourage this guy. he has set out on a difficult task and we should encourage him and wish him good luck.
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Old 03-30-2010, 07:35 AM
 
Location: Somewhere out there
9,616 posts, read 12,914,585 times
Reputation: 3767
Wink On a semi-posiitve note.....

Quote:
Originally Posted by GregW View Post
I suggest you contact the Experimental Aircraft Association in Oshkosh, Wisconsin. they are the brotherhood of individual aircraft designers and builders. They have local chapters all over the country and will be glad to help you learn building methods from wood and cloth to the latest fiber reinforced plastic composites. Although these folks are mostly involved with fixed wing aircraft the building techniques apply to all structures. I suggest you start with a scale model to work out structural and control systems along with researching the techniques used by the pioneers in the early 20th Century. The materials may have changed but the physics and engineering have remained the same.

Unlike some folks I would like to encourage this guy. he has set out on a difficult task and we should encourage him and wish him good luck.
At the very least, he'll learn things about project management, goal-setting and achieving and persistence. Plus materials science and the limitations that faced many of flight-science's early explorers.

(Did you ever watch that movie about the kids who made rockets in that coal-mining town? what was it called? Rocket Man or something? Good one to watch!) I and my brother once tried, at age 16 and 18, to create a simple version of a fan-jet engine that would run on kerosene (which is exactly what Jet A is, only it gets a tad bit more refined).

It sorta spun up on it's plain bearings, whined for about 2 minutes, yellow flames out the back (not a good sign of complete, high-pressure combustion) and then all the rivets and soldering (huh? what WERE we thinking with solder?) gave out, and it spewed it's internals onto the ground. I'll bet it generated all of 0.005 oz of thrust.....

So oh well, huh? We learned a lot.

I'm also an automotive engineer, but I love to design things and get creative. The sorts here who say "You'll surely die trying this. Don't even think about it!" are uncreative nay-sayers of the worst kind. in their world, we'd all still be riding camels or horse carts. Yes, you actually may die trying, if you actually even get off the ground, and there are a lot of facts of physics that will vie to keep you grounded.

But think of what you'll learn just by trying, versus the guys who sit down at the local bar, watching inane stick and ball sports, and guzzling beer!

First off, the difference in air temp between inside the balloon and the atmosphere outside are key to taking advantage of the difference in air density that would "encourage" your device to float upwards, the desired direction. Richard Branson used helium, and still had a massive bag above him. Helium is expensive; you'd be better off generating hydrogen than trying hotter than air, but then, you have that little issue of combustibility. Hydrogen and helium can be contained in lightweight containers. Coal would not be even vaguely viable because of weight.

Wood as a material: would pretty much require a skeleton "space-frame" made of spruce with alloy connectors. (Expensive) The British learned this is WW II with the fabulously successful DeHavilland Mosquito. Look it up. My dad was actually responsible for logging that wood species up in coastal British Columbia, where it still grows. Why spruce? Strength to weight ratio, but also it's amazingly tough, flexible and easily machined.

I once met Burt Rutan, a man you should perhaps contact. Tell him the Porsche engineer from 1987 recommended you call him. His company, out in desert California near Lancaster, is called "scaled Composites". Also get and watch his two DVDs about the race to get the prize for first private plane into space. His innovative approach and in-the-face of skeptics got him up to what? 120,000 feet, and his innovative re-entry technique was truly awe-inspiring.

You'll probably actually need a VERY lightweight alloy-composite frame with ultra-thin but tough polymer skin. Check out that human-powered aircraft that the cyclist pedaled over the English Channel. Same type of construction demands.

Next issue: propulsion so you won't be at the total whims of prevailing winds. Even an alloy Rotax engine, such as the UAV Predator or ultra-light use, will require a massive increase in the volume of heated air. There are also very small Wankel engines, but they have far too high specific fuel consumption numbers; you'd have to have too much fule on board to lift.

Then there's directional control and aerodynamics. All important factors, which will add weight, complexity and cost if you hope to be successful

Finally, you'd surely want a ballistically deployed recovery device; in short, a rocket-launched parachute, in case your balloon failed, or was caught up in structure threatening weather.

The design parameters are rigorous, and the construction means expensive, frankly. Even then, I'd say you won't be gayly floating along, with nary a care. You'd have to set down often, and in a world trip you'd be limited in the extreme as to how much you could carry, so you'd also need a pretty charmed American Express card. And that trip over the ocean would make Lindberg's problems seem minor.

I'd frankly suggest an ultralight. And, build a scale model first to see if it can even fly. You can buy a certified ultra-light aircraft kit, even a two-man (providing you with some baggage space, or be able to take that uber-cute French girl you meet in Paris up for a quick flight over her home town and the family castle. Then she, and her daddy's Chateau, are your's for the asking!). You'd learn to fly, and you'd get off the ground.

So, go find a local flight center that offers ultralight flights, pay a few bucks and see how you like it.

Go for it! Enjoy, and learn.
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Old 03-30-2010, 10:22 PM
 
Location: Leadwood, Missouri
152 posts, read 303,495 times
Reputation: 64
I thank you two for your encouragement. Right now I have gone over my plans and tried to figure up ways to cut the weight down and figure it all out. I know there are equations involved that even I don't understand. I really want to get the right fit to it. Like in October Sky. They went through the same bull**** I am. But they built their rockets and they made them bigger and better. I am a risk taker, that's one reason why I'm doing this. And I will not be flying gayly. I will be flying bisexually. (Sorry, I'm tired).
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Old 03-31-2010, 08:33 AM
 
Location: Ruidoso, NM
1,643 posts, read 4,916,833 times
Reputation: 670
Quote:
Originally Posted by GregW View Post
Unlike some folks I would like to encourage this guy. he has set out on a difficult task and we should encourage him and wish him good luck.
This "guy" doesn't need any encouragement. He's already pulled off one of the greatest spoofs I've seen in a long time in "chat threads" such as this.

Just imagine what he's(?) been proposing: A hot air blimp or dirigible fueled by an "oven" fired with coal!!

What a great joke this thread has been. Congratulations to the OP for pulling this off with such a straight face and keeping the exchange going now for what must be heading for some sort of record!

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