"There is a bill that states healthy food is a human right" (Sacramento: neighborhood, tax)

[Gentoo]

Originally Posted by jade408

I disagree. Keep in mind the bulk of the processed foods appeared in the 50s. We are starting to see the results of this shift in the health problems of the baby boomers and their children. Is it a coincidence?

We have been feeding cows hormones to increase milk output and frequency, and our girls are going through puberty earlier and earlier. Over the past two generations, the average age of puberty has changed from around 16 to 13 or so in girls. Is that a coincidence?

Not just that but the mass production of cows for food has caused a shift in feeding. Cows are now fed corn. Problem is cows aren't designed to handle such a diet. The result is a lot of bacteria as corn often remains undigested in a cows system. This bacteria can and has been passed down to those who eat it. Remember the Ecoli outbreaks?

[Gentoo]

Originally Posted by Curmudgeon

By the way, if you've only ever eaten supermarket meat you don't know what real beef tastes like. Same for pork and chicken.

How true this is. Same with chicken. Even when it comes to eggs they are better.

[Gentoo]

Originally Posted by jaijai

Ever hear of compassion?
And why so black and white / all or nothing?

BWAHAHAHAHA!!!!!
Compassion on C-D, that's good. Almost as good as the compassion shown by the Tea Party...wait...why are they different?

[nullgeo]

Originally Posted by KC6ZLV

Here is a map of food deserts. That is, no grocery store within one mile.

Food deserts by county - Slate Labs (http://labs.slate.com/articles/food-deserts-in-america/ - broken link)

It looks like it affects somewhere around 1% of the people in California. Where it may be a problem is in the sparsely-populated rural counties in Northern California. There is heavily-subsidized public transportation in urban areas. If someone doesn't have a car and lives more than a mile from a grocery store they need to get their act together and learn how to read the bus schedules.

You are dead wrong when you say the availability isn't part of the picture. People choose to shovel junk in their mouths. Nobody is forcing them. People buy potato chips because they like them. They buy TV dinners that are full of fat because they are convenient. It is all about personal choice and it isn't the government's role to bring food to people's front doors.

As far as campaigning goes, the government and many different organizations have been doing this for decades. What do you think the food pyramid is about? The American Heart Association, the American Diabetes Association, and so on.

Yeah ... umm, you kinda misunderstood what I was saying about availability ... and you appear to have missed that I agreed with some of what you were saying with regard to people's choices and habits -- with an exception to "nobody is forcing them" [to shovel junk into their mouths] ... in a very real sense, we are being "force fed" this crap food by virtue of the powerful marketing and distribution of the manufacturers -- who are deliberately creating the products they do because, in part, of the addictive nature ... the manufacturers know precisely what they are doing in that regard ... and finally, you appear to have missed that I also question government's role in legislating the behaviors we are discussing.

I repeat:
I personally feel that government's primary role and opportunity to serve the people here is: information, 1st ... then, 2nd, programs that support the information ... including, 3rd, "sin taxing" foods (such as the chips and tv dinners) a bit to pay for the campaign and level the choice playing field more.

What I was writing about availability was that the issues of availability are not the primary challenge to changing habits ... people make the choices based on acculturation and 'addictions' ... and those are the big 'picture' ... insuring availability is important support, but not the primary problem.

As for the American Heart Assoc., and Diabetes Assn., and the government's "Food Pyramid" and "Plate" programs ... I don't happen to agree with the science they use ... or with the execution of the campaigns either. It's not accurate information, it's not realistically presented, and it doesn't work.

[Curmudgeon]

Where there's a will there's a way. It might require some effort on the individuals part to access healthy foods and it might not be the most convenient option but it's usually doable. For the elderly and others, there's also the Meals on Wheels program, congregate meals, transportation assistance, etc. Safeway and others provide home delivery (yes, it comes at a cost). What I see all too much of is "portly" (and I'm being kind) people of all ages, many dragging along obese children, filling their shopping carts with prepared and frozen foods, snacks high in sugar and fats, sodas, desserts, bottles of prepared sauces (also high in sugar) and all of that filled with fats and preservatives, processed meats such as lunch meats, hot dogs and such, cheap breads and few, if any, fresh vegetables. I mean, why bother when you can just open a can. I could go on but you get the picture.

Mandating availability (a pipe dream) to healthy alternatives won't change their eating habits. The junk tastes good to them and is easy.

In fact, my wife and I took a day trip of a couple of hundred miles this past Saturday. On the way home we stopped at a McDonald's for a potty break and for me to get a small cup of coffee as I'd started yawning. It was early Saturday evening and the place was jamb-packed, presumably with primarily locals. I don't think there were many who weighed less than somewhere in the 200s and none of the children who accompanied them looked as if they'd ever missed a meal or eaten a healthy one. By the way, the Mickey D's was directly across the street from a large grocery store that I'm sure had a full produce section and lean meats, fish, poultry, etc.

It has to start with education which is why I've applauded people who participate in community gardening projects and schools that plant vegetable gardens, tended by the children, teach cooking and healthy eating and serve nutritious lunches and even breakfasts.

Unfortunately, you cannot legislate brains!

[jade408]

Originally Posted by Gentoo

Jade you can repeat this till you're blue in the face but based on some of the responses we're getting, I think especially the part I made bold looks like this $@#@&@#@&@**. When it comes to helping those less fortunate, such language is simply not intelligible.

Yeah, everyone is busy helping people on the other side of the world, while tripping on the less-fortunate people here at home on the way there.

[Gentoo]

Originally Posted by jade408

Yeah, everyone is busy helping people on the other side of the world, while tripping on the less-fortunate people here at home on the way there.

Good point I didn't even think to bring that up. We're so concerned with building schools and feeding people a half a world away. This isn't a bad thing but charity should start at home. Let's build our own schools and feed our own people first.

[Curmudgeon]

Originally Posted by Gentoo

Good point I didn't even think to bring that up. We're so concerned with building schools and feeding people a half a world away. This isn't a bad thing but charity should start at home. Let's build our own schools and feed our own people first.

You radical!

[1AngryTaxPayer]

Originally Posted by Curmudgeon

Where there's a will there's a way. It might require some effort on the individuals part to access healthy foods and it might not be the most convenient option but it's usually doable. For the elderly and others, there's also the Meals on Wheels program, congregate meals, transportation assistance, etc. Safeway and others provide home delivery (yes, it comes at a cost). What I see all too much of is "portly" (and I'm being kind) people of all ages, many dragging along obese children, filling their shopping carts with prepared and frozen foods, snacks high in sugar and fats, sodas, desserts, bottles of prepared sauces (also high in sugar) and all of that filled with fats and preservatives, processed meats such as lunch meats, hot dogs and such, cheap breads and few, if any, fresh vegetables. I mean, why bother when you can just open a can. I could go on but you get the picture.

Mandating availability (a pipe dream) to healthy alternatives won't change their eating habits. The junk tastes good to them and is easy.

In fact, my wife and I took a day trip of a couple of hundred miles this past Saturday. On the way home we stopped at a McDonald's for a potty break and for me to get a small cup of coffee as I'd started yawning. It was early Saturday evening and the place was jamb-packed, presumably with primarily locals. I don't think there were many who weighed less than somewhere in the 200s and none of the children who accompanied them looked as if they'd ever missed a meal or eaten a healthy one. By the way, the Mickey D's was directly across the street from a large grocery store that I'm sure had a full produce section and lean meats, fish, poultry, etc.

It has to start with education which is why I've applauded people who participate in community gardening projects and schools that plant vegetable gardens, tended by the children, teach cooking and healthy eating and serve nutritious lunches and even breakfasts.

Unfortunately, you cannot legislate brains!

They are supposed to be teaching these things. My kid's school has a garden and the kids get to be involved in how to grow your own. But, at the same time, are forced to sell garbage like candy, hot dogs and nachos for endless fund raisers. The money wins out.

[jaijai]

Originally Posted by Gentoo

BWAHAHAHAHA!!!!!
Compassion on C-D, that's good. Almost as good as the compassion shown by the Tea Party...wait...why are they different?

I've noticed a few good hearts around c-d-f... just a few but that's better than none.