"There is a bill that states healthy food is a human right" (Oakland: neighborhoods, buying)

[nullgeo]

Originally Posted by 1AngryTaxPayer

And yet all of us are living longer, getting taller and more intelligent than ever before. It will continue this way until we figure out a way to end mankind or mother nature does it for us.

I'm having me some backyard raised chicken tonight.

Well -----
we're not living longer because of the way we eat ... we are living longer because of medical-science interventions

"getting taller" is not a sign of any particular value

and as for [becoming] "more intelligent" -- based on what? -- the way our world is running more and more intelligently [toward self-inflicted annihilation]? I don't see any real signs of intelligence down here [Scotty] ... please define: "intelligence"

[jaijai]

Originally Posted by nullgeo

Well -----
we're not living longer because of the way we eat ... we are living longer because of medical-science interventions

"getting taller" is not a sign of any particular value

and as for [becoming] "more intelligent" -- based on what? -- the way our world is running more and more intelligently [toward self-inflicted annihilation]? I don't see any real signs of intelligence down here [Scotty] ... please define: "intelligence"

All true and geez, what other of the "lesser" species soils and spoils and ultimately annihilates its own habitat?
None that i know of.
Stupid humans.
Bless each and every one of us!

[evergraystate]

What a complete waste of time. How is this going to help balance the state budget exactly?

[nullgeo]

Originally Posted by CarawayDJ

... There are a lot of individuals and companies seeing $$$$ with the whole organic foods movement. I don't believe they are leaving money on the table. If they think they will sell enough in any area, they will be there.

There is virtually NO comparison here to the money spent by big agri-business and processed food manufacturers that have created the poisonous dominant diet of our culture, and continues to cram it down our collective throats as if we were a bunch of ducks bred for foie gras. You want to talk about money influencing consumer foods to the detriment of -- well, everything ... !!!

Originally Posted by NewToCA

Good for you, so why can't folks just choose to do this without the establishment of yet another governmental organization?

I still don't understand the justification for this bill. It isn't like folks can't eat "healthy" without this bill.

By the way, for all of the comments about natural vs processed food, as someone who grew up in Philly I know an awful lot of folks in their 80's and 90's who spent their entire lives eating hoagies and cheese steaks.

Not saying what you eat doesn't matter at all, however I think some folks get a bit carried away with their concerns associated with "unhealthy" eating.

Moderation in anything is good.

NewTo, I am impressed by your uncharacteristic passion today ... As a fellow former-Philadelphian, I know of what you speak re: cheese steaks and hoagies ... but you are waxing anecdotal here ... some people survive smoking into their 90's too, and we all know damn well it ain't healthy! (and don't forget about the TastyCake addicts! ... mmm. Butterscotch Crimpets!)

That said though, the issue of whether this is a program with a good prospect under government oversight is a valid ponder. But whether the movement to support healthier dietary choices is a good one I think is obviously unassailable ... so, if not government oversight, what would it take to overcome the power and inertia of agri-business and giant food manufacturing that is literally torturing and killing us and our kids? The cost of health care in this country is being identified (correctly) as the greatest danger to our economy over time. The way we eat is the single most damaging force on our health.

I'm sure you have heard about the new "Fat Tax" in Denmark?
Denmark Introduces ‘Fat Tax’ on Foods High in Saturated Fat - ABC News
Denmark doesn't have an obesity problem ... they are going proactive on this ... and leaving the choice on the shelves at an increased cost ... which cost is in the form of a "sin" tax collected by the govt. to be used to deal with health programs.

and, btw, there are LOTS of things for which moderation is not good ... (sex comes to mind, first ... but I'll leave that for another thread and jump to smoking for now )

Originally Posted by hoffdano

...
People aren't fat because they don't eat organic or processed food. They are fat because they eat too much of everything and don't exercise enough.

Yes, people eat too much and exercise too little ... but it's not that simple ... what we eat is HUGE in making us HUGE ... our metabolisms process different kinds of carbs, proteins, etc. differently depending on many many many individual factors, and depending on what combinations we eat of the different foods we do ... it goes even to the seasons we eat different foods. Our bodies evolved eating seasonally fresh foods that grew in the regions we lived in. Now we import foods from opposite hemispheres to have non-seasonal delights ... confuses the body. We combine foods that the body can barely endure (i.e. most grains) with proteins and sugars that would not be foraged together in our evolving past. Then there are the issues of different body types (huge issue) and the new global reality of mixing of very diverse genetic pools (i.e. Asian/Scandinavian, African/Polynesian, even Germanic/Hispanic, etc.) which different racial groups have somewhat different historical dietary adaptations.

Originally Posted by Curmudgeon

The "harm" is when it costs the taxpayers to make it available to those without the native intelligence, appreciation, sophistication or education to take advantage of it. They'll still go to McDonalds 'cause it's cheap and easy.

Originally Posted by Curmudgeon

If the state wants to step in then it should raise them as well, and pay for it. Is that what you want?

Ever hear of Darwinian theory?

So, again, what is a good alternative to balance the power of giant agri-business and manufacturer influence?

Originally Posted by Curmudgeon

Of course I have. But give government an inch it will take a mile.

This is the fly in the dog-poop landing on the ham sandwiches at the picnic, all right.

[KC6ZLV]

You aren't going to change people's purchasing habits simply by making fresh food an option. Every grocery store I've been in that isn't categorically a mini-mart has had fruit, vegetables, and the ingredients to make everything else from scratch. However, many people choose to buy boxed, ready-made "throw it it in the microwave" food because it is convenient. A certain percentage of people buy pop and Doritoes because it works when they want their kids to shut up and sit in front of the TV, computer, or whatever.

If anything should be done it should be making junk food ineligible for food stamp programs.

[Curmudgeon]

Originally Posted by nullgeo

So, again, what is a good alternative to balance the power of giant agri-business and manufacturer influence?

Elementary, of course. Ban fast foods, sweet and fatty snacks and force tens of thousands of businesses to disappear along with millions of jobs. Lack of access to bad diets and no income will help the overweight and unhealthy reduce, right? Of course, it might also get rid of some of the excess population. It's just perfect!

[Digital_Duck]

Originally Posted by jade408

Wow, that's a big assumption there. People who live in food deserts can't make good food choices?

Does it take you an hour to get to the grocery store?

I think you are partially blind to the situation.

1. I can barely keep produce in the house at these price (seen oranges 2 for a dollar) - how will the poor afford it?
2. if the government steps in - the store owners will get very rip produce to consume when they write it off taxes as product loss (more Corporate Welfare)

I have never been in a poor neighborhood store that didn't have a pretty good selection of produce - have you? It's there and not bought very much!

[Digital_Duck]

Originally Posted by Curmudgeon

Elementary, of course. Ban fast foods, sweet and fatty snacks and force tens of thousands of businesses to disappear along with millions of jobs. Lack of access to bad diets and no income will help the overweight and unhealthy reduce, right? Of course, it might also get rid of some of the excess population. It's just perfect!

... before you ban that - how about banning control freaks who want to tell people how they can kill themselves through poor consumption

[Curmudgeon]

Originally Posted by Digital_Duck

... before you ban that - how about banning control freaks who want to tell people how they can kill themselves through poor consumption

Well, one can always hope they'll be the first to starve!

[1AngryTaxPayer]

Originally Posted by jade408

Why would the middle class drive over, they already have easy access to fresh foods.

I don't know about LA but there is no where in SD that you can't buy fresh veggies within 5 miles any direction. If they put in a market anywhere here I'd drive over if the Govt made it cheap enough. They are doing this in Linda Vista and there are already many stores within two miles.