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You "conservatives" don't find it odd that at the very same time Republicans are trying to take billions out of medicaid to give tax cuts to the very wealthy, you stand here saying 15 dollars is too much pay for someone?
There's something wrong there in my opinion. A kind of disconnect. If paying a decent wage causes trouble down the line then that needs to be addressed, the answer is not to pay substandard wages. Saying a job was not "intended" to pay a decent wage is ridiculous no matter how many times you repeat it.
I agree, and if more and more people do what she did, low paying employers will have to figure out a way to find employees who are willing to work for crap wages and no benefits.
Except the illegals will take those jobs and ................... the State does nothing about it.
Quote:
Honestly outside of the pay the worst thing about fast food jobs is that you go home smelling like grease. Both my boys did their time in those craptastic jobs and I'll never forget them walking in the door smelling like two rancid french fries
Never worked fast food. My first job was as a Box Boy. I had friends who worked for Fast Food out of Hs. They learned a lot.
1. Bosses rule so shut up and do what you are told
2. You work hard you keep your job
3. You treat the other employees, who you may or may not like, in a friendly manner and you keep your job
4. It does not pay enough to support you once you are prepared to go out on your own. Just enough to have some money to spend.
5. You learn how taxes take money out of your pocket.
6. The food is junk and why would you want to sell junk food to your friends.
They all quit after a Summer and either got decent jobs, went to a trade school and got decent jobs, or went to college and got decent jobs.
Minimum wage jobs are basically for people with minimal skills and it gives them a chance to learn what is important. They are not expected to stay with the job except in a few cases where they feel they can become managers and/or eventually own a franchise. A job that pays enough to support a family is not a minimum wage job nor ever intended to be.
Part of the problem today, especially in CA, is that the better jobs for those who cannot or do not want to go to college are about gone. Manufacturing jobs that paid well. They are going out of State due to cheap foreign labor and ... to States with more business friendly laws. Restaurants and business that do local business only can ... only raise prices due to ALL the regulations, not just minimum wage laws, but they do add to the burden.
Unions love them as their pay goes up as so many have tied their wages to getting a raise anytime the minimum wage goes up. Remember when a law like this goes into effect, follow the money and it goes to unions and politicians (Both parties) through their donations and does little for the minimum wage worker.
Except the illegals will take those jobs and ................... the State does nothing about it.
Don't smack yourself about that because the enforcement of immigration law is entirely a federal responsibility and not a state one. Local Police Officers do not have the authority to detain people in order to verify their citizenship, nor do they have the authority to enter a workplace and demand proof of employees citizenship. ICE can do both if they have probable cause so how about you call John Kelly and ask him to enforce the law..he's the one getting paid the big bucks to do it.
You "conservatives" don't find it odd that at the very same time Republicans are trying to take billions out of medicaid to give tax cuts to the very wealthy, you stand here saying 15 dollars is too much pay for someone?
There's something wrong there in my opinion. A kind of disconnect. If paying a decent wage causes trouble down the line then that needs to be addressed, the answer is not to pay substandard wages. Saying a job was not "intended" to pay a decent wage is ridiculous no matter how many times you repeat it.
Both parties are corrupt and favor their contributors and to a little bit their voters.
What is a "decent wage"? A minimum wage is a starter wage for a new or 1st time employee so they can learn. It was never intended to support them or a family. It is "decent" for it's intended purpose. It also helps retired people who only have a small Social Security check and maybe a small retirement fund to make ends meet and usually they only want part time work.
Now a way to make a Minimum Wage work, would be to mandate a raise each year for every employee making under oh say $40,000.00 a year regardless of the number of jobs, so a total income and benefits (and also adjusted for inflation each year) or less tied to inflation. The way inflation is figured also needs to be adjusted as it does not cover everything that people buy on a regular basis, including the cost of loans and medical care.
Now if making over $40,000 a year (Also adjusted for inflation each year) then no raise beyond what your work skills, ability and performance demand.
Then no raise for Union workers for this requirement, and this includes State and Federal workers, unless of course their Pay is below $40,000 a year in total. The $40,000.00 a year is based on all income from one or more jobs and includes all benefits of any kind.
OH, and take way any business License and destroy or take the business facility and assets/equipment, etc of such a business and sell to put money on the State's pockets to help the unemployed, for any business hiring illegals. That would make a change for sure.
Won't happen as such business have politicians in their pockets.
Boy I don't usually get into a back and forth with Republicans because they do stuff like this, but I'll just point out again, that repeating this talking point over and over does not make it true.
Again, who didn't intend these jobs to pay a decent wage? Another post said they were "designed" to be low paying....who designed them? And have these unnamed people rethought their job designing to cope with the economy in 2017?
You might have a valid argument somewhere but these statements repeated as if they had some meaning aren't it.
These jobs are just like any other job. An employer seeks an employee that can help bring profit to his business. I don't think we should subsidise low paying employers.
Dave
PS. I reread your post expat and you make an interesting argument at the end. You should drop the "they weren't intended" line though they are like every other job.
Last edited by mauialoha; 07-01-2017 at 04:06 PM..
Reason: Second thoughts
Boy I don't usually get into a back and forth with Republicans because they do stuff like this, but I'll just point out again, that repeating this talking point over and over does not make it true.
Again, who didn't intend these jobs to pay a decent wage? Another post said they were "designed" to be low paying....who designed them? And have these unnamed people rethought their job designing to cope with the economy in 2017?
You might have a valid argument somewhere but these statements repeated as if they had some meaning aren't it.
These jobs are just like any other job. An employer seeks an employee that can help bring profit to his business. I don't think we should subsidise low paying employers.
Dave
PS. I reread your post expat and you make an interesting argument at the end. You should drop the "they weren't intended" line though they are like every other job.
An employer sets a salary level to fit the ability of the employee and the needs of his business. Entry level or first time jobs are not intended to support anyone just get them started. That is reality. Now some employers, like your truly, never have paid minimum wage, always above it. BUT the starting positions needed more than a job at a fast food place, or similar low paying job does.
Am employer looks for an employee that can do the job which is why teachers, nurses, engineers make more than a fast food worker.
No one should subsidize low paying employers. Who said anyone should? No one ever subsidized me and I started at minimum wage and worked up and made more as I improved my skills and finally started my first business. Been doing well ever since.
Oh, I am not a Republican. I belong to neither party.
Basically socially liberal, though not an extremest and fiscally a conservative, though again not an extremist. Extremists on either side are the problem.
Don't smack yourself about that because the enforcement of immigration law is entirely a federal responsibility and not a state one. Local Police Officers do not have the authority to detain people in order to verify their citizenship, nor do they have the authority to enter a workplace and demand proof of employees citizenship. ICE can do both if they have probable cause so how about you call John Kelly and ask him to enforce the law..he's the one getting paid the big bucks to do it.
This Backgrounder briefly summarizes the legal authority upon which state and local police may act in rendering such assistance and describes the scenarios in which this assistance is most crucial. It does not cover the provisions of Section 287(g) of the Immigration and Nationality Act (INA) (that is, Section 133 of the Illegal Immigration Reform and Immigrant Responsibility Act (IIRAIRA) of 1996 titled "Acceptance of State Services to Carry Out Immigration Enforcement"), since the scope of such delegated authority is evident on the face of the Act. Rather, this Backgrounder describes the inherent arrest authority that has been possessed and exercised by state and local police since the earliest days of federal immigration law.
It is well established that the authority of state police to make arrests for violation of federal law is not limited to those situations in which they are exercising delegated federal power. Rather, such arrest authority inheres in the States’ status as sovereign entities. It stems from the basic power of one sovereign to assist another sovereign. This is the same inherent authority that is exercised whenever a state law enforcement officer witnesses a federal crime being committed and makes an arrest. That officer is not acting pursuant to delegated federal power. Rather, he is exercising the inherent power of his state to assist another sovereign.
Abundant Case Law. There is abundant case law on this point. Even though Congress has never authorized state police officers to make arrest for federal offenses without an arrest warrant, such arrests occur routinely; and the Supreme Court has recognized that state law controls the validity of such an arrest.
Saying it is only a Federal Issue ignores the law and history in favor of allowing illegal immigration.
Don't smack yourself about that because the enforcement of immigration law is entirely a federal responsibility and not a state one. Local Police Officers do not have the authority to detain people in order to verify their citizenship, nor do they have the authority to enter a workplace and demand proof of employees citizenship. ICE can do both if they have probable cause so how about you call John Kelly and ask him to enforce the law..he's the one getting paid the big bucks to do it.
There is nothing in your link that disputes what I said, so what you posted was basically irrelevant.
3. Can LLEAs make stops or arrests for civil immigration violations?
No. Ordinarily, local and state law enforcement can only make a stop or arrest for criminal violations. The United States Supreme Court in Arizona v. United States held that there is no basis for LLEAs to arrest on suspicion that the individual is unlawfully present or in violation of other civil immigration laws. LLEAs lack authority to make civil immigration arrests because Congress has assigned that responsibility exclusively to federal agents. Even an investigatory stop must be based on reasonable suspicion that “person apprehended is committing or has committed a crime.” This requirement also applies to prolonged detention after a lawful stop or arrest. “[P]ossible criminality is key to any Terry investigatory stop or prolonged detention. Absent suspicion that a suspect is engaged in, or is about to engage in, criminal activity, law enforcement may not stop or detain an individual.” Suspicion or knowledge of unlawful presence does not justify a stop by LLEAs.17
4. If there is probable cause of civil immigration violations, can an LLEA prolong detention or make an arrest on that basis? No. Probable cause of immigration violations is not the only question regarding an LLEAs’ authority to arrest or postpone someone’s release based on alleged immigration offenses. A second, more fundamental question is whether an LLEA has authority to make an arrest for civil immigration violations at all, which they generally do not. A determination of whether someone is subject to deportation is a civil immigration issue outside the arrest authority of local law enforcement. LLEAs cannot detain someone based on immigration status; state and local authority to make independent arrests for civil immigration violations is preempted by federal law. As the Supreme Court said in Arizona v. U.S., “Congress has put in place a system in which state officers may not make warrantless arrests of aliens based on possible removability except in specific, limited circumstances…If the police stop someone
based on nothing more than possible removability, the usual predicate for an arrest is absent.”
Moreover, Arizona and subsequent decisions have made clear that even a brief detention on the basis of
immigration status following a lawful stop or arrest may be impermissible.
Here's the source, if you don't trust it, or don't believe it, then ask a local cop these two questions:
1) can you detain a person for the sole person of determining their citizenship?
2) can you enter a workplace and demand that workers prove that they are citizens?
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