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Old 08-05-2017, 08:38 PM
 
882 posts, read 689,191 times
Reputation: 905

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Quote:
Originally Posted by CA4Now View Post
When you call the New England Journal of Medicine a "propaganda piece," you're really grasping at straws.



Link? Or are you listing figures from your own personal experience?
Yawn

I don't care where you got the info from. BS is BS! And if it caused you to believe this nonsense, then it's propaganda. Simple enough?

There's a saying that I think goes like this....There are lies, there are damn lies, and then there are statistics (pretty sure it's something like that). And sure, you can cite your sources and I can cite mine. I tend to use common sense since there's way too much BS on the internet and with media (gotta feed that Liberal narrative...don't ya know).

So I look at the fact that we had catastrophic (high deductible) health insurance which was basically fine for the "immortals" (those youngsters that really only needed insurance if they were hit by a bus). But the Democrats said "no", you must have these "essential benefits" or it's not good enough (even though it was). And so, those plans got eliminated and these youngsters and people that simply couldn't afford higher priced insurance were forced into unaffordable plans. I saw it destroy people in the industry I was in (since nearly 80% are part time workers). Those that lived in Nevada got F'ed over the worst with their insurance going up by almost 300%. What I find the most laughable is how people that blindly defend this just won't admit how many people this "affordable" health plan screwed over. And sure, there were winners (the subsidized ones), but there were a lot more losers.

Of course you dodged the question the last time I asked you how a family in San Francisco with the median income of $86k could afford to pay a minimum of $14K for insurance. Really, it's just simple math....

Median Rent (annually) $41K
Health Insurance $14K

$55K

Your average taxes after deductions (Fed, State, SS, Medicare) comes out to $26k. So that leaves $5k to deal with car/bus, insurance/gas, food, utilities, garbage, phone service, etc.). Of course, you'll dodge again (I'm sure of that), but the fact of the matter is, Obamacare was never "affordable" and simply made matters worse.

Link showing what "essential benefits" did to the catastrophic plans per state

https://www.manhattan-institute.org/...nowyourrates/#


Ten Years of Health Insurance Costs:

Average Costs from 2008 through the First Two Months of the 2017 Open Enrollment Period1


Average Average Average Family Average Family
Individual Health Individual Health Health Insurance Health Insurance
Insurance Insurance Premium Deductible
Premium Deductible
First two months of 2017 open enrollment

$393 $4,328 $1,021 $8,352
2016 open enrollment $321 $4,385 $833 $7,983
2015 open enrollment $286 $4,120 $727 $7,760
2014 open enrollment $271 $4,164 $667 $7,771
2013 $197 $3,319 $426 $4,230
2012 $190 $3,079 $412 $4,079
2011 $183 $2,935 $414 $3,879
2010 $167 $2,632 $392 $3,531
2009 $161 $2,326 $383 $3,128
2008 $159 $2,084 $369 $2,760

https://www.forbes.com/sites/theapot.../#4c3e24b215be

Let me guess. You also believe we had 47 million uninsured Americans and that 127 million people had pre-existing diseases.

 
Old 08-06-2017, 06:47 AM
 
Location: So Ca
26,744 posts, read 26,834,489 times
Reputation: 24800
Quote:
Originally Posted by Independentthinking View Post
Yawn

I don't care where you got the info from. BS is BS! And if it caused you to believe this nonsense, then it's propaganda.
Yet your link to the Manhattan Institute's "The ObamaCare Impact" is not?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Independentthinking View Post
Simple enough?
No. The Manhattan Institute is a right-wing non-profit think tank which is focused on "promoting free market principles."

The free market doesn't work with health care. Scroll back.
 
Old 08-06-2017, 08:20 AM
 
Location: Former land of plenty
3,212 posts, read 1,653,641 times
Reputation: 2017
If Obamacare is so bad, whey didn't the Republicans in Putingrad D.C. repeal it? (Like they promised)
 
Old 08-06-2017, 08:32 AM
 
882 posts, read 689,191 times
Reputation: 905
Quote:
Originally Posted by CA4Now View Post
Yet your link to the Manhattan Institute's "The ObamaCare Impact" is not?



No. The Manhattan Institute is a right-wing non-profit think tank which is focused on "promoting free market principles."

The free market doesn't work with health care. Scroll back.
And once again, the perfect dodge. Just like I predicted, lol. You dodged the question on affordibility, you dodged a very thorough article that emphasized "essential benefits" that got rid of lower priced plans, and you dodged the actual rates from Einsurance that showed the jump in 2014. Once again, just one big yawn.

Last edited by Independentthinking; 08-06-2017 at 09:37 AM..
 
Old 08-06-2017, 09:32 AM
 
Location: SF Bay Area
12,287 posts, read 9,827,388 times
Reputation: 6509
Quote:
Originally Posted by AlongTheI-5 View Post
If Obamacare is so bad, whey didn't the Republicans in Putingrad D.C. repeal it? (Like they promised)
Because republicans are bad a messaging and Americans love $1.50 worth of benefits for .90 cents.


The biggest theft the world has even seen is from the current generations for the future generations.
 
Old 08-06-2017, 10:12 AM
 
Location: Former land of plenty
3,212 posts, read 1,653,641 times
Reputation: 2017
Quote:
Originally Posted by shooting4life View Post
Because republicans are bad a messaging and Americans love $1.50 worth of benefits for .90 cents.


The biggest theft the world has even seen is from the current generations for the future generations.
Cmon now. The GOP has been promising the repeal since it was enacted. They have gained a thousand or so in the seats of government while promising the repeal up and down.

Obama had the spine to enact it in the first place. The GOP? Cluck, cluck, cluck!
 
Old 08-06-2017, 11:20 AM
 
Location: Paranoid State
13,044 posts, read 13,874,291 times
Reputation: 15839
Quote:
Originally Posted by Independentthinking View Post
Of course you dodged the question the last time I asked you how a family in San Francisco with the median income of $86k could afford to pay a minimum of $14K for insurance.
a) make more money
b) move to a lower cost area.


Life is all about alternatives.
 
Old 08-06-2017, 12:17 PM
 
882 posts, read 689,191 times
Reputation: 905
Quote:
Originally Posted by SportyandMisty View Post
a) make more money
b) move to a lower cost area.


Life is all about alternatives.
Unfortunately, those alternatives were forced on people based on a myriad of lies. And they were very costly lies for those on catastrophic plans.

Last edited by Independentthinking; 08-06-2017 at 12:35 PM..
 
Old 08-06-2017, 01:14 PM
 
Location: So Ca
26,744 posts, read 26,834,489 times
Reputation: 24800
"If you are fortunate enough to still be employed and have insurance through your employers, you may feel insulated from the sufferings of people like me right now. But things can change abruptly. If you still have a good job with insurance, that doesn't mean that you're better than me, more deserving than me or smarter than me. It just means that you are luckier. And access to healthcare shouldn't depend on luck."

Breast cancer, health insurance and an apology to President Obama - latimes
 
Old 08-06-2017, 02:04 PM
 
Location: PNW
3,076 posts, read 1,683,929 times
Reputation: 10233
I thought your state governor had grand plans to provide "universified" healthcare for California????
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