Could California Survive Without the U.S. and Vice Versa? (Richmond: living, statistics)

[Lovehound]

p.s. as an investor even though I don't expect to sell my L.A. Co. property in the next 20 years, I see a 5-6 percent per year property valuation in LA. There is no doubt that LA property prices are increasing because of (1) high demand and (2) limited supply.

When I bought a few years ago it was a radioactively hot seller's market. Today I would call it a warm-to-hot market depending on geographic location in L.A.

OMG, I see houses closing in Van Nuys and Reseda at over 500K! I never saw that coming...

Like they say, location, location, location. I live further out these days because I'm retired an no need to commute.

[goodie2shoes]

Yes, CA can SURVIVE w/o the US. The US however cannot survive w/o CA. CA puts Hundreds of Billions of Tax Revenue into the Federal Budget. Which funds the Govt and the Poorer Red States.

This is why Republicans are so jealous of CA and they WISHED that CA was a red state so they can use it as an example to why being Red is awesome.

If you look at all the statistics, the Red states has the highest dependency of Govt aid, highest welfare participant, highest crime rates, etc etc.

[oldtrader]

If you look at all the statistics, the Red states has the highest dependency of Govt aid, highest welfare participant, highest crime rates, etc etc.

Absolutely untrue. Take off your rose colored glasses, and look at California as the whole world looks at it.

For years, California has had the highest poverty rate in the entire nation, as represented in the Sacramento Bee, and everything else including Forbes Magazine. No place else is even real close.

California once again has nation

Three most dangerous cites due to crime rate, include Oakland #3 most dangerous and Stockton #8 in the entire country. Yes 2 California cities in the top worst crime ridden cities in the U.S. And t

Detroit - pg.1

Best states to make a living, rated by median income being adjusted for cost of living in the state, which puts California at 46th Place. In other words, 45 other states, actually pay more when adjusted for cost to live in California. Another reason that California is the most poverty stricken state in the entire nation.

Best States to Make a Living from MoneyRates.com

And as far back as 1869, the U.S. Supreme Court has already ruled the constitution does not give any state the right to succeed from the United States, and the Civil shows it is not a good idea to try. If California tried to do it by a Constitutional Amendment, it would take 3/4 of the other states agreeing to it, and that would never happen as at least 13 states would say no, and that would end the try.

[TheseGoTo11]

California has about 1/4 the value of all U.S. traded companies. Can't imagine a CNBC stock chat without California companies. We also produce some insane share of nuts, lemons, walnuts, carrots, broccoli, and other major ag products.

But the problem is this would all be worth little without free access to the other 49 states. And we'd have further problems if we didn't use the U.S. dollar. We'd also have no military protection. Yeah, I know a lot of Mission hipsters and self-important movie stars don't think we need a military, but a lot of people died in wars so they could think such things.

Hollywood could, and is, being replaced elsewhere.

And then there's the issue of free movement. Much of California's wealth has come from people who came here from other states, would the next Larry and Sergei be denied work visas?

[aslowdodge]

Originally Posted by goodie2shoes

Yes, CA can SURVIVE w/o the US. The US however cannot survive w/o CA. CA puts Hundreds of Billions of Tax Revenue into the Federal Budget. Which funds the Govt and the Poorer Red States.

This is why Republicans are so jealous of CA and they WISHED that CA was a red state so they can use it as an example to why being Red is awesome.

If you look at all the statistics, the Red states has the highest dependency of Govt aid, highest welfare participant, highest crime rates, etc etc.

Jeeze now I see why you think Ca is so great, You don't have even have your facts straight. That one poster said you have rose colored glasses and I said that on another thread, but now I see you just need glasses period because you just aren't seeing things as they are. You need to learn that statistics can be skewed any way the creator wants. Look beyond them and see the big picture.
Why do you keep bringing up republicans? Republicans are jealous of Ca???

How do you explain that Ca has about 33% of the entire nations welfare recipients, but only 12% of the nation's population. Yep the other states and republicans wish they had that.

Let's suppose Ca leaves the US on a non friendly basis saying we don't need you like you need us. Legally it would be a big mess. It might be very short sighted:

Ca imports it's water and it's economy depends on water. Suppose the US-Colorado says go to hell and cuts off the supply. There goes a huge chunk of your economy and a lot of jobs. Now those jobs aren't adding to your tax base, they are a double whammy because ca is paying jobless benefits to them.

Ca has a huge burden on welfare costs and also prides itself as being a sanctuary trying not to deport people. Suppose a lot of those poor people in your red states come to Ca to reap the generous benefits Ca doles out. The burden gets heavier and your people aren't going to deport them back to the US. If you tried the US would deny them return.

Ca on it's own would make it a target to an aggressive nation who decides it wants to invade and take Ca because it makes so much money. Could Ca fight them off? Well they wouldn't have much of an army if they left the US and to form an army when there so many liberals and gun haters might be problematic.

Ca funds the Fed to the tune of about 11% and takes up 12% of the population. Why aren't they funding 12%? Sure the US would miss that 11% of revenue, but they also would not have to shell out govt funds to support Ca. Bottom line it's a hit, but not one that can't be covered. You saying the US can't survive without Ca is hogwash.

Ca taxes would increase if they had to support the needed infrastructure if they wanted to leave. Ca has already seen business leave because of taxes and politics. If more left because of rising taxes that would mean less contributions to the tax base and thus a need to raise taxes again to compensate.

It's entirely possible that Ca would lose it's stability because of the changes and not be the rainbow state for you anymore. Not to mention Ca is not even 100% united. Southern and Nor Ca talk about splitting. The far north talks about splitting from the rest of the state.

[goodie2shoes]

Originally Posted by aslowdodge

Jeeze now I see why you think Ca is so great, You don't have even have your facts straight. That one poster said you have rose colored glasses and I said that on another thread, but now I see you just need glasses period because you just aren't seeing things as they are. You need to learn that statistics can be skewed any way the creator wants. Look beyond them and see the big picture.
Why do you keep bringing up republicans? Republicans are jealous of Ca???

????

Federal Tax Revenue by state: (in billion) It's not even close.
#1 California $369.2
#2 Texas $265.3

Compare US Federal Revenue by State 1998-2014 -Chart


States with the HIGHEST Welfare recipients
1. District of Columbia : 22% of the population on Welfare
2. Mississippi: 21.74%
3. New Mexico: 21.5%
4. West Virginia: 19.96%
5. Oregon: 19.93%
6. Tennessee: 19.58%

California? Only 11% of the Population is on Welfare!
Pretty amazing since we have the HIGHEST POPULATION of any State.

States with the most people on food stamps

CA puts over 100 BILLION more in taxes to the Feds than Tx. So yes, CA can survive all by itself if they just kept the money here in the States where it belongs. We can fund our own education, healthcare and Social Programs. Where would America be w/o the $369 BILLION in taxes? How would the POOR red states that DEPEND on the Federal Govt Survive if CA doesn't provide the $$$$?

States that Depend on Federal Money
https://wallethub.com/edu/states-most-least-dependent-on-the-federal-government/2700/

CA is #46 on the list.It sure DOESN'T NEED Federal money. Pretty AMAZING since CA GIVES more than most of Red States COMBINED.

[oldtrader]

If you look at all the statistics, the Red states has the highest dependency of Govt aid, highest welfare participant, highest crime rates, etc etc.

Take off those rose colored glasses.

California welfare capital of U.S.

Is California the welfare capital? - The San Diego Union-Tribune

Even beats out most of European Countries for title of #1.

https://www.cato.org/publications/co...untries-europe

[aslowdodge]

Originally Posted by goodie2shoes

????

Federal Tax Revenue by state: (in billion) It's not even close.
#1 California $369.2
#2 Texas $265.3

Compare US Federal Revenue by State 1998-2014 -Chart


States with the HIGHEST Welfare recipients
1. District of Columbia : 22% of the population on Welfare
2. Mississippi: 21.74%
3. New Mexico: 21.5%
4. West Virginia: 19.96%
5. Oregon: 19.93%
6. Tennessee: 19.58%

California? Only 11% of the Population is on Welfare!
Pretty amazing since we have the HIGHEST POPULATION of any State.

States with the most people on food stamps

CA puts over 100 BILLION more in taxes to the Feds than Tx. So yes, CA can survive all by itself if they just kept the money here in the States where it belongs. We can fund our own education, healthcare and Social Programs. Where would America be w/o the $369 BILLION in taxes? How would the POOR red states that DEPEND on the Federal Govt Survive if CA doesn't provide the $$$$?

States that Depend on Federal Money
https://wallethub.com/edu/states-most-least-dependent-on-the-federal-government/2700/

CA is #46 on the list.It sure DOESN'T NEED Federal money. Pretty AMAZING since CA GIVES more than most of Red States COMBINED.

Pay attention if you are able.
Now look at what you wrote:
"California? Only 11% of the Population is on Welfare!
Pretty amazing since we have the HIGHEST POPULATION of any State."

Now think beyond what you wrote. Only 11% of the people are on welfare you say. You also say Ca has the highest population of any state. Do the math if you know how . . . 11% of the highest population means Ca has more people on welfare than any other state.
33% of all welfare people in the entire US are in Ca. That's fully 1/3 of all welfare people.

I know why you keep referring to these stats, it's because you can't think for yourself. Politicians love people like you who can't think for themselves.

I wrote several examples of what could happen if Ca left and you couldn't reply intelligently to any of them. You are like a Parrot that keeps saying the same thing over and over but doesn't know what it is saying.

Once again where is Ca going to get all this money when it has no water to support it residents and businesses?

People keep poking holes in your arguments but you never back up what you say. Your comment about other states poisoning themselves refining gas was countered with the post about Ca refineries. You totally ignored that when you got called out on it. I was in the Bay area when almost 15,000 people got sick from the Richmond refinery and went to get medical care. This isn't the only incident. You should research things before you make blanket statements as you just lose more and more credibility.

[Shooting Stars]

Originally Posted by CalGal953

Or if we got more of our tax dollars back instead of sending them to welfare bums in Alaska, West Virginia, and the Deep South.

You know what you fail to realize? That you can thank NAFTA for that.

It's not because people in Alaska, West Virginia, or the Deep South are dumb about how to make their economy work and you are so much smarter.

Since you have the ports for all the Chinese merchandise coming in, and your economy is not based on manufacturing, you have benefited from NAFTA in ways they can't.

It was no skin off your nose when the parts of the country that actually made things was buried alive. And now that they are decimated, you call them "welfare bums." You believe you are superior because of the advantage of a physical location that greatly benefits from global trade.

[Tulemutt]

Originally Posted by Shooting Stars

You know what you fail to realize? That you can thank NAFTA for that.

It's not because people in Alaska, West Virginia, or the Deep South are dumb about how to make their economy work and you are so much smarter.

Since you have the ports for all the Chinese merchandise coming in, and your economy is not based on manufacturing, you have benefited from NAFTA in ways they can't.

It was no skin off your nose when the parts of the country that actually made things was buried alive. And now that they are decimated, you call them "welfare bums." You believe you are superior because of the advantage of a physical location that greatly benefits from global trade.

California leads the nation in manufacturing output.

You can look that up.

Just because we have a more diversified economy than southern states doesn't mean NAFTA doesn't affect California.