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Old 02-09-2024, 07:05 PM
pdw pdw started this thread
 
Location: Ontario, Canada
2,674 posts, read 3,094,512 times
Reputation: 1820

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I’ve been looking at how housing starts are down despite unprecedented amount of government removal of red tape and unprecedented demand.
https://www.cbc.ca/amp/1.7060588
Before the inevitable “lower immigration” comments come in, keep in mind housing skyrocketed in 2021 when immigration came more or less to a standstill during the pandemic.

Historical facts: Mulroney passed on the responsibility of public housing to the provinces and halted all new construction of it in the 80s. Before this, the CMHC was funding buildings.
Also, rentals have not been built faster than they’ve been demolished for condo projects since the removal of federal subsidies for rental construction. These used to be built with federal subsidies and then sold to REITs/other corporate landlords. Nowadays, there are virtually no rentals built for that purpose, which is why we have record low vacancy rates almost nationwide. Manitoba and Saskatchewan might be the only exceptions.

The other solutions I see for housing would be huge government overreach into the market. Like banning people from owning multiple homes, etc. I think it’s a win win if we can have construction of housing that isn’t rented at these unaffordable market rates. It’ll come at a cost, but the cost to society of having massive labour shortages and brain drain nationwide as almost no jobs pay enough for housing would be far greater.

Let’s get back the 70s/80s solutions. What are your thoughts?
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Old 02-09-2024, 07:37 PM
 
143 posts, read 111,383 times
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Since all the money government has come either from taxes or printing press, any subsidized housing in downtown Toronto will be payed for either by a specific wheat farmer in Saskatchewan, or by society at large via currency debasement. This refers to any subsidy whatsoever including subsidy to the wheat farmer to be paid by NS fisherman. The function of government is twofold: to maintain domestic peace and provide defense of the realm. That's all.
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Old 02-09-2024, 08:17 PM
 
1,224 posts, read 496,993 times
Reputation: 760
Yes lets put middle class families in public housing. What a wonderful idea..... This idea basically symbolizes a final nail in the coffin for the Canadian dream.
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Old 02-09-2024, 09:43 PM
 
Location: Canada
14,735 posts, read 15,033,548 times
Reputation: 34871
If there's going to be any kind of government subsidized housing then I think provincially subsidized housing for each province in accordance with each province's specific needs would be better then federal.

.
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Old 02-09-2024, 10:24 PM
 
Location: Canada
7,309 posts, read 9,324,850 times
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BC already has penalties on vacant homes, or so my stepdaughter informs me.
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Old 02-09-2024, 10:27 PM
 
Location: Canada
7,309 posts, read 9,324,850 times
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I think the government should get involved but I'm not going to pretend I know what specific scenario that should take.
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Old 02-10-2024, 11:00 AM
 
Location: North Idaho
32,647 posts, read 48,028,221 times
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How do I feel? What the government of Canada does is none of my business, but as a generalization, I don't like the idea of babies living in the gutter, so I am in favor of government (the taxpayers) providing small plain housing for those who can not provide for themselves. No luxuries, not a lot of space, not attractive enough to be used as free housing to the cheats who can actually pay their way but like to get free stuff.

Watching foreign films, I see what lower middle class housing looks like in other countries, and it is grim. Apartment buildings many stories high, small narrow dark apartments, dirt and crime. In a few countries, lower middle class housing is one room not much bigger than a closet for an entire family. But it keeps the rain off, it has heat in the winter and away to cook, and, especially in a country like Canada or the USA, if a person thinks they deserve better, it is easy enough to go out and earn enough to have better.

I'm opposed to the government (the taxpayer) proving nice three bedroom 2 bath houses in nice neighborhoods for people who basically have discovered that there is no need to work because they can live as a freeloader. If people can't work, then the government (the taxpayers) can provide them with a small plain place so they are not living on the street.
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Old 02-10-2024, 11:02 AM
 
1,224 posts, read 496,993 times
Reputation: 760
Not good

Quote:
Canada is underestimating the number of new homes needed — by a lot, says CIBC

Canada's housing shortage boils down to a forecasting failure, says economist

Current projections for the amount of additional housing Canada needs are way off the mark and out-of-date population forecasting is to blame, according to one top economist.

Article content
Canada needs to build five million extra units by 2030 on top of annual construction, said Benjamin Tal, deputy-chief economist with CIBC World Markets in a report on Feb. 6. That’s well above widely circulated estimates of 3.5 million additional homes needed by the end of the decade.

https://financialpost.com/news/canad...projected-cibc
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Old 02-10-2024, 11:09 AM
pdw pdw started this thread
 
Location: Ontario, Canada
2,674 posts, read 3,094,512 times
Reputation: 1820
Quote:
Originally Posted by oregonwoodsmoke View Post
How do I feel? What the government of Canada does is none of my business, but as a generalization, I don't like the idea of babies living in the gutter, so I am in favor of government (the taxpayers) providing small plain housing for those who can not provide for themselves. No luxuries, not a lot of space, not attractive as free housing to the cheats who can actually pay their way but like to get free stuff.

Watching foreign films, I see what lower middle class housing looks like in other countries, and it is grim. Apartment buildings many stories high, small narrow dark apartments, dirt and crime. In a few countries, lower middle class housing is one room not much bigger than a closet for an entire family. But it keeps the rain off, it has heat in the winter and away to cook, and, especially in a country like Canada or the USA, if a person thinks they deserve better, it is easy enough to go out and earn enough to have better.

I'm opposed to the government (the taxpayer) proving nice three bedroom 2 bath houses in nice neighborhoods for people who basically have discovered that there is no need to work because they can live as a freeloader. If people can't work, then the government (the taxpayers) can provide them with a small plain place so they are not living on the street.
I agree with this. The problem with the existing public housing is that the supply of it is so low that there’s like 30-40 year waiting lists for access and there’s maximum income requirements, stuff like that. If there’s a greater supply of public housing, there will be more transient families living there of different income brackets and won’t experience the same issues of concentrated poverty. These can be townhouse complexes, mid rise apartments, maybe complexes of small detached prefab homes. A lot of options out there.
The private market is building slower and slower despite all this red tape that’s been removed. Housing is an essential need like water and food and the government has a responsibility to ensure enough of it is being built. More non-market rentals will take the pressure off the market rentals too, so it’s a win win for all. If there’s a free market option that hasn’t been explored I’m open to it, but I don’t see one out there.
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Old 02-10-2024, 12:32 PM
 
Location: Vancouver
18,504 posts, read 15,552,312 times
Reputation: 11937
Quote:
Originally Posted by pdw View Post
I’ve been looking at how housing starts are down despite unprecedented amount of government removal of red tape and unprecedented demand.
https://www.cbc.ca/amp/1.7060588
Before the inevitable “lower immigration” comments come in, keep in mind housing skyrocketed in 2021 when immigration came more or less to a standstill during the pandemic.

Historical facts: Mulroney passed on the responsibility of public housing to the provinces and halted all new construction of it in the 80s. Before this, the CMHC was funding buildings.
Also, rentals have not been built faster than they’ve been demolished for condo projects since the removal of federal subsidies for rental construction. These used to be built with federal subsidies and then sold to REITs/other corporate landlords. Nowadays, there are virtually no rentals built for that purpose, which is why we have record low vacancy rates almost nationwide. Manitoba and Saskatchewan might be the only exceptions.

The other solutions I see for housing would be huge government overreach into the market. Like banning people from owning multiple homes, etc. I think it’s a win win if we can have construction of housing that isn’t rented at these unaffordable market rates. It’ll come at a cost, but the cost to society of having massive labour shortages and brain drain nationwide as almost no jobs pay enough for housing would be far greater.

Let’s get back the 70s/80s solutions. What are your thoughts?
My gut tells me that the federal government should get back in the game. This article I agree with.

"We now have a 30 year deficit in non-market housing, said Andy Yan, director of the city program at Simon Fraser University.

"We're dealing with the consequences now," said Yan. "Specific populations are struggling for housing that is affordable, that has some kind of relationship to their income."

"We see who's paying the price on our streets in Canada."

https://www.cbc.ca/radio/sunday/fede...sing-1.6946376
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