Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
I've been searching for a home for 20 months now (pre-approved in April 2017, but looking a month or so prior). Our limits have been our low $400k budget, desire for excellent schools and to be in Evanston. The inventory for the elementary school zones we want has been next to nothing.
So we decided to expand our search to west Evanston and as well as LaGrange Park (more walkable and less car dependent). But a colleague of mine showed me this new interactive map created by Harvard and Brown Universities and the U.S. Census Bureau that shows/predicts which Chicagoland neighborhoods yield successful kids.
The average annual salary for a 30 yr old female growing up in these areas:
Oak Brook, north of High School, around Mayslake- $93k
Glenview by Northshore County Club - $91k
South Loop, North of Roosevelt East of State - $87k
Forest Glen - $87k
Lincoln Park Alcott - $86k
Lakeview Hamilton School - $86k
Evanston Penny Park - $86k
Mundelein - $81k
Hoffman Estates - $80k
Indian Hills Wilmette - $79k
West Buffalo Grove - $79k
Naperville Greene Valley - $79k
West Hinsdale - $78k
Palos Heights - $77k
Woodridge - $76k
Libertyville - $76k
East Wilmette - $75k
West Glenview by Metra - $75k
Techy Northbrook - $75k
Even growing up in Beverly would've likely gotten you around a $69k job.
Compare to the areas you don't want to raise your kids:
Lawndale, Austin, Near West Side, Garfield Park and much of the South Side - $16k
Goose Island - $17k
Little Italy - $18k
Maywood - $22k
Rogers Park - $24k
Elk Grove Village - 32k
Has anyone else with younger kids looking to buy a house been using this map obsessively like myself?
I've been searching for a home for 20 months now (pre-approved in April 2017, but looking a month or so prior). Our limits have been our low $400k budget, desire for excellent schools and to be in Evanston. The inventory for the elementary school zones we want has been next to nothing.
So we decided to expand our search to west Evanston and as well as LaGrange Park (more walkable and less car dependent). But a colleague of mine showed me this new interactive map created by Harvard and Brown Universities and the U.S. Census Bureau that shows/predicts which Chicagoland neighborhoods yield successful kids.
The average annual salary for a 30 yr old female growing up in these areas:
Oak Brook, north of High School, around Mayslake- $93k
Glenview by Northshore County Club - $91k
South Loop, North of Roosevelt East of State - $87k
Forest Glen - $87k
Lincoln Park Alcott - $86k
Lakeview Hamilton School - $86k
Evanston Penny Park - $86k
Mundelein - $81k
Hoffman Estates - $80k
Indian Hills Wilmette - $79k
West Buffalo Grove - $79k
Naperville Greene Valley - $79k
West Hinsdale - $78k
Palos Heights - $77k
Woodridge - $76k
Libertyville - $76k
East Wilmette - $75k
West Glenview by Metra - $75k
Techy Northbrook - $75k
Even growing up in Beverly would've likely gotten you around a $69k job.
Compare to the areas you don't want to raise your kids:
Lawndale, Austin, Near West Side, Garfield Park and much of the South Side - $16k
Goose Island - $17k
Little Italy - $18k
Maywood - $22k
Rogers Park - $24k
Elk Grove Village - 32k
Has anyone else with younger kids looking to buy a house been using this map obsessively like myself?
I'm a bit confused about a couple things:
1. If I read this correctly, this is data on people born in 1978-1983, with the map representing the people growing up in these census tracts through age 23?
2. If my understanding about question 1 is correct, then I'm curious how that data is relevant today. Some areas have experienced notable demographic shifts.
3. Can you explain your Beverly comment? I don't fully understand it.
4. I moved a couple years ago and didn't know about this map, but it's quite interesting. If my assumption in number 1 is true, then I wouldn't use this map to determine where to buy a house.
The biggest indicator of a child's future wealth/ economic success is their parents. The list that you have created seems to align with this previous research.
That said, there are things - like good schools and other factors - that can push the pendulum one way or another.
I think the opportunity atlas is fantastic, but I wouldn't use it to decide on which schools/ neighborhoods you want to live in. The map shows historical data, but does that mean that these same neighborhoods will perform they way that they did in the past? Historical data from the 1990s, 2000s, and early 2010s might not give the best estimate of how places will currently perform. I would not argue that this is a predictive guide, the socioeconomic reality of life has changed significantly during the period this data represents.
The biggest indicator of a child's future wealth/ economic success is their parents. The list that you have created seems to align with this previous research.
That said, there are things - like good schools and other factors - that can push the pendulum one way or another.
I think the opportunity atlas is fantastic, but I wouldn't use it to decide on which schools/ neighborhoods you want to live in. The map shows historical data, but does that mean that these same neighborhoods will perform they way that they did in the past? Historical data from the 1990s, 2000s, and early 2010s might not give the best estimate of how places will currently perform. I would not argue that this is a predictive guide, the socioeconomic reality of life has changed significantly during the period this data represents.
I completely agree here. We moved to the chicago suburbs just over 6 months ago and we're in the U46 school district (which is notoriously know as "BAD" by most). Now our goal is to home school if possible (our kids are very young right now so it's not a pressing issue either way). But even so I've talked to multiple people in passing who live in the area and have kids in the U46 school district, middle and high school students, and they've all said a lot of what you see online makes everything out to be really bad when it's really not. I can't speak to every district but multiple people have said the greatest help for your kid in your school district is you, or the parents involvement (you are your kid's greatest advocate). One guy said his daughter was graduating with honors and has many friends who are really excelling in the schools. So just keep that in mind with your search OP.
I'm a bit confused about a couple things:
1. If I read this correctly, this is data on people born in 1978-1983, with the map representing the people growing up in these census tracts through age 23?
2. If my understanding about question 1 is correct, then I'm curious how that data is relevant today. Some areas have experienced notable demographic shifts.
3. Can you explain your Beverly comment? I don't fully understand it.
4. I moved a couple years ago and didn't know about this map, but it's quite interesting. If my assumption in number 1 is true, then I wouldn't use this map to determine where to buy a house.[/quote]
From my understanding, the research, based on tax and census data, looks at people born between 1978 and 1983 — now 34 to 40 years old — and maps their chances of upward mobility by the neighborhoods of their youth.
In particular, their research shows that every year spent in a better area during childhood increases a child’s earnings in adulthood, implying that the gains from moving to a better area are larger for children who are younger at the time of the move.
As someone has said, the weakness is this historical data doesn't show mobility rates for gentrified areas. But it does indicate those neighborhoods that have excellent outcomes likely still do.
Since I have young kids, I find this an especially useful tool to use now that I've expanded the areas for my home search. Since we are very middle income, I'd like to try to give my kids the best chance at becoming high earners.
There are a few things that surprise me, like how did the girls growing up in Westchester, IL (terrible schools from what I've seen) on average make more than the girls growing up in Harding Woods la Grange Park (one of the best schools in the area). So I guess I do have to be mindful of the neighborhood changes. But if I could find a home in one of those top earning areas, it's likely my kids will end up earning more than if we moved to La Grange Park (just as an example).
I think this is interesting, but pretty useless from a practical application. I just searched for my two childhood homes. I lived in Bloomingdale (Glendale Heights district 15 for schools) and St. Charles. Apparently my income should have been $43k based on the Bloomingdale address and $38k based on St. Charles, even though the St. Charles schools are considered much better. Either way, I made over $100k the year I turned 30. One of my siblings also made more than $43k and one makes a little less, but both of them chose careers that don't pay as highly (social work and teaching). They knew they wouldn't be pulling in $100k at age 30 and they are fine with that.
St. Charles was definitely a nicer town with better schools than what we had in Bloomingdale. So, I definitely wouldn't let something like this map convince me otherwise. Of course a lot has changed, too.
Since I have young kids, I find this an especially useful tool to use now that I've expanded the areas for my home search. Since we are very middle income, I'd like to try to give my kids the best chance at becoming high earners.
There are a few things that surprise me, like how did the girls growing up in Westchester, IL (terrible schools from what I've seen) on average make more than the girls growing up in Harding Woods la Grange Park (one of the best schools in the area). So I guess I do have to be mindful of the neighborhood changes. But if I could find a home in one of those top earning areas, it's likely my kids will end up earning more than if we moved to La Grange Park (just as an example).
If you want your kids to make more money then encourage them to go into high earning careers like engineering and finance where you don't need to take on massive student debt to do well. Encourage them to be entrepreneurs. At the end of the day though, happiness isn't just about income. I'm not happier than my sisters even though our household income is at least twice what theirs are. If anything, lately I feel the whole more money, more problems cliche applies.
As for Westchester, I'm pretty sure that a large portion of the population chooses private school there. So, those kids didn't necessarily go to the public schools.
I'm a bit confused about a couple things:
1. If I read this correctly, this is data on people born in 1978-1983, with the map representing the people growing up in these census tracts through age 23?
2. If my understanding about question 1 is correct, then I'm curious how that data is relevant today. Some areas have experienced notable demographic shifts.
3. Can you explain your Beverly comment? I don't fully understand it.
4. I moved a couple years ago and didn't know about this map, but it's quite interesting. If my assumption in number 1 is true, then I wouldn't use this map to determine where to buy a house.
From my understanding, the research, based on tax and census data, looks at people born between 1978 and 1983 — now 34 to 40 years old — and maps their chances of upward mobility by the neighborhoods of their youth.
In particular, their research shows that every year spent in a better area during childhood increases a child’s earnings in adulthood, implying that the gains from moving to a better area are larger for children who are younger at the time of the move.
As someone has said, the weakness is this historical data doesn't show mobility rates for gentrified areas. But it does indicate those neighborhoods that have excellent outcomes likely still do.
Since I have young kids, I find this an especially useful tool to use now that I've expanded the areas for my home search. Since we are very middle income, I'd like to try to give my kids the best chance at becoming high earners.
There are a few things that surprise me, like how did the girls growing up in Westchester, IL (terrible schools from what I've seen) on average make more than the girls growing up in Harding Woods la Grange Park (one of the best schools in the area). So I guess I do have to be mindful of the neighborhood changes. But if I could find a home in one of those top earning areas, it's likely my kids will end up earning more than if we moved to La Grange Park (just as an example).[/quote]
Okay, that's what I thought it was saying. I'd strongly recommend not relying on data from like 20-30 years ago for buying a house today, as other posters stated.
Some areas that are considered to have "excellent" outcomes (what do you consider excellent?) barely had better, or didn't have better outcomes than where I grew up, which is middle class and never gets discussed on these boards.
I agree with the nikita about Westchester. A lot of people there sent their kids to Catholic schools.
I still am not sure what's so surprising about outcomes of kids from Beverly born between 1978 and 1983.
I've been searching for a home for 20 months now (pre-approved in April 2017, but looking a month or so prior). Our limits have been our low $400k budget, desire for excellent schools and to be in Evanston. The inventory for the elementary school zones we want has been next to nothing.
So we decided to expand our search to west Evanston and as well as LaGrange Park (more walkable and less car dependent).
I would encourage you to also look in Downers Grove, in one of their better school boundaries- possibly within walking distance to the Metra. That rough price point works in your favor for a modestly sized home that if anything, would more than suffice as a starter home with ample space for kids, etc. Yes, it would require updates, but so would anything you find at that price point in EV. Really, adding in RE taxes you are somewhat priced out of that Evanston market. YMMV. DG has much lower RE taxes than north suburban cook county, not to mention an express train nearby.
I know very little about LGP other than it's popularity and location.
I would encourage you to also look in Downers Grove, in one of their better school boundaries- possibly within walking distance to the Metra. That rough price point works in your favor for a modestly sized home that if anything, would more than suffice as a starter home with ample space for kids, etc. Yes, it would require updates, but so would anything you find at that price point in EV. Really, adding in RE taxes you are somewhat priced out of that Evanston market. YMMV. DG has much lower RE taxes than north suburban cook county, not to mention an express train nearby.
I know very little about LGP other than it's popularity and location.
I live in Downers, so I am biased, but I think this is spot on -- there are a good number of middle-earning homes in DG, situated next to much higher-earners.
The possibility for getting to know those who are wealthier, and therefore getting the types of friendships, internships, and the like that this might afford, are considerable.
That said - I don't think that the specific neighborhood will make a huge difference if you are looking at like neighborhoods. As nikitakolata said - the right field will make all the difference. Think STEM!
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
