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I've read Boss three times, and that analysis above is far too oversimplified IMO.
If anything, Chicago paid the price for the mismanagement of the entire reconstruction of the South & Jim Crow, and companies recruiting black southerners by the tens of thousands to come compete with union labor up North. The Federal Government is the entity that forced the high rise public housing, Daley certainly is to blame for how it was rolled out in Chicago, but actually didn't want it at all.
Add American Pharaoh, Chicago: City of the Century, The Outfit, Mr. Capone, at least one book specifically on Rostenkowski's machine, Harold Washington and early black submachine boss Bill Dawson to your list. Then there's county government....then you've got to get up to speed on HDO and how the Latinos have been assimilated.
I didn't realize Chicago had so much written on it. I'm learning more about the history daily.
I give up on telling people that LA is one giant suburb. LAs neighborhoods are just as dense as any other city. A major difference, is that the apartment buildings are much newer, and the skyscrapers are more spread out in clusters all over the city and county. But whatever, believe what you want to believe. But your impressions of LA are outdated, as thinking that Chicago is looks like the Blues Brothers.
Are there really neighborhoods of blocks of 3/4 flats and courtyard buildings with studio units?
It has more to do with the average age and type of housing stock and Chicago's buildings were built in late 1800's early 1900's. California's boom didn't come until much later. Your 'typical' dwelling also looked different just by virtue of when it was built.
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I take the LA metro (rail) all the time. The Expo line to downtown, the There are MANY people who live without a car.
I like the tight core of Chicago too and dense walkable neighborhoods. But LA has just as many, they simply have non-walkable areas in between. Have you ever spent time in Santa Monica, Venice, Pasadena, Koreatown, Mid-wilshire, the commercial part of Beverly hills, downtown obviously, Los Feliz and Silverlake. LA is only slightly less dense than Chicago,
I find it hard to believe. While I haven't spent any appreciable time there, I doubt that there are many areas that have 3 liquor stores, 2 grocery stores, 4 bars, and 4 restaurants within a five minute walk of most housing stock. I don't think LA was ever intended to be a dense urban city like Chicago or NY.
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(Don't go looking up statistics, I know them already. Chicago 11,000 ppsqmi, LA 6000-7000 ppsqmi. LAs pop density is brought down by uninhabited mountains (hiking and scenic views within city limits) and most of the San Fernando Valley which is a huge annexed part). But the flat BASIN is about 10,000 pp/sq mi.
Density in the Chicago METRO DID go down, as people moved to the suburbs. Density in California METRO areas and CITIES went UP over time, as they were surrounded by mountains and had no more room to build so they had to build modern apartment buildings.
LA also is the second largest city in the US with double the land area of Chicago and slightly more than NYC.
And people didn't leave the city for the burbs, the left the whole tri state area in search of work.
Chicago as a city is still holding its own.
LA has the whole nice weather thing going for it, so I would imagine people would want to move there simply for that.
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I simply amazed by metro areas, that have stuff to do, in nearly all parts of the metro area. Chicago may have an awesome core, but how does that make the outlying areas any special just because they are in Chicago. When you have attractions and amenities, nightlife, museums, ethnic diversity spread out evenly across many different areas across the city that exposes all residents to diversity, etc.
Uhh, I think it does. When I can have my house in a relatively quiet area, but can take a 20 min el ride, or if it's the weekend it's 4 miles and a 10 minute or $12 cab ride downtown for a night out.
Spread out in and of itself doesn't automatically mean 'better.'
I'm all about easy accessibility to as much as possible, and if the commute times are low, (If something isn't within 10 minute radius of home, I usually figure there's another similar option that is closer)
My most precious commodity is time, and if I can do 90% of what I want to do and spend less than 20 minutes commuting to all of it, that's a huge home run.
While you say traffic in LA isn't that bad, I find it hard to believe you have as much as accessible to you in as close of a radius.
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The gives residents exposure to a lot of different qualities. Chicagos core is world class, but how in the world does Chicagos core make the residents of Hegewisch any more lucky or any more cosmopolitan than residents of South Bend, IN. Or even Archer Heights?? Its an old marginal Polish neighborhood that has seen an influx of different immigrants. Not unlike Hamtramck, MI. In fact most of Chicago is like 50 Hamtramck, MIs all one after another.
I didn't say that. You tried writing off 2/3 of the city as being a bombed out warzone, which isn't true.
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I have not found the traffic in LA to be any worse than what I have experienced in Chicago.
You must have gotten lucky in your situation because I hear all about the 7 lane highways that are in total gridlock.
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And as far as Detroit, Cleveland, and Pittsburgh go, they do have intact neighborhoods that are very similar to Chicagos counterparts.
This was in response to your comment about world class core with a rustbelt surrounding it. Yes, there are similar neighborhoods, but do they have a similar world-class anything to go with that?
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You keep people who say: "Are you a Cubs fan or a Sox fan? You're not either? Well what are you interested in? Black people CHOOSE to segregate themselves. I don't have to sound progressive, I live in 773, I'm a bad*** and don't have to prove anything to anyone."
Chicago OFFERS an urban living lifestyle superior to anything that any other city has to offer, but that has NOTHING to do with the world of the average residents of the metro area or even the city.
NYC rightfully deserves top rights to offering an urban lifestyle. Chicago comes second.
I don't think LA ever intended to be that. They're doing their own west coast thing.
The suburbs of Chicago are directly benefitted by the urban core offering good paying jobs, world class schools and education system and a great deal of culture that is reasonably accessible to most of the population.
If it has nothing to do with the average life of those living around it, then the residents living just outside Peoria Il should have similar lifestyles and opportunities to those living in say, River Forest.
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For the record, this does not apply to anyone else, but rparz. He chose to stereotype and put down some cities, so therefore I am replying in the same kind. This is in no way is about Chicago, rather simply how the poster is pulling the same stereotypes out of a hat.
I know how you feel having to prove that you are not like them. I constantly felt that way living in Lakeview. That takes too much energy!
Now that I've moved, I don't feel like I have to prove anything to anyone. It is their ignorance that we are trying to adjust to. It is not our fault that they refuse to socialize or they judge who would be a good neighbor based on skin color. I don't need to pull out my w2's or flash my degree to show that I am educated and make a certain income. Its rediculous that I've lived in other cities that arent as "great" as Chicago, but never experienced the tension based upon race as I have here.
So I guess if someone fears me because of skin color, let them fear! Thats on them not me. (thats easier said than done because I relocated to Hydepark).
I don't need to pull out my w2's or flash my degree to show that I am educated and make a certain income
I almost died laughing when I read this. But it can feel that way at times living in the northside of Chicago.
Living without a CAR??? In Los Angeles??? Ha Ha Ha! I would like to see some fool try that one! You not only need a car there but you almost need a car for each day of the week! Public transportation?? In Los Angeles??? ROTFL!!! Ha Ha Ha!
I've read Boss three times, and that analysis above is far too oversimplified IMO.
If anything, Chicago paid the price for the mismanagement of the entire reconstruction of the South & Jim Crow, and companies recruiting black southerners by the tens of thousands to come compete with union labor up North. The Federal Government is the entity that forced the high rise public housing, Daley certainly is to blame for how it was rolled out in Chicago, but actually didn't want it at all.
Add American Pharaoh, Chicago: City of the Century, The Outfit, Mr. Capone, at least one book specifically on Rostenkowski's machine, Harold Washington and early black submachine boss Bill Dawson to your list. Then there's county government....then you've got to get up to speed on HDO and how the Latinos have been assimilated.
I agree with Chi-town Native. Saying that the Richard J. held black Chicagoans in "spiteful contempt" is inaccurate, and to condemn Richard M. ("the Daleys") in the same terms is downright unfair. I recognize that both mayors pursued some harmful policies, and Richard J. may be fairly criticized for his role in appeasing white segregationists within the city. But the historical realities are far more complex than Tex claims (and... most likely... ditto to the claims of anyone who would end his argument on Chicago political history with "read Royko if you don't believe me").
I have not found the traffic in LA to be any worse than what I have experienced in Chicago.
Really? I've found it to be tenfold worse in Los Angeles. I've driven in and through LA about a dozen times, never during what would be "rush hour" in almost every other city, and there is not once I haven't been stuck in gridlock traffic. And that includes once at 11p on a Sunday on the 101. I've never experienced that in Chicago. And as far as I know Chicago doesn't have a "Carmageddon" when a stretch of an interstate is shut down.
Living without a CAR??? In Los Angeles??? Ha Ha Ha! I would like to see some fool try that one! You not only need a car there but you almost need a car for each day of the week! Public transportation?? In Los Angeles??? ROTFL!!! Ha Ha Ha!
This isn't 1980.
Your statement sounded just as intelligent and up to date as asking someone if they work at the Union Stock Yards in Chicago.
Really? I've found it to be tenfold worse in Los Angeles. I've driven in and through LA about a dozen times, never during what would be "rush hour" in almost every other city, and there is not once I haven't been stuck in gridlock traffic. And that includes once at 11p on a Sunday on the 101. I've never experienced that in Chicago. And as far as I know Chicago doesn't have a "Carmageddon" when a stretch of an interstate is shut down.
LA has/had a "carmageddon" on the 405 in the Sepulveda pass, because it is basically like shutting down a bridge. The 405 goes through the only naturally low spot along the Santa Monica mountains between Griffith Park and where the mountains continue westward into more wild terrain. Its the ONLY spot that goes between the West Side and the Valley.
It would literally be like shutting down the Golden Gate Bridge, or the Detroit Ambassador Bridge, or any other bridge.
LA seems to do its roadwork all at once. Whether that is better or not, to simply shut down a whole section of vital, strategic freeway versus shutting down one or two lanes for weeks on end (which happens more in Chicago) can be debated.
LA traffic can be ground to a halt based on sometimes very, very little things. THAT I will say makes LA different from other cities. Public transportation has expanded far beyond what most people have the stereotype for. Most of the time the numerous, wide freeways carry people and goods fairly efficiently, but one tiny accident will shut traffic down for miles. Unlike Chicago which has more predictable bottleneck traffic patterns. (roads and highways CAN'T widen, because there is already property so roads stay narrow, and therefore more traffic).
But unlike Chicago, LA has nightlife hotspots, concert venues, etc., etc., scatttered everywhere, many of
which are not at all served on a transit line of any kind, and one must drive.
This is not an issue in Chicago, because nearly ALL tourist attractions, nightlife, venues, that would bring droves of people are basically all in and around downtown.
Los Angeles does have a train system now and a bus system. The problem is that things are more spread out in Los Angeles. My cousin was on the city council and was the city controller of LA for over 15 years. She told me about the problems they face in LA even though they have public transit. The numbers have been getting better though. I think a lot of people would be surprised at how many people actually ride their system, but at the same time for many areas within Los Angeles, it's just not efficient to take that. For other areas of course it is.
You could live within a car in LA, but it depends on where you live, where you work, etc. There are areas of LA that are completely walkable (go to Ventura Boulevard in many areas and tell me you NEED a car), but at the same time there's a ton of areas in LA where you absolutely need a car depending on your lifestyle especially.
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This isn't 1980. 
