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I can actually appreciate Chicago when I relieve myself of the pressure that I supposed to live there and accept it the way it is just to be around others my age and single, just because I grew up within 40 miles of there.
When you actually lived near Chicago i.e. Oak Park, were you hanging out with people you grew up with on average?
It's not really that strange. If I wanted a smaller city that was a little slower paced, I'd consider living there. The winters are brutal - much worse than Chicago, but the summers just like Chicago are very nice. I'm used to the weather though. It was -10 the other night as I was back in Minnesota but it didn't phase me. I actually liked it!
However, it's a little small in mentality sometimes and can be very cliquey in a way. A lot of people who live there grew up in Minnesota, though there's a sizable immigrant population which is great. The area has a lot of people, but the city itself isn't as big as people think at around 400,000. St. Paul is nice too and has a population of under 300,000. Just slightly larger than St. Louis is Minneapolis.
I have friend in Chicago who grew up in the bay area but lived in Minneapolis for awhile. His complaint about Minneapolis is the thing I mentioned above that it can be hard to get in a group of friends sometimes because so many people living there grew up with one another. When you do, it's kind of small enough in areas you may hang out in that word travels fast about you type of thing. I'm not lying either when I say that at least 80% of my graduating class in high school (over 400 people) stayed in state to do their college, and that was normal for all other graduating classes I saw.
In some areas there is a progressive feel but in others, especially once you get out of the city for the majority of places, it's almost like a country mentality. I guess growing up in the state I have had the (dis)pleasure of knowing this first hand, but I find the non progressive people in Minnesota more racist than the ones in the Chicago area. Many, many, many, many more people of the "YEAH! Beer, huntin, 4 wheelin, and 'Merica!" type Minnesota, even in the Minneapolis area, than in the Chicago area by far as well based on my experience.
But you are comparing a state which you have been all around in to a metro area, where you've mostly only been around the urban core. All thats fine, but that might skew your perception.
One can stay only in Minneapolis proper and never leave, and spend time on the fringes of Chicagoland in the Jolilet area, NW Indiana, or McHenry county and have perceptions flipped.
When you actually lived near Chicago i.e. Oak Park, were you hanging out with people you grew up with on average?
Not so much. By the time I finished up undergrad and grad school, my high school friends and I drifted a little, although we hung out on occasion but it was mostly "catching up"
I went to ALL sorts of activities and events in the city, in the usual suspect neighborhoods. Its not like I didn't experience any of that, I did. But when I told them I didn't live in Chicago proper, they had a confused, slightly put-off, "why do you live there and not "the city"" questions.
Its because people who love Chicago love it for the compactness, never having to live beyond a certain radius.
I thought Oak Park would be a great compromise, and although I loved it, there were fewer single 20s/30s age people in Oak Park than I thought there would be, most of my friends I made in Oak Park/Forest Park and other nearby areas were 10 years older than me, the ones my age, seemed to be young couples that just moved from the city.
Meanwhile, those who I met who lived on the north side, all thought I might as well be living in Naperville.
But you are comparing a state which you have been all around in to a metro area, where you've mostly only been around the urban core. All thats fine, but that might skew your perception.
One can stay only in Minneapolis proper and never leave, and spend time on the fringes of Chicagoland in the Jolilet area, NW Indiana, or McHenry county and have perceptions flipped.
I didn't write it as well as I could have, but the metro area of Minneapolis is much like this once you get out of the cities of Minneapolis, St. Paul, and just a few other suburbs. About 2/3 of the population of Minnesota also lives in the Minneapolis area, and Rochester area is only a 1-1.25 hour drive away with another 200,000 people.
I hope you realize you're talking to someone who actually grew up in the state and has spent considerable time in numerous towns/cities in the Minneapolis area. Trust me, I know what I'm talking about with this. I have spent time in a lot of suburbs in the Chicago area as well, and while you can definitely find the hick type of people in the Chicago area on the fringes, there are more in the Minneapolis area, and you'll find them in the Minneapolis area much closer to the actual cities of Minneapolis or St. Paul than you will to Chicago. I find more racist and "AMERICA!" people live in the Minneapolis area especially in the suburbs than in the Chicago area.
Of course, there's many progressive people in those two cities, but once you get out of them, and I mean immediately outside of them, things do change in most of the suburbs right away.
I went to ALL sorts of activities and events in the city, in the usual suspect neighborhoods.
I know what you're saying, which is why I don't hang out much in neighborhoods like Old Town, Lakeview (Except LVE, but even then I don't go to those bars), or Lincoln Park.
Based on our descriptions, we are similar in some ways. We both like to dress in a trendy way and what not (I remember you saying something about a salmon colored shirt and being called gay, except it was in like Norwood Park). I enjoy places with more cosmopolitan feel where it's more than just sports and you can dress cool. However, I have had absolutely no problem (a) finding places to hang out that are like this and (b) finding friends who are like this. The places I go to have people dressing the same way and nobody cares.
When I first moved here, I went with some new coworkers to bars in areas like Lincoln Park and 3 weeks later I realized it wasn't for me, but I didn't have a problem finding other places that fit more of my personality right away.
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Meanwhile, those who I met who lived on the north side, all thought I might as well be living in Naperville.
If by north side you mean Lincoln Park, Old Town, and 66-75% of Lakeview and North Center, then I agree. However, I disagree about half of Gold Coast, Streeterville, River North, Uptown, 50% of Lincoln Square, Rogers Park, most of Edgewater, etc.
I know what you're saying, which is why I don't hang out much in neighborhoods like Old Town, Lakeview (Except LVE, but even then I don't go to those bars), or Lincoln Park.
Based on our descriptions, we are similar in some ways. We both like to dress in a trendy way and what not (I remember you saying something about a salmon colored shirt and being called gay, except it was in like Norwood Park). I enjoy places with more cosmopolitan feel where it's more than just sports and you can dress cool. However, I have had absolutely no problem (a) finding places to hang out that are like this and (b) finding friends who are like this. The places I go to have people dressing the same way and nobody cares.
When I first moved here, I went with some new coworkers to bars in areas like Lincoln Park and 3 weeks later I realized it wasn't for me, but I didn't have a problem finding other places that fit more of my personality right away.
If by north side you mean Lincoln Park, Old Town, and 66-75% of Lakeview and North Center, then I agree. However, I disagree about half of Gold Coast, Streeterville, River North, Uptown, 50% of Lincoln Square, Rogers Park, most of Edgewater, etc.
Fair enough. You are absolutely right, and I don't disagree with you in the slightest.
The big difference I think between you and me, is that you like the ultimate built urban environment and probably not much of an outdoor adventure guy, I prefer a mix or proximity of nature and city culture. The mix of, or proximity of nature and city culture. Like I said, Oak Park was passable. I could go down North Ave and be in Wicker Park/Bucktown, I have a little forest preserve down the street on the Des Plaines river, I go down to the Palos/Sag Valley 10-15 miles away, had a group of friends that did this stuff with as well, but they were largely like I said 7-12 years older than me.
Chicago is a tough place to meet "city people" who like leaving the city, or at least the immediate urban environment. Thats a HUGE difference between Chicago and the west coast, obviously.
I like urban, cosmopolitan, sophisticated mindset, with a love for "the country", nature, and the outdoors. And where I live, I can go for a horse trail ride through Griffith Park and meet cute girls, and talk about going to the Santa Ynez valley (wine country), then go do whatever city stuff later that evening.
I didn't write it as well as I could have, but the metro area of Minneapolis is much like this once you get out of the cities of Minneapolis, St. Paul, and just a few other suburbs. About 2/3 of the population of Minnesota also lives in the Minneapolis area, and Rochester area is only a 1-1.25 hour drive away with another 200,000 people.
I hope you realize you're talking to someone who actually grew up in the state and has spent considerable time in numerous towns/cities in the Minneapolis area. Trust me, I know what I'm talking about with this. I have spent time in a lot of suburbs in the Chicago area as well, and while you can definitely find the hick type of people in the Chicago area on the fringes, there are more in the Minneapolis area, and you'll find them in the Minneapolis area much closer to the actual cities of Minneapolis or St. Paul than you will to Chicago. I find more racist and "AMERICA!" people live in the Minneapolis area especially in the suburbs than in the Chicago area.
Of course, there's many progressive people in those two cities, but once you get out of them, and I mean immediately outside of them, things do change in most of the suburbs right away.
Yeah, I guess its a big difference. In the past my jobs have taken me more in the exurbs in Chicago, with people who grew up in the exurbs. (environmental related jobs).
The big difference I think between you and me, is that you like the ultimate built urban environment and probably not much of an outdoor adventure guy, I prefer a mix or proximity of nature and city culture.
True, though I actually love both the built environment and nature, but I'm not so much of a midwest type of outdoorsy person. I'd say I like being around people more perhaps, but that's not to say I don't enjoy nature. I enjoy the beach, the ocean, etc absolutely but I'm not much of a camping, fishing, hunting type of guy in the slightest if that makes sense. When I go on vacations that are away from people, it's to tropical climates. One of my favorite places I've been in the world is the Kuala Lumpur area, which is like a cross between Los Angeles and Honolulu. There are built environments, but there's a ton of nature there too. It would be hard to live there without a car to put it lightly, but in small areas you could do it.
If I made about double or more what I do now, I would buy property in British Virgin Islands (or attempt - it's really hard as an outsider to do that). Not many people live there, especially when you get off the main island and the area is stunningly gorgeous. It's the only place in the world where I've had a beach to myself and didn't get a little sad that literally no people were around.
The thing is though, I enjoy being outside period and in a place like Chicago, being outside means you actually get to interact with other people and architecture. In other cities, it's kind of flipped - more pure nature but less people and architecture. I grew up going to LA every year of my life since my family is from there, but I always preferred the spontaneity of a place like NYC or Chicago. I think part of my love for a built environment also comes from "practicing" Parkour and Free Running for awhile. I've learned to appreciate these things but that love was there before.
In the end, I enjoy the balance between walkability and nature. I think Chicago has more nature than people give it credit for and while not 100% of that is my type of nature, there's enough that doesn't make me disgusted. The only place I can think of that offers a true balance in these things is San Francisco. I can afford to live there, but I don't want to pay its prices. I'm keeping an eye on LA because I know it's improving in these areas. If it could be more walkable in numerous areas with better public transit like Chicago, I'd definitely consider moving there and closer to my family. I know there's actually an exhibit or museum in LA with developments, buildings, etc that could have been, but never happened. Too bad they had to tear up the street car system too. That is one reason why LA is more spread out - because their street car system was actually one of the tops in the nation.
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Chicago is a tough place to meet "city people" who like leaving the city, or at least the immediate urban environment. Thats a HUGE difference between Chicago and the west coast, obviously.
I don't know about that. I have a number of friends who do like nature. I was asked by five different friends this summer alone here on camping trips to like Michigan. I have a lot of other friends who go to the Caribbean and Hawaii quite a bit, to areas where nobody lives and just nature.
Last edited by marothisu; 12-27-2013 at 05:05 PM..
I love that I am visiting family and friends for the holidays in the Chicago suburbs, and while I always go downtown/city proper while I'm in town, I just can't live there. But I enjoyed going to the Christkindlmarket as I do every holiday season, I went to the Field museum and saw they're special exhibits, Saturday I'm going to a couple microbrews.
See downtown is a large part of the reason why I love Chicago. I love that you have all the skyscrapers, stores, museums, restaurants, etc, but then you can hop on the CTA for 15 minutes and be in a neighborhood where you can walk to all your amenities but still have it not be dominated by high rises and skyscrapers.
I think if Los Angeles had better public transit that I could possibly see myself living there, even with its spread out feel. It's not compact like how I like my cities, but if I could reasonably get from one end of town to the other that wouldn't be as big of a concern for me as it is now. At this point in my life a car, and all the money that one entails, is frankly something that I don't need.
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I can actually appreciate Chicago when I relieve myself of the pressure that I supposed to live there and accept it the way it is just to be around others my age and single, just because I grew up within 40 miles of there.
Yeah, I have family and friends who grew up in the further out suburbs of St. Louis who now live either in the city itself or the immediate suburbs in St. Louis County, meaning the ones where you sometimes don't even realize you've left St. Louis in the first place, and I sometimes get comments about how far away Chicago is, how expensive it is, why I don't move back, etc.
I imagine such expectations are natural almost everywhere, but sometimes you just have to move to a new place.
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Originally Posted by Tex?Il?
I like urban, cosmopolitan, sophisticated mindset, with a love for "the country", nature, and the outdoors. And where I live, I can go for a horse trail ride through Griffith Park and meet cute girls, and talk about going to the Santa Ynez valley (wine country), then go do whatever city stuff later that evening.
This makes sense why you like LA.
My brother suggested that our family go horseback riding in Griffith Park, and I spent the whole time getting yelled at by the instructor for not keeping the horse close enough to the ledge and praying to God that the horse didn't tumble over the side of the mountain. Not a fun day for me.
Personally, my idea of nature is going to a beach or taking a stroll through a park. I was never really the outdoorsy type.
My brother suggested that our family go horseback riding in Griffith Park, and I spent the whole time getting yelled at by the instructor for not keeping the horse close enough to the ledge and praying to God that the horse didn't tumble over the side of the mountain. Not a fun day for me.
Personally, my idea of nature is going to a beach or taking a stroll through a park. I was never really the outdoorsy type.
I also like going to the beach too. But even then, its for a bike ride on the strand or for kayaking and snorkeling around rock outcrops.
That (the nature and outdoors part) and I also love being around people who choose a career path they are passionate about regardless of the job market, and worry about making a living if that doesn't work out later. (Aka: screenwriting, acting, songwriting/music industry, etc.)
Its also why I love college towns. (higher education is as tough as entertainment.)
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