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These sounds are 100% real. But of course, God says in the Bible that even if the rich man were to be let out of Hell to testify to his brothers, they still would not believe. Pharaoh didn't believe even after witnessing the plagues and the death of the first born sons. So what does that tell you about unbelievers in the modern world? These sounds are 100% empirical evidence that not only Hell exist, but there are millions of souls there and in torment. If you do not believe, you chose not to. Just like you chose not to go to Heaven.
I completely agree. Twin shared with me the same thing about Lazarus and the rich man. And as for my SPF comment it was meant more lighthearted and not to be offensive. I do believe in hell. I believe it's real and it does exist. Is it in the center of the earth? Not sure, don't know but Satan is the prince of this world, so maybe the souls who don't want anything to do with God end up there, in the center of the earth. Ultimately that doesn't matter.
I completely agree. Twin shared with me the same thing about Lazarus and the rich man. And as for my SPF comment it was meant more lighthearted and not to be offensive. I do believe in hell. I believe it's real and it does exist. Is it in the center of the earth? Not sure, don't know but Satan is the prince of this world, so maybe the souls who don't want anything to do with God end up there, in the center of the earth. Ultimately that doesn't matter.
If you believe in hell because you spent hours researching the original hebrew word 'sheol' and how it is translated almost arbitrarily as grave or hell in the king james version and what it's real historical meaning is, and then you STILL believe in hell...then okay, whatever.
But if you believe in hell because of what your preacher told you, you are simply an ignorant sheep.
It is 100% impossible to believe in a physical, literal hell based on an honest inquiry into the topic. Simply impossible...and when you get rid of that blasphemous side of Christianity, it sure does leave you with a much more loveable God.
If you believe in hell because you spent hours researching the original hebrew word 'sheol' and how it is translated almost arbitrarily as grave or hell in the king james version and what it's real historical meaning is, and then you STILL believe in hell...then okay, whatever.
But if you believe in hell because of what your preacher told you, you are simply an ignorant sheep.
It is 100% impossible to believe in a physical, literal hell based on an honest inquiry into the topic. Simply impossible...and when you get rid of that blasphemous side of Christianity, it sure does leave you with a much more loveable God.
It's interesting how so many believers think hell cannot possibly exist, but they have no problem believing that heaven exists with just as much (READ: lack of) evidence. Just because something is written in a book, it doesn't mean it's true. (Harry Potter anyone?)
"Proving" the existence of god/heaven/angels by referring to the bible gets you caught in a circular argument which makes you look foolish: "God exists because the bible says so. The bible says so because it's the word of god." Can't you see the circularity of that argument as well? No reason. No logic. No facts required. Just undying, unquestioning "faith".
faith/fāTH/
Noun: 1. Complete trust or confidence in someone or something.
2. Strong belief in God or in the doctrines of a religion, based on spiritual apprehension rather than proof.
Interesting that you call others "ignorant sheep" when you are just as guilty as being an "ignorant sheep" yourself. That is called HYPOCRISY!
I completely agree. Twin shared with me the same thing about Lazarus and the rich man. And as for my SPF comment it was meant more lighthearted and not to be offensive. I do believe in hell. I believe it's real and it does exist. Is it in the center of the earth? Not sure, don't know but Satan is the prince of this world, so maybe the souls who don't want anything to do with God end up there, in the center of the earth. Ultimately that doesn't matter.
Um...I hate to be a phrasing judge here but technicially you don't "completely" agree with him if you agree that this recording is a hoax (as has been well proven on this thread so far) since he claims these sounds are real. Secondly, if you "completely" agree already that hell is an eternal torture chamber (how you think this is moral justice and still are a sane human being is beyond me), you're either really not objectively "researching" hell, or your research is concluded and you've made up your mind already.
Anyways, I think you need to continue your research as there are many other arguably biblical possibilities of what hell could be or not be (such as Eternal Seperation, Annihilationism, and Universal Reconciliation)that in my opinion, make infinitely more moral sense. I've been researching the idea of hell for years and tried to justify the traditional torture hell every possible way morally and I always fall about infinitely short of doing so.
Just as an example. Here's how the general outlook is from my view and understanding: God at the beginning of the universe made the rules and punishments for a single sin which in your model is eternal torture (supposedly because the significance of sin is eternal) and having all of our offspring automaticallly born in sin (original sin). He then creates these temporal beings who have no mental ability to even comprehend eternity in different parts of the world allowing them to create their own religions and cultures over time and created the only way to save themselves (Jesus) something that probably less then 10% of everyone who ever lived are lucky enough to discover.
If you ask me, this is the type of justice system that makes Vlad the Impaler's system look like a "go to your room!" justice system. I mean, this is the typle of thing that can morally justify the Spanish Inquisition (which no one expects ) and other "repent now" atrocities in history and suddenly, 72 virgins for being a martyr doesn't sound so crazy by comparison. Its one thing to say there are "hard truths" in the Bible or that God just knows justice better than us, but When is something sounds so morally absurd it is infinitely beyond and known human scale of justice, alternatives must be re-examined. That is one thing this forum is really good at. ..oh just as a side note, if you really want to take the rich man in hell story literally, that means your going to be sitting on Abrahams breast for all eternity...I guess if you're into that kind of thing..lol
Last edited by Jrhockney; 10-19-2012 at 11:52 AM..
Don't listen to this type of thing unless this is what you want in your world.
Huh? You mean just by listening to it, it'll become part of my world? Wow... this must be powerful stuff for you to say that! I better go listen to it again.
...or maybe I should listen to Tony Robbins tapes. He promises me a lifetime of success for only $215... what a bargain!
Get over yourself with the hyperbole. Listening to this badly produced garbage will hardly become a part of "anybody's world".
These sounds are 100% real. But of course, God says in the Bible that even if the rich man were to be let out of Hell to testify to his brothers, they still would not believe. Pharaoh didn't believe even after witnessing the plagues and the death of the first born sons. So what does that tell you about unbelievers in the modern world? These sounds are 100% empirical evidence that not only Hell exist, but there are millions of souls there and in torment. If you do not believe, you chose not to. Just like you chose not to go to Heaven.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jrhockney
Have you even read this thread?.. Do I really have to repost the freaken video of the Christian hell believer who found the same audio recording in a 1973 horror movie? And btw, I seriously don't know how you sleep at night saying and believing this biblically questionable moral insanity.
Shush. Don't disturb Allen's fantasy world. There's certain things you just can't fix.
Anyways, I think you need to continue your research as there are many other arguably biblical possibilities of what hell could be or not be (such as Eternal Seperation, Annihilationism, and Universal Reconciliation)that in my opinion, make infinitely more moral sense. I've been researching the idea of hell for years and tried to justify the traditional torture hell every possible way morally and I always fall about infinitely short of doing so.
Just as an example. Here's how the general outlook is from my view and understanding: God at the beginning of the universe made the rules and punishments for a single sin which in your model is eternal torture (supposedly because the significance of sin is eternal) and having all of our offspring automaticallly born in sin (original sin). He then creates these temporal beings who have no mental ability to even comprehend eternity in different parts of the world allowing them to create their own religions and cultures over time and created the only way to save themselves (Jesus) something that probably less then 10% of everyone who ever lived are lucky enough to discover.
If you ask me, this is the type of justice system that makes Vlad the Impaler's system look like a "go to your room!" justice system. I mean, this is the typle of thing that can morally justify the Spanish Inquisition (which no one expects ) and other "repent now" atrocities in history and suddenly, 72 virgins for being a martyr doesn't sound so crazy by comparison. Its one thing to say there are "hard truths" in the Bible or that God just knows justice better than us, but When is something sounds so morally absurd it is infinitely beyond and known human scale of justice, alternatives must be re-examined. That is one thing this forum is really good at. ..oh just as a side note, if you really want to take the rich man in hell story literally, that means your going to be sitting on Abrahams breast for all eternity...I guess if you're into that kind of thing..lol
Excellent post! Common sense and reason should be all that goes into deciding what is real or not. Of course, fundamentalists are perfectly content with the traditional view of hell because in their little world, they won't be there. Only the wicked (98% of the world other than their little clan) will be eternally tormented. They sleep well at night believing this. That's the scary part of it all!
It's interesting how so many believers think hell cannot possibly exist, but they have no problem believing that heaven exists with just as much (READ: lack of) evidence. Just because something is written in a book, it doesn't mean it's true. (Harry Potter anyone?)
"Proving" the existence of god/heaven/angels by referring to the bible gets you caught in a circular argument which makes you look foolish: "God exists because the bible says so. The bible says so because it's the word of god." Can't you see the circularity of that argument as well? No reason. No logic. No facts required. Just undying, unquestioning "faith".
faith/fāTH/
Noun: 1. Complete trust or confidence in someone or something.
2. Strong belief in God or in the doctrines of a religion, based on spiritual apprehension rather than proof.
Interesting that you call others "ignorant sheep" when you are just as guilty as being an "ignorant sheep" yourself. That is called HYPOCRISY!
Comprehend much? I don't believe in hell OR heaven, so I'm not sure how I become a hypocrite. I was only pointing out how so-called "Christians" have no idea what they believe. They blindly accept what their preacher tells them without a clue as to the lack of any support for 99% of what is spewed from the pulpit on a weekly basis.
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) and other "repent now" atrocities in history and suddenly, 72 virgins for being a martyr doesn't sound so crazy by comparison. Its one thing to say there are "hard truths" in the Bible or that God just knows justice better than us, but When is something sounds so morally absurd it is infinitely beyond and known human scale of justice, alternatives must be re-examined. That is one thing this forum is really good at.
..oh just as a side note, if you really want to take the rich man in hell story literally, that means your going to be sitting on Abrahams breast for all eternity...I guess if you're into that kind of thing..lol 
