The difficulty of salvation (passages, explanation, women, gnostic)
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feelings nothing more than feelings.. that is all you guys got..
what do you do with your guilt? the only answer has to be legally binding.. and you can't find it with out His legal book . which makes most of you outlaws.
The outlaws are the ones carrying brands.
The lack of discretion and filthy vile an innocent child is forced to witness is the devils cup. Satan and his kind imagine every evil and impose it upon the world.
A pretense of fallen angels tempting mankind to believe they come to reap.
A delusion so grand.
OK, that sounds good. There's even some biblical correctness to it. But it also sounds like something we might instruct others to do on their own, in that God loves them and will receive them to Himself.
But I'm still unclear as to how Jesus fits in with this. Is it simply His instruction that we should do this? How are His death and resurrection involved? What did we actually have to be saved from that such a work of Christ was necessary? (Sorry... I'm just trying to understand). Thanks.
It is when you think he's a jewish man with a beard. This might be a surprise to you , but it's about God our Father more than Jesus Christ, what Jesus did was make our Father known to us.. If you have seen me(remember not the man with the beard).....YOU have seen the Father.
What are we saved from ? Ourselves when Jesus shows us the Father.
OK, that sounds good. There's even some biblical correctness to it. But it also sounds like something we might instruct others to do on their own, in that God loves them and will receive them to Himself.
But I'm still unclear as to how Jesus fits in with this. Is it simply His instruction that we should do this? How are His death and resurrection involved? What did we actually have to be saved from that such a work of Christ was necessary? (Sorry... I'm just trying to understand). Thanks.
What keeps us from God is our state of mind (consciousness). No one in our entire species' history ever achieved the consciousness (Spirit) of God which is unconditionally loving and accepting of all life (Agape). For that reason, human consciousness was separated from God. Jesus had an unfair advantage from God, but He DID achieve it in His human consciousness and God was well pleased. Since His human consciousness is part and parcel of ALL human consciousness that has ever been created, His perfect consciousness connected ALL human consciousness with God forever. When He died, His human consciousness was "born again" as Spirit (Holy Spirit) and became available to ALL of us as the Comforter sent in His name to guide us to the truth God has "written in our hearts."
What keeps us from God is our state of mind (consciousness). No one in our entire species' history ever achieved the consciousness (Spirit) of God which is unconditionally loving and accepting of all life (Agape). For that reason, human consciousness was separated from God. Jesus had an unfair advantage from God, but He DID achieve it in His human consciousness and God was well pleased. Since His human consciousness is part and parcel of ALL human consciousness that has ever been created, His perfect consciousness connected ALL human consciousness with God forever. When He died, His human consciousness was "born again" as Spirit (Holy Spirit) and became available to ALL of us as the Comforter sent in His name to guide us to the truth God has "written in our hearts."
I hope you don't mind, but I'm posting the link to my favorite explanation of yours:
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But I'm still unclear as to how Jesus fits in with this. Is it simply His instruction that we should do this? How are His death and resurrection involved? What did we actually have to be saved from that such a work of Christ was necessary? (Sorry... I'm just trying to understand). Thanks.
Ah yes, the Atonement. How does it work? We are really not given a map for the how, but several illustrations of the result, some of which would be conflicting if they were to be taken as descriptions of HOW, and some of which are downright out of character such as the currently popular "Penal Substitution" theory.
You should do some background search on theories of Atonement Probably the most popular alternative is "Christus Victor." My perception (taken from Melville) is that crucifixion under the Law invalidates Law or any action as basis for judgement and opens the condition of the heart or intent what we strive for with the concern for the well-being of anyone in any situation as the aim. It is not necessarily something that would have universal appeal, but Jesus' ministry was to the Jews, who were held under Law, so this may just be another perception of the result rather than the mechanics of Atonement. The point remains that we should be conscious that we ARE in relationship with God and man and we have the means to make it real community.
Though not a "Jesus-believer", I can understand this idea. A view of God as being angry, vengeful, punishing, etc., can do nothing but keep people in fear of God, and therefore desiring to keep their distance at all costs. It's a fear that needed to be eradicated.
just read Enoch which who was before the flood. it has been the same and all men with a conscience know it. so it comes back to the question what do you do with your guilt? ... that is both legal and binding in his court? pick up the book and start reading , pray for his spirit to come and that is the only way to get all His instruction for your salvation.
anything short of it is not binding and outlaw.
just read Enoch which who was before the flood. it has been the same and all men with a conscience know it. so it comes back to the question what do you do with your guilt? ... that is both legal and binding in his court? pick up the book and start reading , pray for his spirit to come and that is the only way to get all His instruction for your salvation.
anything short of it is not binding and outlaw.
Deja vu. We've been down this path before, on this very thread and I already answered your question.
And tubal mescech cain will always take a bribe.
Simple math really. Fix the books.
you got it .
actually the Father has defined lawful and outlaws. certainly not me !
I just have tried to "study to show myself approved" by the one who created the court and understands true justice . TO the one who understands a side of " love " is not fluff nor feelings , which we all need to know Love is first and foremost a choice( free will ) , not a feeling. that is for those who think that "God's love" is about his feelings for you ..it isn't ! and the other side of Love is " to protect" and thus is also a choice not a fluffy feeling.
when we get up in the middle of the night to take care of a baby it isn't about our fluffy feelings, it is about a choice to benefit and serve another more than our own needs , and it is love.
I get a lot of flack when I present my more detailed science-based explanations so I try the KISS mode in spiritual talk more and more, Pleroo. But I appreciate your citing it. In fact, it deserves a bump.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MysticPhD
Ok kat . . . You don't like the consciousness explanation . . . let me try analogy again to music. First . . . it is necessary to understand that the complexity of life and the universe is comprised entirely of vibratory energy in manifestations way too complex for most of us to easily contemplate. For example, even just one of us is comprised of a huge complex of vibratory energy in uncountable forms and functions (cells, neurons, etc.) . . . but in reality we are ALL just energy in vibration (no "solid" anything . . . no flesh, no whatever). Our sensory system just confuses our consciousness (another vibratory energy form) by arraying these "vibrations" into forms we can see, touch, feel, hear, smell, etc. . . . as separate "things" that have consequences when we interact with them as "things." Complex and confusing enough to make my point?
This is the reason for using music as the analogy . . . it is just sound energy vibrations that our consciousness can recognize as "conposites" that we call rhythm and melody in various keys, etc. God is the whole symphony of the universe. Humans are instruments for playing universe music in the human orchestra section. We were and still are "out-of-tune" instruments . . . playing badly, wrong melodies, passages, completely off-key and discordant . . more like noise. God needed at least one human instrument to be in tune and playing properly so the rest could atttune themselves properly. However, human instruments are only born in the wombs of women . . . hence Jesus.
Jesus had to develop . . . as we all do . . . and had to attune His vibrations (instrument) perfectly with God. If you have "two tuning forks" . . . one the entire universe and the other in a human body . . . they are not on the same scale . . . so in one sense they are separate. But once they are resonating PERFECTLY they are indistinguishable . . . and the key they resonate in is identical! In the case of God that "key" is Love. Since they are vibrations indistinguishable one from one the other . . . they cannot be anything else but One.
Our human orchestra is located in a specific part of the universe where ALL human instruments are supposed to be seated as part of the Celestial orchestra once they are properly "tuned" and trained to "play" properly. Unfortunately, all human instruments must be reborn as Spirit to actually join the Celestial orchestra in the human section. Jesus achieved the perfection of love and showed us how to "tune" our instruments and "play" in tune. When He died . . . He was reborn as Spirit and was seated as part of the Celestial orchestra in the human section as the Holy Spirit where He continues to help each of us "tune" our instruments and learn to "play" in tune. However since Jesus's "playing" is indistinguishable from God's . . . they remain One.
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