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The boss has issued an ultimatum>>>>"Get off that computer!" I never argue with the boss, so Rose must leave you for now...please do not say goody.
“Trust him. And when you have done that, you are living the life of grace. No matter what happens to you in the course of that trusting - no matter how many waverings you may have, no matter how many suspicions that you have bought a poke with no pig in it, no matter how much heaviness and sadness your lapses, vices, indispositions, and bratty whining may cause you - you believe simply that Somebody Else, by his death and resurrection, has made it all right, and you just say thank you and shut up. The whole slop-closet full of mildewed performances (which is all you have to offer) is simply your death; it is Jesus who is your life. If he refused to condemn you because your works were rotten, he certainly isn't going to flunk you because your faith isn't so hot. You can fail utterly, therefore, and still live the life of grace. You can fold up spiritually, morally, or intellectually and still be safe. Because at the very worst, all you can be is dead - and for him who is the Resurrection and the Life, that just makes you his cup of tea.” - Robert Farrar Capon-
With regards to Matt. 25:46 - it's pretty self-explanatory, unless you don't like what it says. Then you have to perform verbal gymnastics as seen in the OP.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jerwade
No gymnastics are necessary if you have a correct translation, nothing about it being eternal.
And these shall go away into age-abiding correction, but the righteous into age-abiding life.
The concept of salvation being deliverance from "eternal punishment" is utterly false.
Quote:
Originally Posted by DRob4JC
If you are correct, then nothing is eternal, which includes those for have eternal life... which shoots down God's promise.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jerwade
When the perishable has been clothed with the imperishable and the mortal with immortality, then the saying that is written will come to pass: "Death has been swallowed up in victory."
Quote:
Originally Posted by DRob4JC
So let me get this straight...
Matthew 25:46 - "These will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life."
The same Greek word is used. Are you telling me these are used differently?
Quote:
Originally Posted by DRob4JC
Because you have no boundary in sacrificing language in order to meet an outcome. That's nuts.
You are basically telling Jesus that He didn't really mean what He said... He meant to say something different.
That's right out of the garden in Genesis 3... "God surely didn't say that you would die"... well - yes He did.... and they did.
So will you, which means you do not have eternal life for surely you will die. As the New Testament has ONLY one word which can truthfully be translated as ETERNAL. This is the Greek word Aidios which is used only twice: For since the creation of the world GODS invisible qualities - Hiseternal (aidios) power and divine nature have been clearly seen. But then, we have already had this discussion which most fundamentalists just ignore, as you did the post above.
No gymnastics are necessary if you have a correct translation, nothing about it being eternal.
And these shall go away into age-abiding correction, but the righteous into age-abiding life.
The concept of salvation being deliverance from "eternal punishment" is utterly false.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Harry Diogenes
Then I would stop with the gymnastics and get a correct translation.
παpακαλώ
Because you can copy and past "you're welcome" doesn't mean squat (κοντόχονδρος).
And the words endless torment (adialeipton timorion), eternal imprisonment (aidios eirgmos) or eternal punishment (aidios kalasin) do not appear anywhere in the Greek New Testament, at least not in conjunction. Neither, will you find the term aidios timorion or eternal torment.
Therefore, whoever says that there is an eternal (aidios) time set for punishment (kalasin) or torment beyond this life is sadly mistaken. It's a limited duration of aionion (αἰώνιον - a period of time; an age) kalasin (Κόλασιν - chastisement or correction) which is in view, but the day and hour that it begins and ends is unpredictable. If it were eternal, then the word Aidios would have been used. But not even Jesus used the word for eternal in conjunction with any kind of punishment or life for that matter.
Because you have come to accept that aionion means eternal (aidios) when it doesn't.
In every other instance of the use of the word it does. But I guess Jerwade in 2018 knows better than 2000 years of historical Christian teaching? Is that it?
So will you, which means you do not have eternal life for surely you will die. As the New Testament has ONLY one word which can truthfully be translated as ETERNAL. This is the Greek word Aidios which is used only twice: For since the creation of the world GODS invisible qualities - Hiseternal (aidios) power and divine nature have been clearly seen. But then, we have already had this discussion which most fundamentalists just ignore, as you did the post above.
The word aidios is never used by Jesus. You quoted Romans 1:20, and it was used as a descriptive word to describe God the Father. Note that God is the ONLY truly eternal being - from eternity past, to eternity future. He has never NOT existed. So that is the correct term.
That would not apply to us, because we have not existed eternally in the past as God has. We have a starting point. God doesn't. That's the difference in the terms.
However, Jesus used aionios to describe life eternal with God for believers, and punishment eternal for those that are destined. It is totally incorrect to interpret the same word in different ways. If Jesus wanted to use the term aidios to describe eternal life, He could have... but He didn't.
In every other instance of the use of the word it does. But I guess Jerwade in 2018 knows better than 2000 years of historical Christian teaching? Is that it?
If you want to believe otherwise, that's your choice. However, his eternal (aidios) power and divine nature are the only things which are Eternal.
If you want to believe otherwise, that's your choice. However, his eternal (aidios) power and divine nature are the only things which are Eternal.
And because God is eternal. so is his wrath.
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