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Agreed! - There are many Scriptures supporting the 'rapture,' including, but, not not limited to: 1 Thes 4:16-17, Rev. 3:10, Matt. 24:38-41, 1 Cor. 15:51-52, Dan. 12:1-2, 2 Thes. 2:7-8, John 14:1-3 ... and even Rev. 4:1 to Rev. 19 (John is told "come up here" and witnesses the entire Great Tribulation from a heavenly perspective -- During that time, the church (which is mentioned 25 times in Rev. 1-3, is not mentioned again until Christ returns.
Likewise, there are three primary notions of when the rapture might (or might not) occur:
PRE TRIB: ‘Rapture’ BEFORE the 7-year Great Tribulation, Prior to 7-SEAL Warnings
MID TRIB: ‘Rapture’ at MIDDLE of Great Tribulation (42 mos); After 7-Seals and Before the 7-Trumpets
POST TRIB: (same as NO Rapture); OR it occurs upon Christ’s returns at the End of the Great Tribulation
Some argue that the 'rapture' view came later (Nelson Darby in the 1800's), therefore, cannot be considered (since the early church fathers didn't mention it). Of course, Scripture advises that many End Time events will become much clearer in the latter days. Others declare that the specific word, 'rapture' does not appear in Scripture, however, there are a large number of accepted, modern Christian terms that do not appear in Scripture.
At the end of the day, one's belief in the 'rapture' (or not), has no bearing on one's salvation or relationship with God. A more important issue is whether the beliefs/disbeliefs of Christians are Scripture-based, and not simply derived from intuition, popular opinion, movies or internet articles.
Lol, the first sentence of Revelation says that everything written in the book must shortly come to pass, YOU have to walk by those prophesies.
You are reading a book about the 7 feasts of Jesus, only, you don't have a clue what is said and done on the 7 feasts of Jesus.
Revelation is about the temple and all the comings and goings of the temple. You read Revelation and you begin in Rosh Hashanah, you are working your way through 7 feasts where all the sacrifices and all the holy days fall on Tishri 15th.
You are reading of Passover, Unleavened bread, firstfruits, Pentecost, Rosh Hashanah, ten days to Yom Kipuur, Yom Kipuur, the Feast of Tabernacles, and Shemini Atzeret.
If a Christian doesn't know what is said and done on all these days, that Christian should NOT READ REVELATION, he should go and study the 7 feasts of Christ before he even opens the book.
Revelation is written for EVERY GENERATION, it is not a book of the last days, it is a book showing a Gentile how to symbolicaly die as a Gentile to become a Jew.
Christians are sealed and marked with the seal and stamp of Babylon in their forehead and right hand, and then they read Revelation looking for the people of Babylon, how ironic.
If it were not for Christians, the ways of Babylon and the traditions of Tammuz would have long since been forgotten, but Christians have kept the worship of the Babylonian Messiah alive for 2000 years, and while the Christians are keeping the holy days of Tammuz with his traditions and riturals, they say,'' I wonder who those Babylonian people of Revelation are?'''
''I wonder who those people are, the ones who recieve the seal of Babylon in thier forehead?''
THEY are the ones keeping the holy days, traditions, and rituals of the Babylonian Messiah, then they say,'' Wonder who those Babylonians are?''
The rapture is written about by Paul. It has nothing to do with temples, feast days or anything else. When the last Gentile is saved into the body of Christ and Jesus deems the time is right it will happen. Primary purpose is to give glorified bodies to all the saints in spirit form to be given their glorified bodies and complete the process began centuries ago. We aren't complete until we have a body, although it will be only flesh and bone, no blood. The new body will be powered eternally by the Holy Spirit, no food required although we can eat if we want just like Jesus did.
The body of Christ must be removed before the Tribulation, we have nothing in common with the Temple and being under the law. Those who are putting themselves under the law can never be saved by it. Those saved by grace are a heavenly people, in fact spiritually today we are said to be seated in heaven.
Php 3:20 But our citizenship is in heaven, and from it we await a Savior, the Lord Jesus Christ,
Php 3:21 who will transform our lowly body to be like his glorious body, by the power that enables him even to subject all things to himself.
The Jews are an earthly people....and they will shine down here and remain near and dear to the Lord after they receive the prophesied punishment of the Tribulation. The body of Christ has no part in that.
I for one am not concerned about the "rapture" (or the notion of it), and what happens to our pets. I also can't see how animals hanging around people would somehow be superior. Animals living their lives in pure nature would seem to be the most blessed, free, and natural.
In the end, it's all a crapshoot. All this fantasizing and dreaming - wondering about the rapture, what heaven will be like, etc. - won't force anything into reality or make anything happen. Better to stick with the now, the present, and what we sense around us, and leave all the rest for God (or fate/destiny/whatever).
Last edited by Thoreau424; 09-10-2019 at 11:56 AM..
When the Rapture happens, will our pets also be lifted with us to heaven? If not, I think I am going to stop being a Christian, because I do not want to leave them behind.
The Bible doesn't tell us. It's silent on the topic.
Let me ask you, though...what happens when you die? Suppose you die of a heart attack tonight? Or get hit by a bus on the way home? Who will care for your pets? Fact is, for 2000 years people been waiting for Jesus to return expectantly...but they've all died. We may hope, but there is no reason we can say for sure he'll return before you die.
O Cruiser, lol, yeah, that makes sense, God comes rewarding the lawless and pagan, and he comes punishing the lawfull saints who keep his recorded religion, yeah, that makes sense.
So glad God is coming to judge and punish his chosen people, the only people in history who continue to follow God. 2000 years of the world punishing Jews isn't near enough, lol.
You have it exactly backwards Cruiser, Rosh Hashanah and Yom Kippur are coming, and EVERYBODY who knows Rosh Hashanah and Yom Kippur know what it comes to do.
What is appointed to happen on Rosh Hashanah and Yom Kippur Cruiser?
You obviously do not know, you don't even have an opinion because you don't know the subject matter.
Jesus came for the first rain in the spring, and Jesus came fulfilling Passover, unleavened bread, firstfruits, and Pentecost, and the second coming of Messiah is his coming to fulfill Rosh Hasnanah, Yom Kippur, the feast of Tabernacles and Shemini Atzeret.
On Rosh Hashanah this year, in a few days from now, God is going to seal all his people with his seal of protection in their forehead and right arm because they keep his Sabbaths and his feasts, and upon this same day, God is going to seal your forehead and right hand for the Sabbaths and holy days you keep, and you keep Babylonian Holy days.
Rosh Hashanah and Yom Kipur come to judge the whole world in how they have treated God's people. All the Gentiles and Gentile nations are judged in how they have persscuted the only people who keep God's religion.
You on the other hand, you think God is coming to reward everyone who doesn't keep his commandments, his Sabbaths and his holy days, lol.
Sounds like something a Christian would say with replacement mentality, that God is coming to punish the only people who are loyal to him, and he comes go reward every Gentile who hates and seeks punishment for his own people.
Guess what? God has a reserved time of punishment for YOU.
Dude, there is no such thing as a rapture, you should get this in your head.
Listen, all those scriptures you are reading, they have to do with Rosh Hashanaha, the ten days to Yom Kippur, Yom Kippur, the feast of Tabernacles, and Shemini Atzeret.
What you have done is to take false preconcieved ideas about the great division, this division is to divide soul and spirit from the flesh. Every story points to this divison, and OF COURSE, Christians are not taught the worship system Jesus loved, practices and taught.
You are reading things that will be said and done on Rosh Hashanah, Yom Kippur, Sukkot, and Shemini Atzeret.
You don't connect any of your scriptures to the fact that all your scriptures are there to SHOW US what will happen on these appointed days with their VERY SPECIFIC things said and done.
For instance, you speak of Rosh Hashanah where EVERY YEAR the people of God are sealed with protection against Yom Kippur but you haven't a clue that you are speaking about your own appointed holy days.
You are looking for a rapture where Paul and others are speaking about the first day of the feast of Tabernacles where ALL THE SACRIFICES AND ALL THE HOLY DAYS WILL TAKE PLACE ON A SINGLE DAY.
You are looking at Paul QUOTING Zechariah 14 saying,'' We then, we who are left behind will then be caught up..
''WE WHO ARE LEFT ALIVE AFTER JUDGMENT COMES.''
Paul isn't showing a rapture, he is IN FACT, showing the left behind AS THE RIGHTEOUS, NOT THE WICKED.
Then we have Jesus speaking about the division of the sheep and the goat,'' YOU ARE THE SHEEP, YOU ARE THE GOAT.''
You are the sacrifice, you wil be cut in half, DIVIDED as all sacrifices, and God will walk between thenhalves..
YOU ARE the mount of Olives and when you die, you will cleave in two.
YOU ARE the wheat AND the tare.
YOU ARE the rich man AND Lazarus.
Kingdom against kingdom YOU ARE, and how will you or anyone debate this fact?
You wanna do something wrong? You want to hurt somebody and so you see your desire with your right eye, and then your right hand reaches to take it, but your left eye is watching and it slaps down the right hand, and your left eye says,'' Now you know that IS WRONG.''
There you are, AND RIGHT THERE IS WHERE YOU STAND ALONE.
kingdom against Kingdom, evil against righteousness, your evil inclination is supposed to be shut down by the spirit which is to guide you away from sin.
THERE YOU STAND BETWEEN YOUR OWN TWO MINDS, THERE YOU STAND AS A KINGDOM AGAINST A KINGDOM, AND YOU ARE THE FREAKING KING, WHATEVER YOU DECIDE IS LAW.
Jssus said,'' SOME OF YOU STANDING HERE WILL SEE THE KINGDOM OF HEAVEN.''
They did See the kingdom, THEY SAW WHAT THEY WERE.
They saw Elijah, Moses, and Jesus, and THIS is what a person is,'' The kingdom of heaven.''
A prophet
A priest
A King
The prophet sees what it sees and the priest agrees along with the king, and whatever is agreed upon, and whatever is done, it is certainly done by 3, just exactly what happens inside you everytime you make a decision.
This is the water, the blood and the spirit.
Only certain Christian denominations believe in the rapture and not even all of them.
Only certain Christian denominations believe in the rapture and not even all of them.
More and more people are learning the truth, Paul was quoting Zechariah 14 when he says,'' We who are left alive.''
Left alive after what?
The coming of the Lord is as the rain, the spring rain and the fall rain, and Jesus already came for the spring rain, and now we wait for the feast of Tabernacles, exactly what Zechariah 14 is detailing, but in detailing the feast of Tabernacles being fulfilled, Zechariah shows wide salvation and GREAT UNBELIEVABLE HOPE, UNFAILING hope because God comes to Judah, he transforms them while the whole world watches, and what is so very hopefull is the fact that all the other nations and peoples are STILL THERE..
It is then that God reaches out to all nations, and while we see Judah and Israel transformed, this transformation is ALSO offered to all the Gentile nations who would then join Israel AFTER the coming of the Lord. This is hope beyond what any Christian would tell you because Christianity is biased and confused about what is appointed to happen, and they are confused simply from ignorance and their rejection to study the 7 appointed visitation days.
What happened at the first coming of the Lord, it is going to repeat. Where it was just a small local manifistation in Jerusalem, the second coming is a global repeat of what happened in the first coming.
Instead of one man coming as a Messiah, Messiah comes to indwell a great multitude like lions amongst the people in every city, every nation.
All the scriptures of hell only pertain to the outcome of the feast of Tabernacles. All scriptures of hell refer to the outer court of Gentiles KNOWN as the outer court of darkness, and the hell, it is the comparison of salvation in the court, against the Libety and life found in the temple proper.
We are given the design of the temple and it's 3 sections so we can know what the kingdom of heaven is, and we ARE SHOWN the differences in those 3 sections of heaven in very many scriptures.
Consider the great mercy and hope that Jesus gives us when he says that you can speak and teach AGAINST HIM, and be forgiven, but not only this, Jesus takes it to the extreem and says that you can actually decide not to keep any of the commandments, AND THEN, YOU CAN EVEN TEACH OTHERS NOT TO KEEP ANY OF THE COMMANDMENTS AND STILL BE SAVED.
Jesus speaks of the least and the greatest TELLING US that we can teach against Jesus, that we can choose not to keep any of the commandments and even teach others not to keep the commandments and STILL BE SAVED.
Again, ''The works of every man will be tested by fire, and if the works of every man burn in the flames, and every man burns, THEY ARE STILL FREAKING SAVED.''
O Cruiser, lol, yeah, that makes sense, God comes rewarding the lawless and pagan, and he comes punishing the lawfull saints who keep his recorded religion, yeah, that makes sense.
So glad God is coming to judge and punish his chosen people, the only people in history who continue to follow God. 2000 years of the world punishing Jews isn't near enough, lol.
You have it exactly backwards Cruiser, Rosh Hashanah and Yom Kippur are coming, and EVERYBODY who knows Rosh Hashanah and Yom Kippur know what it comes to do.
What is appointed to happen on Rosh Hashanah and Yom Kippur Cruiser?
You obviously do not know, you don't even have an opinion because you don't know the subject matter.
Jesus came for the first rain in the spring, and Jesus came fulfilling Passover, unleavened bread, firstfruits, and Pentecost, and the second coming of Messiah is his coming to fulfill Rosh Hasnanah, Yom Kippur, the feast of Tabernacles and Shemini Atzeret.
On Rosh Hashanah this year, in a few days from now, God is going to seal all his people with his seal of protection in their forehead and right arm because they keep his Sabbaths and his feasts, and upon this same day, God is going to seal your forehead and right hand for the Sabbaths and holy days you keep, and you keep Babylonian Holy days.
Rosh Hashanah and Yom Kipur come to judge the whole world in how they have treated God's people. All the Gentiles and Gentile nations are judged in how they have persscuted the only people who keep God's religion.
You on the other hand, you think God is coming to reward everyone who doesn't keep his commandments, his Sabbaths and his holy days, lol.
Sounds like something a Christian would say with replacement mentality, that God is coming to punish the only people who are loyal to him, and he comes go reward every Gentile who hates and seeks punishment for his own people.
Guess what? God has a reserved time of punishment for YOU.
LOL.
How was Abram saved? what about the thief on the cross, how many good works did he have? I have to agree with you it looks really upside down to have a whole group TRYING to keep the law (but failing) and then Christians over here telling everybody they can be saved by simply believing the gospel of grace. Jesus changed everything after the cross.....since the Jews rejected and killed Him even though He really wanted the Jews to be priests to the gentiles, so He turned to the gentiles through Paul. I doubt what I say will sway you to accept grace, even though you should........and I don't feel like a long drawn out post.......so I will give you a link to some really gifted Christians at Doctrine. Org who can explain things better than I can.........have a great day amigo
How was Abram saved? what about the thief on the cross, how many good works did he have? I have to agree with you it looks really upside down to have a whole group TRYING to keep the law (but failing) and then Christians over here telling everybody they can be saved by simply believing the gospel of grace. Jesus changed everything after the cross.....since the Jews rejected and killed Him even though He really wanted the Jews to be priests to the gentiles, so He turned to the gentiles through Paul. I doubt what I say will sway you to accept grace, even though you should........and I don't feel like a long drawn out post.......so I will give you a link to some really gifted Christians at Doctrine. Org who can explain things better than I can.........have a great day amigo
No, Jesus did not come offering a betrothal to a Jew to become a Jew, Jesus came as a Jew adding Gentiles to the already saved nation of God's chosen people, and WHY ARE THEY CHOSEN?
Reality Cruiser, the Jews have been the ONLY people brave enough and loyal enough to practice God's religion that he DEMANDED them to keep.
Then there is you.
You can't quote the actual covenant to fit or twist yourself under the covenant of Jesus because of the fact that you are neither Israel or Judah, and the covenant is extreemly clear and obvious to whom it was written,.' NOT YOU.''
You can rationalize all day long how you think you have replaced God's people, BUT REALITY AND HISTORICAL FACT BEAR OUT THE TRUTH WITH NO DOUBTS.
The Jews alone follow God, the Jews alone follow and practice the religion of Jesus, NOT CHRISTIANS.
In what crazy world can a Christian claim that he is in the same religion as Jesus loved and practiced?
Christians are so far and away from the religion of Christ that they reject his being the Passover lamb, or ANY of the 7 missions of Jesus, Christians DON'T EVEN KNOW THE NAMES OF THEIR OWN APPOINTED VISITATION DAYS.
Christians know nothing of the temple they claim to be, and then they claim to be the bride of a Jew while cursing Jews lol, that marriage is going to work out just fine lol.
REALITY
Come back to reality Cruiser, The Jews are the ONLY people who love the commandments and ways of God, and they alone have been called out of the ways of the world, they are lawful, and have been loyal UNTO DEATH AT THE HANDS OF PEOPLE SAYING THE SAME THING YOU ARE SAYING, THEY ARE HATED AND DESPISED BECAUSE THEY ARE THE ONLY PEOPLE KEEPING THE RELIGION OF CHRIST.(Again, ''NOT YOU.'')
Then there is you, Jesus told us all about your coming, the prophets and disciples along with Jesus, they all spoke of a lawless, TORAHLESS time when believers would actually stand against everything called of God or worshipped of God as you do here and now.
While the chosen people have been persecuted for 2000 years at the hand of Christians, they were persecuted and killed very specifically for following what God demanded them to follow.
Then there is you, a lawless Gentile trying to claim the inheritance and covenant only made to Israel and Judah, and ONLY if they continued following God as they have. You are not Israel or Judah by any stretch of the imagination, you practice and are involved with Pagan Holy days, pagan traditions, and pagan rituals while cursing the Holy days of Christ, his being the Passover lamb, the Pentecost ram, the Yom Kippur goat and the Sukkot bull, and rather than honor the sacrifices of Christ, you willingly choose the worship system of Babylon over the worship system of God.
Why can't you keep the ways of God that he ordained for his son and his people in Jerusalem?
Because the Jews follow God, and you don't want to be seen keeping the ways of Jesus because the Jews do?
That has always been the case, so much anti-Semitism that the ways of God had to be outlawed by Christians as not to have anything to do with God's chosen people who keep his ways unto death, death at the hands of this mentality.
God is not coming to punish the Jews Cruiser, king David, king of the Jews is coming to conquer all nations with his covenant with Israel and Judah, again,'' NOT YOU.''
1 Kings.
Jeroboam said in his heart, “Now, the kingdom might revert to the house of David. If these people go up to offer sacrifices in the house of the LORD at Jerusalem, their hearts will return to their lord, Rehoboam king of Judah; then they will kill me and return to Rehoboam king of Judah.”…
Last edited by Hannibal Flavius; 09-10-2019 at 02:58 PM..
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