Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
LoL you could say that I'm the king of going off-topic (or hijacking threads) on CD, I was just giving you some friendly advise.
Unlike you I'm not here to convert others to my philosophy, I just enjoy talking religion & philosophy.
FYI 99% of the time people disagree with me and I’m not bothered with that at all.
you could say that I'm the king of going off-topic (or hijacking threads) on CD, I was just giving you some friendly advise.
I got a private message about your tendency to get in trouble with the Mods concerning that issue...along with some real friendly advice not to go down with that sinking ship...
I got a private message about your tendency to get in trouble with the Mods concerning that issue...along with some real friendly advice not to go down with that sinking ship...
Later kid....
Probably from people who don't get the difference between a trade and gift either.
I got a private message about your tendency to get in trouble with the Mods concerning that issue...along with some real friendly advice not to go down with that sinking ship...
Later kid....
What is ironic, Alan, is that you are more concerned with the "sinking ship" but you acted the same way to me as you are to this poster. I used smilies and you didn't comment on my age. Also I said to you that you were ignoring my comments yet pushing your own view quite heavily. You say that it is this poster's age which is why they are wrong... isn't that a personal attack like the ones you commented on in the "Do you love your enemies?" thread:
Quote:
Originally Posted by alanMolstad
Ironmaw1776spm62... getting a bit too personal with your posts there dont you think?
The tip off is when a person stops talking about the arguments of the other posters, and just starts attacking the other person.
I believe a better way to go is to just keep the thinking and the main ideas of the other person as the subject.
Say things like: "That is a silly idea"..or.."That argument has no merit"...or .."I disagree with that point of view"
That way you dont get sucked down into the mud of "Getting Personal" and risk someone reporting your post to the MODs and the hassle that can cause you.
This poster hasn't hijacked or gone off topic that I can see...
It is you that rejects any other thought than your own.
Btw... Using examples like birthday parties and hospitals to describe God's ways is wrong. There is no similarity there. I am not sure why you persist.
Back to the topic... prayer does not save us. The Love and Grace of God saves us...
Believing is not what saves us. Not only did DaltonG and freedom make the point that the thief a horrible argument toward believing saving us, Acts 26:27-28 shows that believing must not be the only part to becoming a Christian. If Agrippa believed, yet was not a Christian yet, there must be something else to add. And, by studying the new testament in it's entirety shows that there is 4 more steps outlined in the Scriptures.
5 Steps to salvation sounds like a best seller of the christian bookstore shelves and one i am pretty sure i would not give the time of day.
There is one step to Salvation and God took it - God was in Christ reconciling the world unto Himself 2 Cor 4 verse 19
Location: The Chatterdome in La La Land, CaliFUNia
39,031 posts, read 23,020,628 times
Reputation: 36027
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tricky D
Originally Posted by alanMolstad So did Jesus die for all of humanity or did he only die for those who believe in him?
The problem here is that you confuse a gift with a trade.
A gift (given freely out of love) is a gift with no strings attached.
A trade occures when you have to accept a certain condition in order to receive the gift, so it isn't really a gift at all.
Jesus died for ALL of humanity but not everyone will accept this gift unfortunately. We choose whether we want to accept Jesus gift as atonement for our sins or we can choose to stand in front of God one day without a sin covering. The only thing we have to do to receive God's gift of salvation is ACCEPT the gift. Accepting the gift is an acknowledgement of our sinful state and our need of a savior. All God asks of us is to repent (turn from) our wicked ways and accept Jesus gift of salvation. There is no strings attach and God will NOT force anyone to accept His gift. When we obey God, it is out of a loving response to that gift and not to earn a gift. There is NOTHING we can do to earn this gift of salvation.
Location: The Chatterdome in La La Land, CaliFUNia
39,031 posts, read 23,020,628 times
Reputation: 36027
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tricky D
Originally Posted by alanMolstad So do you only love people when they love you back?
In other words does God only love people who love Him?
Or do you believe that love isn't a gift?
God loves ALL mankind but will not FORCE His love on anyone who wishes to reject His love or gift of salvation. Jesus died for ALL of mankind but not everyone is going to accept that gift.
I'm going to use an illustration to clarify. Supposed if you had a monetary debt that needs to be paid. What if someone offered you a monetary gift to wipe out that debt completely? If you reject the gift, then will the gift wipe out your debt? No, because the gift needed to be received and applied towards your debt before your debt could be wiped out. The same is true with salvation. We have to accept the gift and apply the gift to our lives in order for it to wipe away our debt of sin.
Jesus died for ALL of humanity but not everyone will accept this gift unfortunately. We choose whether we want to accept Jesus gift as atonement for our sins or we can choose to stand in front of God one day without a sin covering. The only thing we have to do to receive God's gift of salvation is ACCEPT the gift. Accepting the gift is an acknowledgement of our sinful state and our need of a savior. All God asks of us is to repent (turn from) our wicked ways and accept Jesus gift of salvation. There is no strings attach and God will NOT force anyone to accept His gift. When we obey God, it is out of a loving response to that gift and not to earn a gift. There is NOTHING we can do to earn this gift of salvation.
Okay, the thing you are missing here is that God is the judge. Jesus paid the debt to the judge. It is done. You believing or not-believing the debt has been paid does not change that the debt is paid. Your believing and acceptance did not and does not, in anyway, affect the exchange between God and the mediator Jesus Christ. It is throughout the bible that Christ died once and for all but sacrifice of animals happened over and over. Sacrifice was insufficient to pay the debt in full.
The payment of another person's debt does not depend on the debtor believing and/or accepting.
If you got a fine and someone else paid it... could you pay it again? The debt doesn't exist anymore, so the payment you gave would be sent back. Regardless of whether you accept the payment of the debt, the transaction only involves the payer and the payee, not the debt holder.
We have to accept the gift and apply the gift to our lives in order for it to wipe away our debt of sin.
Quote:
I'm going to use an illustration to clarify. Supposed if you had a monetary debt that needs to be paid. What if someone offered you a monetary gift to wipe out that debt completely? If you reject the gift, then will the gift wipe out your debt? No, because the gift needed to be received and applied towards your debt before your debt could be wiped out. The same is true with salvation. We have to accept the gift and apply the gift to our lives in order for it to wipe away our debt of sin.
The problem here is that you assume that my debt is so great that I couldn't pay it off on my own.
What if my debt was small enough that I could pay myself?
I mean I'm already found guilty of a crime I didn't even commit; Adam and Eve committed the 'original' sin and I can safely say that I wasn't even around when that happened.
Location: The Chatterdome in La La Land, CaliFUNia
39,031 posts, read 23,020,628 times
Reputation: 36027
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tricky D
Originally Posted by Chatteress The problem here is that you assume that my debt is so great that I couldn't pay it off on my own.
What if my debt was small enough that I could pay myself?
I mean I'm already found guilty of a crime I didn't even commit; Adam and Eve committed the 'original' sin and I can safely say that I wasn't even around when that happened.
Are you totally without sin? The Bible tells us that the wages of sin is death so even ONE sin can condemn you. Jesus offers us a way but we have to accept that gift and apply that gift towards our debt of sin. None of us is without sin and the penalty is too much for any of us to pay on our own. This is why Jesus died on the cross to offer each and everyone of us reconcillation with the Father.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
LoL you could say that I'm the king of going off-topic (or hijacking threads) on CD, I was just giving you some friendly advise.
(just for you)
So did Jesus die for all of humanity or did he only die for those who believe in him?
The problem here is that you confuse a gift with a trade.
So do you only love people when they love you back?
