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Eusebius has quite the wit . . . but all the conflict and confusion would be moot if everyone realized that the ENTIRE UNIVERSE is about BECOMING. Nothing starts out as it will end up. Jesus was human with an advantage . . . but as human He had to BECOME Christ and ONE with God. The seed metaphor is not trivial.
Eusebius has quite the wit . . . but all the conflict and confusion would be moot if everyone realized that the ENTIRE UNIVERSE is about BECOMING. Nothing starts out as it will end up. Jesus was human with an advantage . . . but as human He had to BECOME Christ and ONE with God. The seed metaphor is not trivial.
I have to hand it to Eusebius.....that is a GREAT line and one I will definitely remember.
I absolutely agree and based on what I've seen posted on this forum....there are many who just don't have a clue what it is they are supposed to be doing.
Eusebius has quite the wit . . . but all the conflict and confusion would be moot if everyone realized that the ENTIRE UNIVERSE is about BECOMING. Nothing starts out as it will end up. Jesus was human with an advantage . . . but as human He had to BECOME Christ and ONE with God. The seed metaphor is not trivial.
It is interesting that Jesus told His disciples that He is not the Father (He told them His and their Father art in heaven) and Jesus told His disciples He is not their God but that He was going to where His God and their God is (above).
That emboldened part of your statement is not exactly what He had said.
Quote:
I will take Jesus' words over 2000 years of retarded doctrines of Christendumb.
But you are not taking all of His words to discern this important matter of faith for He said this:
John 8: 19Then said they unto him, Where is thy Father? Jesus answered, Ye neither know me, nor my Father: if ye had known me, ye should have known my Father also.20These words spake Jesus in the treasury, as he taught in the temple: and no man laid hands on him; for his hour was not yet come.....
That was written to prove He had spoken words that would have made them laid hands on Him.
23And he said unto them, Ye are from beneath; I am from above: ye are of this world; I am not of this world. 24I said therefore unto you, that ye shall die in your sins: for if ye believe not thatI am he, ye shall die in your sins.25Then said they unto him, Who art thou? And Jesus saith unto them, Even the same that I said unto you from the beginning.....
57Then said the Jews unto him, Thou art not yet fifty years old, and hast thou seen Abraham? 58Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I am.59Then took they up stones to cast at him: but Jesus hid himself, and went out of the temple, going through the midst of them, and so passed by.
Everybody that opposes that Jesus is God are ignoring the full implication of why He was crucified.
Luke 2:10And the angel said unto them, Fear not: for, behold, I bring you good tidings of great joy, which shall be to all people. 11For unto you is born this day in the city of David a Saviour, which is Christ the Lord. 12And this shall be a sign unto you; Ye shall find the babe wrapped in swaddling clothes, lying in a manger. 13And suddenly there was with the angel a multitude of the heavenly host praising God, and saying,14Glory to God in the highest, and on earth peace, good will toward men.
By proper grammar, the angels were praising not only God in the highest but God on earth.
The angels declared the Christ being born and so implying that Jesus the man did not become the Christ until His water baptism is bunk.
So what about that prophecy?
Isaiah 9:6For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be calledWonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlastingFather, The Prince of Peace.
Confusion?
Genesis 1: 26And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth. 27So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them.
The same hand in creation by the singular God and yet when God spoke for the act of creation, it was in the plural.
The same hand in creation is the same hand that saves.
John 10: 28And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand. 29My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand. 30I and my Father are one.
1Samuel 2:2There is none holy as the LORD: for there is none beside thee: neither is there any rock like our God.
1 Corinthians 10: 4And did all drink the same spiritual drink: for they drank of that spiritual Rock that followed them: and that Rock was Christ.
Isaiah 45:6That they may know from the rising of the sun, and from the west, that there is none besideme.I am the LORD, and there is none else.
Isaiah 45:21Tell ye, and bring them near; yea, let them take counsel together: who hath declared this from ancient time? who hath told it from that time? have not I the LORD? and there is no God else beside me; a just God and a Saviour; there isnone besideme.
And yet Jesus is at the right hand of God the Father as One God as Jesus Christ is the Saviour and thus God for only God can save.
Acts 13:23Of this man's seed hath God according to his promise raised unto Israel a Saviour, Jesus:
1 Timothy 1:1Paul, an apostle of Jesus Christ by the commandment of GodourSaviour, and Lord Jesus Christ, which is our hope;
If you are reading the verse with your beliefs still as seeing Jesus seperated from God the Saviour...
2 Timothy 2: 3For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour;
Titus 1:4To Titus, mine own son after the common faith: Grace, mercy, and peace, from Godthe Father and the Lord Jesus Christ ourSaviour.
Yes, Jesus prayed to the Father but so has God spoken in regards to the acts of creation in the plural. This is how Jesus is as God the Saviour as the same One God in the singular in the act of creation is the same God that saves and that is why there is not other God besides God or no one else because Jesus is God as the Father and Jesus are One God.
May God cause the increase for He is far capable of giving wisdom to those that seek the truth in His words.
That emboldened part of your statement is not exactly what He had said.
But you are not taking all of His words to discern this important matter of faith for He said this:
John 8: 19Then said they unto him, Where is thy Father? Jesus answered, Ye neither know me, nor my Father: if ye had known me, ye should have known my Father also.20These words spake Jesus in the treasury, as he taught in the temple: and no man laid hands on him; for his hour was not yet come.....
That was written to prove He had spoken words that would have made them laid hands on Him.
23And he said unto them, Ye are from beneath; I am from above: ye are of this world; I am not of this world. 24I said therefore unto you, that ye shall die in your sins: for if ye believe not thatI am he, ye shall die in your sins.25Then said they unto him, Who art thou? And Jesus saith unto them, Even the same that I said unto you from the beginning.....
57Then said the Jews unto him, Thou art not yet fifty years old, and hast thou seen Abraham? 58Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I am.59Then took they up stones to cast at him: but Jesus hid himself, and went out of the temple, going through the midst of them, and so passed by.
Everybody that opposes that Jesus is God are ignoring the full implication of why He was crucified.
Luke 2:10And the angel said unto them, Fear not: for, behold, I bring you good tidings of great joy, which shall be to all people. 11For unto you is born this day in the city of David a Saviour, which is Christ the Lord. 12And this shall be a sign unto you; Ye shall find the babe wrapped in swaddling clothes, lying in a manger. 13And suddenly there was with the angel a multitude of the heavenly host praising God, and saying,14Glory to God in the highest, and on earth peace, good will toward men.
By proper grammar, the angels were praising not only God in the highest but God on earth.
The angels declared the Christ being born and so implying that Jesus the man did not become the Christ until His water baptism is bunk.
So what about that prophecy?
Isaiah 9:6For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be calledWonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlastingFather, The Prince of Peace.
Confusion?
Genesis 1: 26And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth. 27So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them.
The same hand in creation by the singular God and yet when God spoke for the act of creation, it was in the plural.
The same hand in creation is the same hand that saves.
John 10: 28And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand. 29My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand. 30I and my Father are one.
1Samuel 2:2There is none holy as the LORD: for there is none beside thee: neither is there any rock like our God.
1 Corinthians 10: 4And did all drink the same spiritual drink: for they drank of that spiritual Rock that followed them: and that Rock was Christ.
Isaiah 45:6That they may know from the rising of the sun, and from the west, that there is none besideme.I am the LORD, and there is none else.
Isaiah 45:21Tell ye, and bring them near; yea, let them take counsel together: who hath declared this from ancient time? who hath told it from that time? have not I the LORD? and there is no God else beside me; a just God and a Saviour; there isnone besideme.
And yet Jesus is at the right hand of God the Father as One God as Jesus Christ is the Saviour and thus God for only God can save.
Acts 13:23Of this man's seed hath God according to his promise raised unto Israel a Saviour, Jesus:
1 Timothy 1:1Paul, an apostle of Jesus Christ by the commandment of GodourSaviour, and Lord Jesus Christ, which is our hope;
If you are reading the verse with your beliefs still as seeing Jesus seperated from God the Saviour...
2 Timothy 2: 3For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour;
Titus 1:4To Titus, mine own son after the common faith: Grace, mercy, and peace, from Godthe Father and the Lord Jesus Christ ourSaviour.
Yes, Jesus prayed to the Father but so has God spoken in regards to the acts of creation in the plural. This is how Jesus is as God the Saviour as the same One God in the singular in the act of creation is the same God that saves and that is why there is not other God besides God or no one else because Jesus is God as the Father and Jesus are One God.
May God cause the increase for He is far capable of giving wisdom to those that seek the truth in His words.
Where does the Bible teach us that God would die for our sins? God is immortal and cannot die (1 Tim 1:17, Lk 20:36)....so what sacrifice is made if it is God Himself on the cross?
God, who loves perfectly, had to endure watching the agonies of His Son, the most worthy object of his love, suffer at the hands of men and be brutally crucified on a cross. Surely there is no question of the degree to which God suffered. God atoned for our sins by providing a sacrifice, His Son, not by being one.
Where does the Bible teach us that God would die for our sins? God is immortal and cannot die (1 Tim 1:17, Lk 20:36)....so what sacrifice is made if it is God Himself on the cross?
God, who loves perfectly, had to endure watching the agonies of His Son, the most worthy object of his love, suffer at the hands of men and be brutally crucified on a cross. Surely there is no question of the degree to which God suffered. God atoned for our sins by providing a sacrifice, His Son, not by being one.
That is it in a nutshell.
God atoned for our sins. God did it as only God can.
It is interesting that Jesus told His disciples that He is not the Father (He told them His and their Father art in heaven) and Jesus told His disciples He is not their God but that He was going to where His God and their God is (above).
I will take Jesus' words over 2000 years of retarded doctrines of Christendumb.
So, to be a real Christian you have to be Christ-like and believe like Christ that God is Jesus' God and that Jesus is not the disciples' God.
Joh 20:17 Jesus is saying to her, . . . "go to My brethren, and say to them that I said, 'Lo! I am ascending to My Father and your Father, and My God and your God.'"
Jesus said that, not in His humanity but as the resurrected Son of God in power.
The disciples did believe that Christ was God ...
Jhn 20:26-29
And after eight days again his disciples were within, and Thomas with them: then came Jesus, the doors being shut, and stood in the midst, and said, Peace be unto you. Then saith he to Thomas, Reach hither thy finger, and behold my hands; and reach hither thy hand, and thrust it into my side: and be not faithless, but believing. And Thomas answered and said unto him, My LORD and my God. Jesus saith unto him, Thomas, because thou hast seen me, thou hast believed: blessed are they that have not seen, and yet have believed.
Jesus didn't deny that he was Thomas God, and he did not correct him. You would think that if Jesus was not God he would have said something at that time.
God provided the sacrifice for our atonement....God was not the sacrifice.
Saying it doesn't make it so.
Psalm 49:7 No mancan redeem the life of another or give to God a ransom for him-
If Christ was merely a human being(a natural born man), and not the only begotten son of God immaculately conceived of the holy spirit and in fact the incarnation of deity, God become a man, then his death is not able to ransom anyone from sin and death. It seems to me believing this way really is tantamount to denying the lord who bought you(ransomed you from sin and death) ...
God provided the sacrifice for our atonement....God was not the sacrifice.
Saying it doesn't make it so.
Amen ChristyGrl!
"God sent His Son into the world to save sinners." It does not say "God sent Himself."
God Himself gave Jesus as His (God's) approach present to bring us to Himself.
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