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Old 02-21-2010, 04:38 PM
 
370 posts, read 378,925 times
Reputation: 34

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Obviously if you don't believe this, then this thread is not for you, but for those that do:

What happened that led you to discover this truth?
and
What happened afterward when you tried to tell people?

For me, I was just examining small-time, unimportant doctrines when I stumbled across a SDA site. I don't agree with them about anything now, but they convinced me that there wasn't a hell, and that the wicked would be destroyed. Then I had to look into various passages that "supported" hell. One of these was the Lazarus and the rich man parable. After that I found L Ray Smith's article explaining the parable, and then stumbled on more of his material. That's how I found out anyhow.

After that, when I tried sharing with several of my friends, I was called in and told to keep quiet many times. I'm even forbidden from talking to certain people as they are "weak in the faith" and I'd lead them astray.
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Old 02-21-2010, 05:06 PM
 
8,989 posts, read 12,456,235 times
Reputation: 746
Quote:
Originally Posted by Flaminghedge View Post
After that, when I tried sharing with several of my friends, I was called in and told to keep quiet many times. I'm even forbidden from talking to certain people as they are "weak in the faith" and I'd lead them astray.
It is one of the oldest heresies. Anytime people say, put away orthodox/ traditional Christianity or you have been brainwashed by orthodox/ traditional Christianity beware!
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Old 02-21-2010, 05:14 PM
 
370 posts, read 378,925 times
Reputation: 34
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fundamentalist View Post
It is one of the oldest heresies. Anytime people say, put away orthodox/ traditional Christianity or you have been brainwashed by orthodox/ traditional Christianity beware!
Hey fundy, I'd just like to point out that your status doesn't make much sense since all heretical means is 'unorthodox'. So I don't really mind if you call my beliefs heretical either as I agree with you completely - they are unorthodox.
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Old 02-21-2010, 05:20 PM
 
Location: Seattle, Washington
8,435 posts, read 8,394,235 times
Reputation: 1690
Quote:
Originally Posted by Flaminghedge View Post
Obviously if you don't believe this, then this thread is not for you, but for those that do:

What happened that led you to discover this truth?
and
What happened afterward when you tried to tell people?

For me, I was just examining small-time, unimportant doctrines when I stumbled across a SDA site. I don't agree with them about anything now, but they convinced me that there wasn't a hell, and that the wicked would be destroyed. Then I had to look into various passages that "supported" hell. One of these was the Lazarus and the rich man parable. After that I found L Ray Smith's article explaining the parable, and then stumbled on more of his material. That's how I found out anyhow.

After that, when I tried sharing with several of my friends, I was called in and told to keep quiet many times. I'm even forbidden from talking to certain people as they are "weak in the faith" and I'd lead them astray.
For me the same type of thing.. I was studying preterism although I didn't have a name for it then, and I began to see hell/heaven more clearly.. then the more I thought about it the more it became clear that God had not changed the plan from the beginning and that he wanted all to come to him.. Once that got through my thick skull all I had to do was imagine an all-powerful God wondering if he should save all or just a few. I studied to prove it was just a few and found that it was all.. go figure.

Anyway, I tried to tell my mother that there is no hell.. she said I was bound for hell if I didn't change my ways. But since I was not a member of a church group, I really haven't gone too deep with others except here of course...

The reason I know it is right is because of the change in ME since that time. I have become a better person and that is what "sealed the deal" so to speak.
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Old 02-21-2010, 05:36 PM
 
3,580 posts, read 455,932 times
Reputation: 385
I came across universal restoration by wanting to understand what the scriptures were saying ... I had a desire to know the truth and did not know what christian denomination to attend to get the truth so I looked online for discussions on all sorts of doctrine .... and heeded advice that I was given about always checking everything against scripture .....
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Old 02-21-2010, 05:37 PM
 
370 posts, read 378,925 times
Reputation: 34
Quote:
Originally Posted by katjonjj View Post
The reason I know it is right is because of the change in ME since that time. I have become a better person and that is what "sealed the deal" so to speak.
Yeah, the same thing happened to me.

Also, there was this one section of a paper written by Ray that was just so blunt and profound it changed my mind very quickly:

THE GOSPEL OF CHRISTENDOM

The "Gospel" means "Good News." Imagine taking your gospel to some
back village in China and telling them the following:

"Greetings brothers! We are here with truly good news. You have always
been taught that your family members are with your ancient ancestors.
Well that is true, however, they are not happy. No, they are actually
in great pain and suffering. They are, in fact, suffering by having
their flesh burned with fire. They suffer every second. They have no
rest, no peace, no hope, and no food or water. The pain is so great
that it would kill them, except that they are already dead. We realize
how being dead and alive at the same time is a little difficult to
explain. It requires a Doctor of Divinity degree to fully comprehend.

Anyway, the god that we represent and worship, is the very god who is
torturing your beloved family members and ancestors. This is the same
god that is going to torture most of the human race with fire. Our god
likes burning helpless women and little children with fire. Of course,
there is no purpose or redeeming value to it, itís just great fun.

When we get to Heaven, we will be able to watch their suffering as
long as we want. I suspect it will be the number spectator sport this
side of Heaven. Now, watching little heathen babies not yet weaned off
their motherís milk, popping like burned bacon strips in a white hot
skillet, might not seem like fun at first, but if god enjoys it, I
guess we can sear our consciences until we too enjoy it.

We are here to tell you about this god of Christendom. Our god loves
you, as long as you love him back before you die. You see, thatís the
down side of god. No one knows why, but if you should die before you
love him, his love for you turns to hatred. Therefore, it is paramount
that you should worship this god of Christendom or he will burn you
with fire for all eternity."

Or maybe you would save this portion of the Good News until you have
indoctrinated them a little further.

The second part of this is at this link:

L. Ray Smith - James Kennedy Letter

Type in
THE JUSTICE AND FAIRNESS OF HELL
on the find bar to get to it quickly.
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Old 02-21-2010, 05:41 PM
 
370 posts, read 378,925 times
Reputation: 34
Quote:
Originally Posted by meerkat2 View Post
I came across universal restoration by wanting to understand what the scriptures were saying ... I had a desire to know the truth and did not know what christian denomination to attend to get the truth so I looked online for discussions on all sorts of doctrine .... and heeded advice that I was given about always checking everything against scripture .....
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Old 02-21-2010, 05:44 PM
 
Location: Seattle, Washington
8,435 posts, read 8,394,235 times
Reputation: 1690
Quote:
Originally Posted by Flaminghedge View Post
Yeah, the same thing happened to me.

Also, there was this one section of a paper written by Ray that was just so blunt and profound it changed my mind very quickly:

THE GOSPEL OF CHRISTENDOM

The "Gospel" means "Good News." Imagine taking your gospel to some
back village in China and telling them the following:

"Greetings brothers! We are here with truly good news. You have always
been taught that your family members are with your ancient ancestors.
Well that is true, however, they are not happy. No, they are actually
in great pain and suffering. They are, in fact, suffering by having
their flesh burned with fire. They suffer every second. They have no
rest, no peace, no hope, and no food or water. The pain is so great
that it would kill them, except that they are already dead. We realize
how being dead and alive at the same time is a little difficult to
explain. It requires a Doctor of Divinity degree to fully comprehend.

Anyway, the god that we represent and worship, is the very god who is
torturing your beloved family members and ancestors. This is the same
god that is going to torture most of the human race with fire. Our god
likes burning helpless women and little children with fire. Of course,
there is no purpose or redeeming value to it, itís just great fun.

When we get to Heaven, we will be able to watch their suffering as
long as we want. I suspect it will be the number spectator sport this
side of Heaven. Now, watching little heathen babies not yet weaned off
their motherís milk, popping like burned bacon strips in a white hot
skillet, might not seem like fun at first, but if god enjoys it, I
guess we can sear our consciences until we too enjoy it.

We are here to tell you about this god of Christendom. Our god loves
you, as long as you love him back before you die. You see, thatís the
down side of god. No one knows why, but if you should die before you
love him, his love for you turns to hatred. Therefore, it is paramount
that you should worship this god of Christendom or he will burn you
with fire for all eternity."

Or maybe you would save this portion of the Good News until you have
indoctrinated them a little further.

The second part of this is at this link:

L. Ray Smith - James Kennedy Letter

Type in
THE JUSTICE AND FAIRNESS OF HELL
on the find bar to get to it quickly.
That's horrible.. and profound
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Old 02-21-2010, 09:36 PM
 
Location: Texas
4,346 posts, read 5,571,047 times
Reputation: 843
It was easy. I knew that the one who treated me to such perfect love (even though I'd never done one thing to deserve it) was no respecter of persons.


Of course - the scriptures are full of UR as well, at least to those with eyes to see.

Last edited by firstborn888; 02-21-2010 at 10:34 PM..
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Old 02-21-2010, 10:00 PM
 
370 posts, read 378,925 times
Reputation: 34
Quote:
Originally Posted by firstborn888 View Post
It was easy. I knew that the one who treated me to such perfect love even though I'd never done one thing to deserve it was no respecter of persons.


Of course - the scriptures is full of UR as well, at least to those with eyes to see.
Did you originally believe in ET?
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